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What is equality to you?

willman
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Vaati
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The bickering and insults can cease. You were warned by another mod only a few hours ago. Any further and accounts will be suspended.

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Cyclone Veteran

Cyclone

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But she hasn't drawn attention to any other way she isn't equal?

 

I can understand that a payrise 'cos she has an issue can seem insulting, it would to me, but surely take the money and continue with the battle.

 

I don't think they actually offered her a pay rise though, not from what I've read.

 

---------- Post added 09-01-2018 at 16:58 ----------

 

As some one who has worked in heavy industry as well as leisure and entertainment I am beginning to believe due to the recent debate , protests and demonstrations over the last year or so that I am a complete moron simply by being male.

Every time I pick up a news paper ,turn on the radio or watch the news on T.V. it seems as though my very gender is under attack due to the latest sexual misdeeds ,pay disparity or vocal abuse carried out by the heads of industry and entertainment on women.

Don't be ridiculous.

Looking for ways to make women equal isn't an attack on men.

 

When I worked in heavy industry would it have been fair if I had to do all the heavy lifting with all the risk of injury or danger involved while a college who was say less able to do the same job was on the same pay .

If the jobs weren't equal then nobody should argue for equal pay for them.

 

That situation can be reversed in many situations where the weaker sex or college can perform a job that many men who are used to manual work would find hard or impossible to perform ,in that case would it be fair for them to be paid the same rate of pay.

Why talk about the "weaker sex" and not just "weaker people". You realise that some women are stronger than some men? Stereotypes don't help.

 

All this recent gender debate fascinates me and I can see how upsetting it is for all concerned ,but is it new or as my mam used to say ,'' Thill never be equality ont shop floor as long as women have the babys''.

 

Not upsetting for me. I would fully support a female colleague doing the same job as me in demanding the same pay, all other things being equal.

 

---------- Post added 09-01-2018 at 17:02 ----------

 

In the first paragraph you are saying job should be equal; but then you go on to say people should be paid extra if they out perform others!

If one person is performing better, then whilst they might have the same job title, they're not doing the same job. I don't think that many people would argue against meritocracy, unless performing well is considered to be an inherent characteristic, like sex.

 

All this equality is restricting employers from rewarding good performance, we are all different.

I like to think of myself as a model employee, yet I get zero monetary reward for it, because we are all equal. We are not all equal.

That's not what equality means. Perhaps your employees just use it to avoid paying anyone more than they have to.

 

I used to get paid more than my follow employee that works in the same vehicle, then they got equal pay, then they were awarded 10p an hour more, recently I was regraded and I am now paid 80p more than my colleague.

 

What next, the unions are pushing for equality!

 

Performance related pay shouldn't be a target in the fight for equality IMO. But presumably performance is also used to select for promotion, which then comes with higher pay as well.

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willman Experienced

willman

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I don't think they actually offered her a pay rise though, not from what I've read.

 

---------- Post added 09-01-2018 at 16:58 ----------

 

Don't be ridiculous.

Looking for ways to make women equal isn't an attack on men.

If the jobs weren't equal then nobody should argue for equal pay for them.

Why talk about the "weaker sex" and not just "weaker people". You realise that some women are stronger than some men? Stereotypes don't help.

 

Not upsetting for me. I would fully support a female colleague doing the same job as me in demanding the same pay, all other things being equal.

 

---------- Post added 09-01-2018 at 17:02 ----------

 

If one person is performing better, then whilst they might have the same job title, they're not doing the same job. I don't think that many people would argue against meritocracy, unless performing well is considered to be an inherent characteristic, like sex.

That's not what equality means. Perhaps your employees just use it to avoid paying anyone more than they have to.

 

Performance related pay shouldn't be a target in the fight for equality IMO. But presumably performance is also used to select for promotion, which then comes with higher pay as well.

 

In which you must have misread it they offered a payrise of 45k. Which she refused.

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/carrie-gracie-bbc-gender-pay-gap-refuse-pay-rise-offer-collusion-unlawful-discrimination-men-women-a8148366.html

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the_bloke Rising Star

the_bloke

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Coming up next; male employees no longer expect to be paid more over time in a role they have proved they are good at it in case they are paid more than the newly promoted woman next to them doing the same job badly

 

Edit: swap male/woman around in that statement as you wish.

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Halibut Mentor

Halibut

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Why do you think she hasn't quit all her jobs for the BBC, if they are as bad as she makes out?

 

She isn't making out that they're bad jobs or that the BBC is bad - she's complaining about unequal pay. Men doing the same job as her were being paid substantially more than her. Does that seem fair to you?

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Cyclone Veteran

Cyclone

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Yes, sorry, they offered her a large payrise, but not equal pay to her male colleagues.

 

---------- Post added 09-01-2018 at 19:10 ----------

 

Fair or not - it’s a marketplace.

 

Discrimination on gender or sex with regards to pay would be illegal though.

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Lockdoctor

Lockdoctor

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She isn't making out that they're bad jobs or that the BBC is bad - she's complaining about unequal pay. Men doing the same job as her were being paid substantially more than her. Does that seem fair to you?

She said the BBC is breaking the law which if true means the BBC are bad people. There were no men doing the same job as her because she was the only China editor. I had never heard of this woman before she resigned, but I had heard of Jon Sopel, and Jeremy Bowen, who the woman is comparing herself to. In my opinion people applying for such roles as International editors should agree to accept whatever pay is negotiated at the time they are interviewed for such a job and it is irrelevant what other people are paid. The BBC got rid of Christa Ackroyd, who was the highest paid regional presenter because she refused to accept a pay cut. I never heard any male regional television presenters complaining they were not paid the same as her.

 

---------- Post added 09-01-2018 at 19:24 ----------

 

Fair or not - it’s a marketplace. Not saying she’s not worth a substantial pay rise but some of these people with (relatively) huge incomes lose contact with the real world - remember that Christa Akroyd on Look North !

yes remember Christa Akroyd. Wasn't she poached by the BBC from Calendar?

Edited by Lockdoctor
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