Cultural appropriation, a complete non-issue?

[Jomie]

There are black people who are ‘quintessentially English’. Two examples: Sir Trevor McDonald, Floella Benjamin, OBE.

As for cultural appropriation, they do say that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

[leviathan13]

For me...

 

Female James Bond, no, just no, is James a girl's name?

 

Black James Bond, maybe, but feels to me like he should be a white dude.

 

Here's one back at ya...

 

If they made more Black Panther movies, can we eventually have a white Black Panther?

 

I'd say no, because someone would claim 'white privelege' at a white actor stopping a black actor taking the part. It's fine if black actors take a part that has been historically white, but the other way round is racism.

 

For example, the film 'White Chicks' - two black actors, in effect, 'white-up' and that's fine. Yet, the other way is seen as racist and something from a bygone era.

 

In Thor, Idris Elba was playing a mythical Norse character. 2000 years ago, I would have thought that all Norse gods would have been a representation of their followers. How would we go having a white person playing Mohammed in a film about Islam?

 

I know we've had white people playing Jesus, despite the area of the world he would have come from, but try telling the older generation of Christians that he would have had darker skin and hair and you'll be shouted down.

Edited July 17, 2018 by leviathan13

[Baron99]

a black JAMES BOND no way!! how would that work judging by when the original stories were written timewise, Bond is the quintessential english secret agent and at the time very few blacks were in the country never mind the secret service.

now maybe you could have a love child of the original bond? which was from one of his many dalliances with various foreign agents? who follows in his fathers footsteps as 008?

 

The back story of James Bond has clearly been defined. Father, Scottish aristocracy & his mother is Swiss aristocracy.

 

Clearly any actor who lands the role of Bond ends up high profile & I believe that this is the main reason for wanting a black actor / woman to play the role. Just jumping on the Bond franchise bandwagon.

 

We're often told that there are many talented black actors, directors, writers & similarly talented women. Well come up with a few new original ideas, plots & storylines.

 

---------- Post added 17-07-2018 at 12:41 ----------

 

There are black people who are ‘quintessentially English’. Two examples: Sir Trevor McDonald, Floella Benjamin, OBE.

As for cultural appropriation, they do say that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

 

Don’t forget Chris Eubank. Makes Prince Charles sound common.

[Ridgewalk]

The term is becoming more and more popular in news and social media, with more and more people being accused of it, but does it really deserve the demonisation it's getting?

 

The most common use seems to be against celebrities who wear clothing and fashion accessories originating from or influenced by other cultures, supposedly not knowing or understanding their origins. As long as there's no justified offence caused (i.e, wearing a swastika covered dress because you like the pattern), then what's actually so bad?

 

Another example is the ever popular male Caucasian students' hair option of wearing dreadlocks. My personal opinion is that it looks ridiculous, but should it cause offence?

 

Funnily enough, when I saw the thread title I immediately thought of the example you give in the last paragraph. If I’m honest it probably does offend me. Poseurs in general offend me. Too «* look at me*» and vain, in a white, middle class, trendy sort of way

 

---------- Post added 17-07-2018 at 12:45 ----------

 

There are black people who are ‘quintessentially English’. Two examples: Sir Trevor McDonald, Floella Benjamin, OBE.

As for cultural appropriation, they do say that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

 

Frank Bruno is also «* quintessentially «* English, he’s true to his class roots. Not sure about the other two you’ve named.

[realcockney]

There are black people who are ‘quintessentially English’. Two examples: Sir Trevor McDonald, Floella Benjamin, OBE.

As for cultural appropriation, they do say that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

 

I was talking about the era the book was written:roll:

[InigoMontoya]

a black JAMES BOND no way!! how would that work judging by when the original stories were written timewise, Bond is the quintessential english secret agent and at the time very few blacks were in the country never mind the secret service.

now maybe you could have a love child of the original bond? which was from one of his many dalliances with various foreign agents? who follows in his fathers footsteps as 008?

 

Weren't quite a lot of the books set in Jamaica and around the Carribean?

