Shamima Begum

[neworderishere 0]

29 minutes ago, Halibut said:

You're clearly grossly overestimating the degree of cost incurred - and why the assumption that she'd be on benefits the rest of her life?

For all those of you who are determined to see her as evil, here's a different perspective. All I'd ask is that you actually read it before deciding it's a load of rubbish - https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/feb/14/shamima-begum-grooming-islamic-state-pregnant-uk

oh its in the Guardian it must be correct then? no slanting of the story? you are the one that is wrong if she comes back here , she and all of her family will be under police protection and will be on welfare for the rest of their sorry lives. not over estimating but it would run into millions.

[Halibut 12]

3 minutes ago, neworderishere said:

oh its in the Guardian it must be correct then? no slanting of the story? you are the one that is wrong if she comes back here , she and all of her family will be under police protection and will be on welfare for the rest of their sorry lives. not over estimating but it would run into millions.

Why?......................

[neworderishere 0]

1 minute ago, Halibut said:

Why?......................

you need to ask why? there a very many people who would like to see her come to some harm and that will go by association to her family  as well simply because she is what she is and has fled back from ISIS, the police and government will have a duty to protect her , nobody would employ her........or would you like her given a new identity???

[tinfoilhat 11]

10 minutes ago, hobinfoot said:

No one made her go and live in this murderous groups so called Caliphate. She shows no remorse in fact the complete opposite. I don't believe she was some naive little girl. Before she left hours of ISIS propaganda were watched by her. There is no place for her and kind in civilised society. She chose to live in hell let her live in it.

There was an awful lot of SS soldiers who went on to lead perfectly normal lives post 1945, who has quite happily signed up  before that. Would you have killed all them?

 

I'm not defending this girl, she sounds a horrible piece of work, and from a legal standpoint we are probably stuck with her. I wouldn't try and bring her back here either - we aren't obligated to do so and nor should we. But stick her head in a noose the second she arrives at Heathrow? I'm not sure. All sounds a bit ISIS to me.

[El Cid 229]

53 minutes ago, Shunter said:

Assuming that she was naive and led astray, does her current outlook make you think she's ashamed of what she did? Her persona in the media says otherwise.

Others that have been led astray and returned are now helping others that have strayed, this girl may well do the same.

Better a person that has gone through that ordeal than people without experience.

[Top Cats Hat 10]

1 hour ago, Shunter said:

Assuming that she was naive and led astray, does her current outlook make you think she's ashamed of what she did? Her persona in the media says otherwise.

How do you know what her current outlook is? 🙄

[sheffbag 232]

1 hour ago, Halibut said:

If you consider the possibility that she was a naive schoolgirl led astray by those with bad intent you might view her plight differently. But knowing you, probably not.

Using your usual technique of asking for evidence whenever you want to give a alternate view, enlighten us  on how she was naive, especially when she seems quite proud of the fact that she recruited the other 2 girls and doesn't regret anything that she has done while there

[neworderishere 0]

1 minute ago, Halibut said:

You can easily find plenty of accounts of people who have left criminal lifestyles and gone on to lead good lives, plenty of murderers who've done likewise. It's small minded to assume that this young woman can never change or move on.

Remember, as far we know this woman hasn't killed anyone.

then you must be one of the most naive people i have ever been in contact with, i may or may not have led a criminal lifestyle in the past but i dont want to destroy the way of life in the west as she does, i am sure murderers that have gone straight also dont want to destroy our way of life , they dont want to shackle women etc etc . this one supports IS that is enough guilty by association.

[Guest makapaka]

1 hour ago, Halibut said:

If you consider the possibility that she was a naive schoolgirl led astray by those with bad intent you might view her plight differently. But knowing you, probably not.

I have to say - yesterday I posted she shouldn't be allowed to return.

When I read into it more I learned that she was 15 when she was effectively groomed and became a child bride.

 

So this girl is a victim - and if we heard a local sheffield 15 year old girl had been groomed and taken to london to work for a criminal gang I believe their might be a different reaction on here.

 

It's complicated and i'm not sure I fully stand behind my first assumption now to be honest.

Edited February 15, 2019 by makapaka

[Top Cats Hat 10]

25 minutes ago, sheffbag said:

 and doesn't regret anything that she has done while there

And you know that, how?

[the_bloke 17]

She has to be allowed in the country; she's a British citizen and international law says you can't make someone stateless.

 

However some parts of society will see her as a hero, and that's the worry. 

 

I agree that she should be investigated and charged and punished accordingly with the grooming taken in mitigation. From then on she should be given a new identity with strict conditions attached to prevent her being used as an icon for extremists, or even worse to be involved with extremists herself. The last thing that should happen is to see her plastered all over the television giving anti Western rants like Choudary and Hook were.

[Halibut 12]

15 minutes ago, makapaka said:

I have to say - yesterday I posted she shouldn't be allowed to return.

When I read into it more I learned that she was 15 when she was effectively groomed and became a child bride.

 

So this girl is a victim - and if we heard a local sheffield 15 year old girl had been groomed and taken to london to work for a criminal gang I believe their might be a different reaction on here.

 

It's complicated and i'm not sure I fully stand behind my first assumption now to be honest.

Good on you for having had a rethink - and being ballsy enough to admit it. I think there are plenty who'd do well to follow your example. The sentence I've emboldened makes a very good point.

30 minutes ago, neworderishere said:

then you must be one of the most naive people i have ever been in contact with, i may or may not have led a criminal lifestyle in the past but i dont want to destroy the way of life in the west as she does, i am sure murderers that have gone straight also dont want to destroy our way of life , they dont want to shackle women etc etc . this one supports IS that is enough guilty by association.

I don't think she does either.