Occupy Sheffield Cathedral

[E-Man Groovin 27]

If they do have a credible set of proposals then brilliant, that's all i've been asking for from day one. If they had sensible proposals that would benefit the British working people I would be 100% behind them.

 

However they don't, they have tents that block churches. And BO.

 

Come up with concrete proposals or bugger off.

 

Why are "credible proposals" so important to you? Perhaps the protesters are simply surfing the zeitgeist; giving voice to the growing sense of discomfort regarding global economics. They're a broad church, they may not have a concrete end except 'change' regarding these issues. I'm with them on that. Your antipathy to them may be because you simply wish for a continuation of the status quo; but let me help you here. In case you haven't noticed it in your years on this planet, to change is human; otherwise we'd still be working with stone, or bronze. Or iron.

[ab6262 202]

Originally Posted by Nicoracle

I have been with Occupy Sheffield since we set up. We have had loads of support from so many people and organisations. To name a few Sheffield Green Party, PCS Union Sheffield, Rotherham Against The Cuts, Quaker Church, Street Pastors, The Archer Project, Roney Robinson (BBC Radio Sheff), and the list goes on and on. Also Nick Clegg said he supported us in an interview on BBC Radio Sheffield the other morning.

 

Occupy is about raising awareness and judging by the number of pages in this thread and the local media coverage, we are doing just that.

 

We are the 99%

 

 

QUOTE=dabuckle;8247933] i love it when a plan comes together!

 

 

ah yes the plan coming together:suspect: support from who?? oh yes the ususal suspects:loopy:

[Womerry2 10]

Since you're comfortably in the top 10%, try putting yourself in the flip-flops of the 90%.

 

I, too, am irritated beyond measure by the "99 %" claim. Think about it.

 

There are many good points in the Occupy manifesto, but "we are the 99 %" is so manifestly ill-considered that it detracts from their value.

 

Look at your wish list - perfectly reasonable by the standards of most users of this Forum, but how many of the users of the Archer Project, for example, would have the level of peace of mind that would make them think of adding a sofa and a book case for a library to the requirements of a protest camp? You are clearly not THE 99 %. There is a world of difference between the living standards of all those IN the 99 %, and the gap between the "top" 10% and the top 1% is considerably less wide than that between the top 10% and the bottom 10%. I would expect a movement like Occupy to be very aware of this - it is, after all, the most blatant example of what is wrong with the way we have done things up to now.

[Squiggs 11]

I can see issues with the "99%" and it wouldn't necessarily be a slogan that I would come up with

 

However I can also see that it is, to some extent, an attempt at "inclusion" - an umbrella slogan meaning that it is open to the homeless and disenfranchised, open to the unemployed, open to workers from the part-time minimum-waged to the middle classes where, on-site, no matter whether you own nothing but the clothes on your back or whether you are a homeowner, your input is equally valid and none are "more equal than others"

 

But "we are not the 1%" doesn't trip off the tongue so well

[dutch 68]

Too right Darth!

 

As Johann Wolfgang von Goethe said "None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free".

 

Spot on!

 

Those who think they have freedom in this society are hopelessly lost but when you tell them it is not appreciated.

[ampersand 10]

Gosh

 

23 pages and 461 posts (so far) (or it was when I started this post) on an insignificant protest that won't make any difference - if you believe about half of what you read on here

 

If it is so insignificant and meaningless why has it got so many of you worked up about it?

 

They aren't hurting you or affecting your life

 

The point of protests like this one isn't to "target" the capitalists or bankers - it is to raise the public awareness of the issues and to let those in power know that some people do care in the hope that those who have the power will then have the encouragement to change things - that is why they choose places where they will be most visible

 

To those who say - why not Fargate (or wherever) - the obvious answer is - why? - why pick somewhere you're going to be moved on from almost immediately

 

To those who say - but without any clear idea of what they stand for I can't support them - fine - if you need a clearer idea you probably wouldn't support them anyway

 

The whole point of a "free" country is that people are free to protest - you're free to object, but they're free to do it

 

To those who continue to be worked up about it - just ignore them and go on with your lives, your opinions won't change theirs just as theirs won't change yours - just accept that some people who aren't happy with the status quo are prepared to do something about it - you may consider it pointless and insignificant - but those words also describe your opinion

 

As Joseph Heller wrote, "Someone had to do something. Every victim was a culprit, every culprit a victim, and somebody had to stand up sometime to try to break the lousy chain of inherited habit that was imperiling them all"

Edited November 8, 2011 by ampersand
dodgy grammar

[woodmally 10]

Beautifully put Anna.