 

I think there might have been one or two blacks around then.

 

 

In any case, James Bond (the film franchise) is being continually reset to be current, so anyone could be Bond.

 

 

(Indeed, some of the more fanciful theories contend that "James Bond" is a code name, and 007 is simply someone playing that role)

[RootsBooster]

But we can have a black or female James Bond?

 

Not saying that's wrong, just trying to find the line.

 

Also, in a lot of Japanese anime, many of the characters don't have typical 'Asian' characteristics. I've not seen the original anime of Ghost in the Shell, but having recently gotten in to Tokyo Ghoul, Cowboy Bebop and Full Metal Alchemist, almost all of the characters have westernised features. So, this being the case, I don't see how SJ could have come under such criticism for her live-action portrayal.

Bond is an ever-morphing role. We've had Irish, Scottish, English, Welsh, dark haired, brown eyed, blonde, blue eyed Bonds, why not a black or female Bond?

 

---------- Post added 17-07-2018 at 17:01 ----------

 

a black JAMES BOND no way!! how would that work judging by when the original stories were written timewise, Bond is the quintessential english secret agent and at the time very few blacks were in the country never mind the secret service.

now maybe you could have a love child of the original bond? which was from one of his many dalliances with various foreign agents? who follows in his fathers footsteps as 008?

If you're going to cry 'original Bond!' then he'd likely need to carry out his missions in a wheelchair with a mobile life support system now.

[realcockney]

Weren't quite a lot of the books set in Jamaica and around the Carribean?

 

I think there might have been one or two blacks around then.

 

 

In any case, James Bond (the film franchise) is being continually reset to be current, so anyone could be Bond.

 

 

(Indeed, some of the more fanciful theories contend that "James Bond" is a code name, and 007 is simply someone playing that role)

 

yes good point that would be a good way to bring in a black bond and up to date as previously mentioned Idris Elba would be an excellent choice.

[leviathan13]

Bond is an ever-morphing role. We've had Irish, Scottish, English, Welsh, dark haired, brown eyed, blonde, blue eyed Bonds, why not a black or female Bond?

 

---------- Post added 17-07-2018 at 17:01 ----------

 

If you're going to cry 'original Bond!' then he'd likely need to carry out his missions in a wheelchair with a mobile life support system now.

 

But does everything have to become politicised and have to be changed just for the sake of 'progress'? How about we talk about a white Shaft? Does it always have to be historically white, male roles that are changed?

[Waldo]

a black JAMES BOND no way!! how would that work judging by when the original stories were written timewise, Bond is the quintessential english secret agent and at the time very few blacks were in the country never mind the secret service.

now maybe you could have a love child of the original bond? which was from one of his many dalliances with various foreign agents? who follows in his fathers footsteps as 008?

 

Well, thematically, clearly there are different people who are employed for the 007 role (odd that they're all called James tho). Otherwise, James would be like 100 by now. Also, it's clearly set in the modern day (just look at the cars and gadgets) where a lot of English people are non-white.

 

I'd have zero issues with a black bond, the only concern would be how entertaining he was.

 

---------- Post added 17-07-2018 at 21:08 ----------

 

I'd say no, because someone would claim 'white privelege' at a white actor stopping a black actor taking the part. It's fine if black actors take a part that has been historically white, but the other way round is racism.

 

For example, the film 'White Chicks' - two black actors, in effect, 'white-up' and that's fine. Yet, the other way is seen as racist and something from a bygone era.

 

In Thor, Idris Elba was playing a mythical Norse character. 2000 years ago, I would have thought that all Norse gods would have been a representation of their followers. How would we go having a white person playing Mohammed in a film about Islam?

 

I know we've had white people playing Jesus, despite the area of the world he would have come from, but try telling the older generation of Christians that he would have had darker skin and hair and you'll be shouted down.

 

Actually, I think on reflection, it's a poor comparison. A Black Panther, would be specifically a black person; there's no such specificity with the James Bond 007 character.