Africa Turning To Russia And China .

[geared]

We can't, we don't.  There's too much history, not just colonialism but from general mismanagement of aid and such.

The default method for aid was to just hand it over, and hope they did the right thing.   All that happened was the elite took 99% for themselves and left little for the rest.

 

There are many criticisms of Chinese methods, and it's still unfair in a broad sense.  But it works, and the benefits from the work really do impact on normal peoples lives.

 

The Russians are a different kettle of fish, they're really only in it for themselves and they're really only appealing to the wealthy elite.  They won't do a single thing to improve normal peoples lives.

[Al Bundy]

21 minutes ago, geared said:

We can't, we don't.  There's too much history, not just colonialism but from general mismanagement of aid and such.

The default method for aid was to just hand it over, and hope they did the right thing.   All that happened was the elite took 99% for themselves and left little for the rest.

 

There are many criticisms of Chinese methods, and it's still unfair in a broad sense.  But it works, and the benefits from the work really do impact on normal peoples lives.

 

The Russians are a different kettle of fish, they're really only in it for themselves and they're really only appealing to the wealthy elite.  They won't do a single thing to improve normal peoples lives.

They built the Lada.

[carosio]

10 hours ago, Anna B said:

Is it so surprising? The West were the colonisers who exploited the African countries in the first place and did them few  favours. And in spite of years of aid, which usually came with strings attached, failed to pull them out of poverty.

Now that China has stepped in, aid is working better and the improvement measurable.   

Perhaps the African who's seeking asylum will ditch the West and fall into the welcoming arms of China and Russia?

Edited August 12, 2023 by carosio

[Baron99]

3 hours ago, geared said:

China isn't putting aid into Africa, they offer cut price loans to the countries Governments.

 

Yes there are strings, usually the money is spent on big building projects - which are required to be given to Chinese construction companies.  So the money flows straight back to Chinas coffers.   Several countries are now drowning in debt, these projects aren't always very well thought through.

 

Russia likes to provide military aid, in exchange they want natural resources.  Wagner got involved in CAR, they now control many of the countries largest gold mines.  

In Syria they cut a deal, they would take a cut of production for every oil well they recaptured for Assad.  They went to work and took most of them back.

Spot on. 

https://www.statista.com/chart/19642/external-loan-debt-to-china-by-country/#:~:text=At the end of 2021,the biggest debts to China.

 

African countries are becoming massively indebted to China.  Yes they are building infrastructure such as ports, mqinly so Chinese shipping can get resources out of those countries for Chinese use & the coutries can't say diddly-squat as they own the Chinese billions in loan repayments, which they will never be in a position to repay. 

 

Meanwhile, western nations like the UK, continue to pour aid into these countries which no doubt will now find its way to Beijing. 

 

Could you imagine the outcry if the UK decided to do the same thing, we'd immediately be accused of trying to regenerate the Empire in Africa; be accused of exploiting poor Africans & stripping the continent of its resources for nothing else than the UK's gain. 

 

Of course, no matter how much condemnation China receives for their actions, it won't trouble them what's so ever. 

[Jack Grey]

Great

 

Let's stop sending billions in Aid to Africa and let the Russians and Chinese look after them 👍

[cressida]

1 hour ago, carosio said:

Perhaps the African who's seeking asylum will ditch the West and fall into the welcoming arms of China and Russia?

Noticing the problems Europe still has preventing illegal immigrants,  if they are wise Russia and China will have none of it imo

[Organgrinder]

1 hour ago, carosio said:

Perhaps the African who's seeking asylum will ditch the West and fall into the welcoming arms of China and Russia?

That's a good point.

They should do but we know that they won't.

[Al Bundy]

1 hour ago, Baron99 said:

Spot on. 

https://www.statista.com/chart/19642/external-loan-debt-to-china-by-country/#:~:text=At the end of 2021,the biggest debts to China.

 

African countries are becoming massively indebted to China.  Yes they are building infrastructure such as ports, mqinly so Chinese shipping can get resources out of those countries for Chinese use & the coutries can't say diddly-squat as they own the Chinese billions in loan repayments, which they will never be in a position to repay. 

 

Meanwhile, western nations like the UK, continue to pour aid into these countries which no doubt will now find its way to Beijing. 

 

Could you imagine the outcry if the UK decided to do the same thing, we'd immediately be accused of trying to regenerate the Empire in Africa; be accused of exploiting poor Africans & stripping the continent of its resources for nothing else than the UK's gain. 

 

Of course, no matter how much condemnation China receives for their actions, it won't trouble them what's so ever. 

Did you not get the memo?

 

England=bad

Anyone else=good.

[Magilla]

6 hours ago, Al Bundy said:

Did you not get the memo?

 

England=bad

Anyone else=good.

Who's saying the actions of China and Russia are good here?