Why Is Sheffield So Far Behind Many Other Uk Cities?

[Irene Swaine 1,073]

Feeder buses would connect communities to the tram network and places like Killamarsh, Eckington and Mosborough would be able to use the tram from a minibus link to Halfway P+R. Not that Supertram needs more customers though, get on any tram and you will usually find that it's packed out.

[Irene Swaine 1,073]

23 hours ago, SheffieldForum said:

Similarly, the tram could fairly easily be routed to Dore and Totley on the train tracks.

The older trams couldn't, as they aren't built to heavy rail standards and don't have TPWS fitted to them etc. 

 

Running a tram on the mainline would interfere heavily with National Rail services. You wouldn't want a train to Aberdeen or London being held up by a late running light rail vehicle. South of Sheffield station is something of a bottle neck and has services reversing (Liverpool-Norwich), (Manchester Piccadilly - Sheffield) & (London-Sheffield). There would also be little gain as the railway station isn't particularly handy for Dore Village or Totley itself. 

[Lizzie b 54]

8 minutes ago, Irene Swaine said:

Feeder buses would connect communities to the tram network and places like Killamarsh, Eckington and Mosborough would be able to use the tram from a minibus link to Halfway P+R. Not that Supertram needs more customers though, get on any tram and you will usually find that it's packed out.

We had these Supertram Link buses a few years ago in these areas Irene, but the powers that be took them away, I don’t know why, it’s not like they weren’t used.

[Planner1 443]

3 hours ago, RollingJ said:

By whom? Although the Sheffield one doesn't appear (from my observations) to cause significant problems in operation, they are restricted on where they go, and, as you should know, quite expensive to construct and maintain.

By the decision makers, politicians.

 

Tram systems attract drivers away from car use, which is something that doesn’t tend to happen with buses.

 

Larger cities need a modern, attractive, high capacity mass transit system. Buses have a role, but aren’t seen as the complete answer in bigger cities.

 

If you want your city to be attractive and seen as being progressive and an investable proposition, having good transport infrastructure is important. Mass transit systems show that the authorities at national and local level are investing significantly in that, which will send a message to potential investors.

[RollingJ 2,072]

2 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

By the decision makers, politicians.

 

Tram systems attract drivers away from car use, which is something that doesn’t tend to happen with buses.

 

Larger cities need a modern, attractive, high capacity mass transit system. Buses have a role, but aren’t seen as the complete answer in bigger cities.

 

If you want your city to be attractive and seen as being progressive and an investable proposition, having good transport infrastructure is important. Mass transit systems show that the authorities at national and local level are investing significantly in that, which will send a message to potential investors.

Do these  decision makers - politicians - always know what they are talking about? I have heard some right howlers from them.

[Planner1 443]

1 hour ago, RollingJ said:

Do these  decision makers - politicians - always know what they are talking about? I have heard some right howlers from them.

Very few politicians are experts in their areas of responsibility.

 

Of course they are briefed by officers and get recommendations from them, but they make their own mind up and say what they like.

[RollingJ 2,072]

7 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

Very few politicians are experts in their areas of responsibility.

 

Of course they are briefed by officers and get recommendations from them, but they make their own mind up and say what they like.

That is painfully obvious, from some of the comments they make - maybe they should think before opening their mouths.

 

If I was responsible for a department, I would be careful in what I said, and be happy to admit I wasn't sure, but maybe that is just me. If I was briefed by someone who did have clue what they were talking about, I would tend to take that advice, and only add my thoughts after saying something to the effect of 'but my thoughts/understadings are'...

Edited February 13 by RollingJ

[26b-6 16]

On 07/02/2024 at 10:26, ECCOnoob said:

Pretty weak source . A three year old hatchet job from some trash web newspaper very selectively quoting out of a think tank opinion report that doesn't just talk about Sheffield but lots of other cities. 

 

I agree the tram system doesn't go everywhere and could do more, but, every time they even mention some proposal there's always a good part of the population shouting them down,  crying about the disruption it would cause, crying about how it will affect businesses, crying about how many nurses it could pay for....  

 

On last stats it still served 8.4 million passengers according to the DFT and it's passenger numbers previously reached as high as 15 million. Can't be that much of a joke because somebody is clearly using it.

 

I think it quite obvious Leeds is showing some envy over not having a tram. They'd been trying to push through plans and obtain funding for once since the 1970s, but suddenly had a rush of activity and failed proposals throughout the 1990s / early 2000s (which coincidentally was around the time that Sheffield supertram opened).  Even today, their regional mayor is making political pledges that the city will get their own "amazing tram system"

 

Makes a nice change for once for us to have something they don't.

the newspaper's source is from Centre-For-Cities.  A well respected research group used by urban-planners.

 

https://www.centreforcities.org/press/governments-infrastructure-revolution-is-not-enough-to-improve-transport/

 

https://committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/41122/pdf/

 

Still waiting to hear all these Leeds folk are envious of Sheffield's tram system.?

 

Edited February 20 by 26b-6

[26b-6 16]

2 minutes ago, 26b-6 said:

edit

 

the newspaper's source is from Centre-For-Cities.  A well respected research group used by urban-planners.

 

https://www.centreforcities.org/press/governments-infrastructure-revolution-is-not-enough-to-improve-transport/

 

https://committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/41122/pdf/

 

Still waiting to hear who all these Leeds folk are envious of Sheffield's tram system.?

Edited February 20 by 26b-6

[Planner1 443]

2 hours ago, 26b-6 said:

 

Still waiting to hear who all these Leeds folk are envious of Sheffield's tram system.?

They’ve recently consulted on their overall mass transit vision, which you can find here

 

51% of respondees fully supported it and 37% partially supported it.

[Guest busdriver1]

3 hours ago, Planner1 said:

They’ve recently consulted on their overall mass transit vision, which you can find here

 

51% of respondees fully supported it and 37% partially supported it.

As we all know, there are lies, damn lies, and statistics. 51% of how many? A figure that would reflect WAY more accurately the actual amount of people wanting their council to squander billions would be the total of people in favour from a survey of how many. Percentages can look good whilst being meaningless without context, and old old con to get the right sort of outcome.

[hackey lad 3,996]

1 minute ago, busdriver1 said:

As we all know, there are lies, damn lies, and statistics. 51% of how many? A figure that would reflect WAY more accurately the actual amount of people wanting their council to squander billions would be the total of people in favour from a survey of how many. Percentages can look good whilst being meaningless without context, and old old con to get the right sort of outcome.