 

Beautifully put!!! Its ridiculous. I'm sure Anna has a bank account with a leading high street bank. Like many of these squatters in London spend time having coffee's in Starbucks.

 

They have nothing constructive to say or put forward apart from blame the bankers.

 

They never blame the stupid people (of which I was one of them and accepting its my fault) for borrowing too much.

 

We all borrowed when it was the good times. Yet when its bad we all blame the hand that fed us.

 

I am in debt and working to get out of it. I suggest others do the same rather than blaming someone else for their own shortcomings.

[molly44 10]

Beautifully put!!! Its ridiculous. I'm sure Anna has a bank account with a leading high street bank. Like many of these squatters in London spend time having coffee's in Starbucks.

 

They have nothing constructive to say or put forward apart from blame the bankers.

 

They never blame the stupid people (of which I was one of them and accepting its my fault) for borrowing too much.

 

We all borrowed when it was the good times. Yet when its bad we all blame the hand that fed us.

 

I am in debt and working to get out of it. I suggest others do the same rather than blaming someone else for their own shortcomings.

 

wouldn't you feel better if the government did the Greek solution and wrote maybe 60- 70 percent of your debt off!. so instead of you paying over the odds for your debt, the bankers and the hedge fund managers, takes the hit for you. after all its only their the profit margin for the interest on your loan that they will lose. wouldnt that be better?

[Paul2412 10]

Are they occupying today what with the on/off drizzle?

[Tony 10]

"we are not the 1%" doesn't trip off the tongue so well

 

Indeed. This is why I find the "99%" thing so disingenuous and nauseating. It's a hollow, meaningless sound bite that is unbelievably ill-considered. It says nothing more than that they are the ultra privileged minority who don't know that they are born.

 

The example of the Spanish Civil War are long gone. Protesting by clicking the Facebook LIKE button is so much easier than staring down the barrel of a gun.

 

The real truth is that the protesters may as well be the 1% as far as the overwhelming majority of people on the planet are concerned.

 

This 99% thing does them no favours when the protesters real world comparisons are the trivia like the type and size of house, car and holidays that they have compared to Bill Gates - not whether they are likely to die of malaria, cholera, or a beating from the secret police before they reach 30.

Edited November 8, 2011 by Tony

[harvey19 541]

Most criticism seems to be against the government or the bankers.

The government is made up of people we elected.

The majority of people still vote along party lines, at the last election many who supported the LibDems still voted Labour or Conservative as they imagined a vote any other way was wasted.

The bankers are people who have risen to the top of their profession and so hopefully know what they are doing in the best interests of the country.

The question I pose is ...Are there any in government or banking who are in sympathy with the protestors ?

[green 10]

Indeed. This is why I find the "99%" thing so disingenuous and nauseating. It's a hollow, meaningless sound bite that is unbelievably ill-considered. It says nothing more than that they are the ultra privileged minority who don't know that they are born.

 

The example of the Spanish Civil War are long gone. Protesting by clicking the Facebook LIKE button is so much easier than staring down the barrel of a gun.

 

The real truth is that the protesters may as well be the 1% as far as the overwhelming majority of people on the planet are concerned.

 

This 99% thing does them no favours when the protesters real world comparisons are the trivia like the type and size of house, car and holidays that they have compared to Bill Gates - not whether they are likely to die of malaria, cholera, or a beating from the secret police before they reach 30.

 

If they were called something else, would this make any difference to your feelings towards the protesters objectives Tony?