The Consequences of Brexit [part 5] Read 1st post before posting

[Magilla 510]

EEC, different animal to the EU.

 

Yawn, that ole chestnut. Nah, it's the same animal that has evolved (partly) under the UK's guidance.

 

Yes.

 

Through their elected representatives in Europe and through Commissioners appointed by their democratically elected representatives in Westminster.

 

Indeed, it's a red herring.

 

Anyway, as Theresa said today, it's her soft-Brexit or no-Brexit.

 

Which one do you want leavers, or are you pinning your hopes on Boris?

Edited July 15, 2018 by Magilla

[Top Cats Hat 10]

 

Which one do you want leavers, or are you pinning your hopes on Boris?

 

With the Brextremists currently struggling to get the 48 signatures needed to kick off a leadership challenge (out of 316 MPs) I doubt a hard Brexit government is anywhere near becoming a reality.

 

Also a senior Tory MP said on one of the politics programmes today, that although Boris is a colourful character and well liked in the party, if he got even a sniff of leading the party, there are too many MPs who simply wouldn't let that happen.

 

So it looks like we're having Teresa May's 'soft Brexit' where we get a worse deal than even Cameron got, are still subject to the ECJ on many matters AND no longer have any say in what decisions are made in Brussels. And just like Groundhog Day we start again with the rise of a 'Brexit Betrayal' UKIP Mark 2, again threatening Tory seats.

 

Well done leavers! (where's that slow hand clap emoji?)

Edited July 15, 2018 by Top Cats Hat

[Obelix 11]

So did people get a vote on this change ? It all snowballed from the common market which primarily was for trading ,to the giant organisation ,with many arms , that it is today

 

I dont recall us being asked for any of the numerous other treaties either like oooh I dunno the North Atlantic Treaty, so why do you think we should have one for the Lisbon Treaty or the Maastrict Treaty?

[I1L2T3 10]

With the Brextremists currently struggling to get the 48 signatures needed to kick off a leadership challenge (out of 316 MPs) I doubt a hard Brexit government is anywhere near becoming a reality.

 

Also a senior Tory MP said on one of the politics programmes today, that although Boris is a colourful character and well liked in the party, if he got even a sniff of leading the party, there are too many MPs who simply wouldn't let that happen.

 

So it looks like we're having Teresa May's 'soft Brexit' where we get a worse deal than even Cameron got, are still subject to the ECJ on many matters AND no longer have any say in what decisions are made in Brussels. And just like Groundhog Day we start again with the rise of a 'Brexit Betrayal' UKIP Mark 2, again threatening Tory seats.

 

Well done leavers! (where's that slow hand clap emoji?)

 

Why have we wasted 2 years on a hard Brexit agenda when less than 10% of MPs actually support it.

 

Answer of course is that those 40 or so nutjobs hold the balance of power in the Tory party.

 

MPs need to man/woman up. Yes we can Brexit if they really want to, but let’s go for the simplest way to implement the question on the ballot paper: EEA membership.

 

It is effectively what we’ll end up with anyway so let’s cut out the crap and go straight to it.

[El Cid 222]

The Office for National Statistics said that net migration from countries outside the EU had risen to 227,000, the highest level since September 2010. As if the Tories have any intention of bringing down immigration, when we leave the EU. We do allow foreigners into England these days, although some people would rather not. We live in a globalised world, first they invented the wheel, and now people can get a 737 to go anywhere in the world.

[RJRB 688]

Day by day we move closer to another referendum.

Whether this is a simple further in or out,or another referendum on the terms proposed by Mrs May remains to be seen.

The electorate are much better informed than they were 2 years ago and some claims have been shown to be either downright lies or deceptions.

Mrs May is the nearest thing that we have to a leader trying to arrive at a workable conclusion .

There is no champion of a hard Brexit who is capable or prepared to step up to the plate.Without exception they are vociferous back benchers incapable of turning their dreams into reality.

One thing is for sure.

There is no tangible Brexit dividend and time slips by towards a damaging conclusion for our future.

[I1L2T3 10]

The Office for National Statistics said that net migration from countries outside the EU had risen to 227,000, the highest level since September 2010. As if the Tories have any intention of bringing down immigration, when we leave the EU. We do allow foreigners into England these days, although some people would rather not. We live in a globalised world, first they invented the wheel, and now people can get a 737 to go anywhere in the world.

 

One of the reasons for a strong vote for leave from Brits of Asian origin was because the Asian community want increased non-EU migration. Many businesses are constrained because they can’t easily bring skilled people in.

[L00b 441]

One of the reasons for a strong vote for leave from Brits of Asian origin was because the Asian community want increased non-EU migration. Many businesses are constrained because they can’t easily bring skilled people in.

”without the ambit of the working time Directive, nor all those other pesky socialistic employee-sided measures” is the bit you missed

 

Can’t be doing with paying skilled curry chefs a living wage rather than NMW (the problem being their earning level in the U.K., relative to the UK minimum for working visa’d non-EU immigrants )

Edited July 16, 2018 by L00b

[I1L2T3 10]

”without the ambit of the working time Directive, nor all those other pesky socialistic employee-sided measures” is the bit you missed

 

Can’t be doing with paying skilled curry chefs a living wage rather than NMW (the problem being their earning level in the U.K., relative to the UK minimum for working visa’d non-EU immigrants )

 

I’m not defending it.

 

It’s a good reminder that there are a lot of people who for various reasons are queuing up to exploit the opportunities that deregulation will provide.

 

From small businesses all the way up to the Brexit leaders (like Mogg and Hannan) whose complete motives are not known yet.

[L00b 441]

I’m not defending it.

Oh, I know

It’s a good reminder that there are a lot of people who for various reasons are queuing up to exploit the opportunities that deregulation will provide.

 

From small businesses all the way up to the Brexit leaders (like Mogg and Hannan) whose complete motives are not known yet.

The Brexit leaders’ motives are very transparent: maximum personal profit for them and their backers, and rule-taking from Washington Manhattan.

 

Which is exactly how and why Mogg plays the working class Brexiteers with his nationalist snake oil, whilst moving his financial business and his 1%er clients’s funds to the EU27. As blatant a case of “do as I say, not as I do” as I’ve ever seen.

 

Brexit leaders don’t really want political power, so much as the transformation of the U.K. into an ultra-liberal neo-capitalist template. Caviar for them, soylent green for the populace.

 

The “exactly how” matters little. The clock plays for them, and they’re quite happy playing it until March’19.

Edited July 16, 2018 by L00b

[Top Cats Hat 10]

Although not a big fan of a second referendum (because the 2016 referendum didn't oblige us to leave the EU so we don't need one to remain), I quite like Justine Greening's idea of a three way referendum which is basically back in, a hard Brexit or Teresa May's. 'soft Brexit'.

 

The Brextremists won't be able to shout "No re run! We've already voted!" as this is a new vote on the real situation with a lot more information on the consequences of leaving than we had in 2016.

[geared 321]

Why have we wasted 2 years on a hard Brexit agenda when less than 10% of MPs actually support it.

 

Have we actually done that though??

 

It pops up in the press often enough but I've not actually seen any real details about it, or any of it's important parts.

Just seems like a load of talk and no substnce, I get the feeling no-one's actually put a great deal of work into the concept or how it might work.

 

I quite like Justine Greening's idea of a three way referendum which is basically back in, a hard Brexit or Teresa May's. 'soft Brexit'.

 

We should have had that vote to start off with though, at least that way we could be sure what we actually voted for.