Four cyclists killed in car crash

[hmr44 10]

Imagine if you were driving, and you skidded on ice killing 4 people, put yourself in his boots.

I know its awful for the people families but unless he intentionally tried to kill them, nobodys to blame.

[PENGUIN 10]

I'm sure a huge part of the driver died along with the cyclists. Its already been said by investigators speed was not the cause of this but nature was. I hope the driver has better support through this than what you guys have shown.

[nick2 10]

I was talking generaly, where a car is involved and the driver is found to be at fault they rarely get a serious sentance.

 

If this was an accident then thats different.

[samc 10]

I really feel for this driver and for all the cyclists involved.

 

To me this does sound to be a tragic accdientI read the driver was going at the correct speed for the road. Spotting black ice is not easy if it's an isolated bit of ice and the entire road isn't icey.

 

If I was that driver I am not sure how I would mentally cope and continue my life. I am sure they will have thoughts of wishing they'd died instead.

[Greybeard 10]

Speed in unsuitable road conditions may have been a factor, - but if ice was the cause had the road been gritted ? Given that that stretch of the road is a 'notorious black spot for accidents' it should have deserved extra attention from the LA.

 

The inquest will reveal all I expect.

[spinac 10]

When there are deaths involved like this we want to blame someone, but the full facts will only be found from the investigation. Maybe the driver was driving with excessive speed for the conditions - and maybe he wasn't.

 

I used to drive 50,000 miles a year as part of my work. I drove with consideration for my life and others, but still managed to skid on black ice once in a place I would never have expected it (at the top of a hill on a dry, sunny, but cold day). I spun round completely twice, left the road and went into a wall backwards and was totally uninjured. I narrowly missed a big lorry coming the other way so could easily have suffered myself, but if there'd been any cyclists or pedestrians around I dread to think what would have happened.

 

Sometimes we're lucky, sometimes accidents are just accidents and sometimes drivers are to blame. Whether the driver in this case is to blame or not we don't know yet, but it's a burden he'll carry for the rest of his life, however our main sympathy should be with the loved ones of those that were totally innocent in this.

[fnkysknky 10]

Are you lot taking the **** or what? The report says that it doesn't look like the drivers speed was to blame and that it was an accident, it skidded on the ice.

 

Should have known you'd all know better than the experts on scene

[robS35 10]

Originally posted by PENGUIN

I'm sure a huge part of the driver died along with the cyclists. Its already been said by investigators speed was not the cause of this but nature was. I hope the driver has better support through this than what you guys have shown.

 

I would say speed was the major factor in the cause of this crash plus the road was also icy, the police say the driver was going at something like 50mph, now to say that isnt excessive speed given the road conditions at the time is stupid.

[spinac 10]

agreed robS35. the question is not whether the driver was exceeding the speed limit, but was he driving at an appropriate speed for the conditions? I've skidded as described when under the speed limit and had no forewarning of possible black ice, but I've also seen people overtake on motorways when snow is settling and when there has been a deluge of rain where the spray from the vehicles in front reduce visibility to such a degree that overtaking puts everyone at risk.

 

Speed limits give the maximum legal speed for good driving conditions. They are not necessarily safe driving speeds.

 

I hope the driver has a clear concsience over his contribution to the outcome whether guilty of any driving offence or not.

[scoop 10]

I once skidded on some mud in the grounds of the Northern General Hospital (there was some buillding work going on and tractors had been going back and forth from the site onto the road). I was only doing about 1o miles an hourbut still managed to slide across to the other side of the road, thank god no one was in the way, but it goes to show that even at snails pace you can get into trouble in slippery conditions.

[Cyclone 10]

an amazing number of arm chair experts (not to mention judges and jurys posting here).

 

I've skidded on black ice before, the rest of the road was completely ice free, and one patch was just a sheet of ice. I was only doing 30 mph and went into a tree. Unless we become psychic somehow then accidents will happen, they are called accidents for a reason.

 

My current car has a warning light that comes on at 4 degrees and another for 0 degrees, I think that's a brilliant feature as I know when I should be taking a bit of extra care as ice is possible.

 

I'm particularly interested in the post by kipper

The driver will have known how bad the road gets and selfishly felt protected in its steel carcus as all car drivers do.

 

how exactly do you know that? For all you know he'd never driven on that road before.

 

If there are any questions to be asked it might be about this;

 

It is understood police were called to another accident on the same road an hour previously after a car lost control on the ice.

Why didn't they either call out a gritter or put up some warning signs?

 

The conditions don't exactly sound like the ones when you'd be worried about black ice either

 

in fine weather, ... when they were struck by the car travelling in the opposite direction shortly after 1000 GMT on the A547 Rhuddlan Road.

[Lotti 10]

I can't believe you lot!

 

Ok - it's a tragedy, it is. And I really feel for those cyclists who survived and the families of the dead.

 

But come on! You don't know the circumstances - you are judging a man you do not know without any actual evidence.

 

You have only read what is in the papers, whoever said the guy knew it was a bad road, how do you know?! Do you know him?

It could have been an isolated spot of ice as the report says it was a fine day.

 

When it was icy here recently I drove as I believed was safe with the conditions. I don't have years of experience but I did learn in the winter and know how important it is to take conditions into consideration. Still I managed to skid and was terrified I wouldn't stop before the junction I was pulling out of. I did stop in time but it would have been quite possible not to have done.

 

I am sure that the driver went away feeling guilty whether he was to blame or not. He was the more damaging vehicle, so whether he was driving dangerously or not, he will probably feel responsible.

 

I sincerely hope nobody ever finds this thread and passes it onto him because you lot are so judgemental.