Leeds - Actual Capital of the North?

[DnAuK]

sadly with this councils blinkers the new retail quarter will prob never happen and if it does it will be a disaster like the new market, the problem is the council dont look at schemes from a business point of view:roll:

 

This is the problem. When I first moved back to Sheffield i though 'wow - it's finally going places'. Three years later, it hasn't. Not really. meanwhile Leeds has Trinity and an upgraded Victoria Centre, plus a new bar / restaurant / entertainment venue opening up regularly.

 

---------- Post added 11-12-2015 at 09:44 ----------

 

The moor is going to be as big of a disaster as the market. The redevelopment is only a small little part of the moor.

Cineworld will be flying high with its refurb, 4DX and is closer to the tram with a bigger (but not big enough) parking lot.

Last week there was someone screaming about believing in god and the bible on moor with a loud soundsystem.

 

Leeds has more shopping brands and products to offer.

Sheffield is shrinking, leeds is keeping up and keeps these shops that Sheffield has lost.

 

The best parts of Sheffield are, sadly, outside the cente. Which isn't condusive to attracting people into the city. If they want the Moor to work they need a direct link to it from town. If you are a visitor who doesn;t know the transport system exactly how do you get there? Put a dedicated bus stop outside the train station that just shuttles to the Moor and back (like the FreeBee that was taken off, largely because it wasn't clear to visitors exactly where it went from!) and that might help.

[dutch]

Let me put it the way I see it.

 

The moor:

No connection to tram

No connection to train

Indecent parking.

Not enough places for food/drinks

Not particularly visually attractive or outstanding, (its just ok).

bad reputation due to market disaster.

When I come/go from south of city bus is ok, but from north bus stops frequently 10 minutes now to adjust to time schedule at fargate. Sitting there 10 minutes far away from the moor doing nothing because the bus is playing new timing games there, then takes a pacman route allover the place to get to the moor.

 

When I get out of train station in Leeds there is an easier more direct better developed connection to the city centre and its facilities.

 

---------- Post added 11-12-2015 at 10:34 ----------

 

I would like to add that sheffield trainstation is the most beautifull trainstation of any place I have ever lived and appreciate that very much.

 

Personally I prefer Sheffield station over leeds, but Sheffield will never rise to the top unless they perhaps build a nonstop rolling stairway from there to fargate.

Edited December 11, 2015 by dutch

[DnAuK]

Let me put it the way I see it.

 

The moor:

No connection to tram

No connection to train

Indecent parking.

Not enough places for food/drinks

Not particularly visually attractive or outstanding, (its just ok).

bad reputation due to market disaster.

When I come/go from south of city bus is ok, but from north bus stops frequently 10 minutes now to adjust to time schedule at fargate. Sitting there 10 minutes far away from the moor doing nothing because the bus is playing new timing games there, then takes a pacman route allover the place to get to the moor.

 

When I get out of train station in Leeds there is an easier more direct better developed connection to the city centre and its facilities.

 

---------- Post added 11-12-2015 at 10:34 ----------

 

I would like to add that sheffield trainstation is the most beautifull trainstation of any place I have ever lived and appreciate that very much.

 

Personally I prefer Sheffield station over leeds, but Sheffield will never rise to the top unless they perhaps build a nonstop rolling stairway from there to fargate.

 

Woe. there will be people on this Forum who swear we are the same person

[dutch]

The irony is that there is a tram from the station to fargate.

 

BUT!!!!! It is at the small, dark hidden minute back exit unknown to strangers/visitors. Far away from the fantastic front entrance.

 

Say you are a visitor, get out check out the station. Admire the artwork outside and ask, "where is the tram?"

You have to go all back again and further from where you got of the train, and the rear exit tram stops are some of the ugliest tram stops we have in Sheffield.

[DnAuK]

The irony is that there is a tram from the station to fargate.

 

BUT!!!!! It is at the small, dark hidden minute back exit unknown to strangers/visitors. Far away from the fantastic front entrance.

 

Say you are a visitor, get out check out the station. Admire the artwork outside and ask, "where is the tram?"

You have to go all back again and further from where you got of the train, and the rear exit tram stops are some of the ugliest tram stops we have in Sheffield.

 

There used to be bus-stops outside the front of the station. There is space to cut a recess into the paved area for a shuttle bus. As long as you make sure it's only used by a bus to service the run into town. Don't want buses backed up on the main road. That would help.

[dutch]

As far as an artistic city Sheffield has developed very far with its galleries, winter garden, theatres. And many more beautiful things that make Sheffield special.

 

But as far as a national competitor in business, money, national development Sheffield is a loser to Leeds.

[Cyclone]

You're attacking Gap for not moving with the times but defending Sheffield?

 

No, I'm describing how they're doing as a retailer. Which is pretty badly at the moment.

 

---------- Post added 11-12-2015 at 11:36 ----------

 

Last week there was someone screaming about believing in god and the bible on moor with a loud soundsystem.

 

Leeds regularly has people doing the same...

 

---------- Post added 11-12-2015 at 11:41 ----------

 

If they want the Moor to work they need a direct link to it from town. If you are a visitor who doesn;t know the transport system exactly how do you get there?

 

It IS part of town. That's like saying you want a direct link from Fargate to town, what does it mean?

 

---------- Post added 11-12-2015 at 11:44 ----------

 

Let me put it the way I see it.

 

The moor:

No connection to tram

No connection to train

Indecent parking.

Not enough places for food/drinks

Not particularly visually attractive or outstanding, (its just ok).

bad reputation due to market disaster.

When I come/go from south of city bus is ok, but from north bus stops frequently 10 minutes now to adjust to time schedule at fargate. Sitting there 10 minutes far away from the moor doing nothing because the bus is playing new timing games there, then takes a pacman route allover the place to get to the moor.

 

When I get out of train station in Leeds there is an easier more direct better developed connection to the city centre and its facilities.

 

---------- Post added 11-12-2015 at 10:34 ----------

 

I would like to add that sheffield trainstation is the most beautifull trainstation of any place I have ever lived and appreciate that very much.

 

Personally I prefer Sheffield station over leeds, but Sheffield will never rise to the top unless they perhaps build a nonstop rolling stairway from there to fargate.

 

So in order to make this comparison favourable to Leeds, you've had to redefine the city centre in Sheffield as "The moor" and claim that Leeds train station is direct onto Briggate?

[DnAuK]

No, I'm describing how they're doing as a retailer. Which is pretty badly at the moment.

 

---------- Post added 11-12-2015 at 11:36 ----------

 

 

Leeds regularly has people doing the same...

 

---------- Post added 11-12-2015 at 11:41 ----------

 

 

It IS part of town. That's like saying you want a direct link from Fargate to town, what does it mean?

 

---------- Post added 11-12-2015 at 11:44 ----------

 

 

So in order to make this comparison favourable to Leeds, you've had to redefine the city centre in Sheffield as "The moor" and claim that Leeds train station is direct onto Briggate?

 

What Dutch is saying (and I agree with him) is that you walk out of Leeds station and there is something immediately in front of you to go at. Namely Trinity, which connects to Briggate and Headrow. With Sheffield that isn't the case as it's hampered by geography. Your only link into the retail / theatre / restauarant / bar section of town is a hike up Howard Street or a tram to Cathedral / West Street. Neither of these give immediate access to the Moor. So if you want to get visitors from out of town to the Moor you need a direct transport link.

 

I know people will say 'go across to the Howard and jump on a bus there', but seriously how many out of towners would know this? It needs fixing. or the Moor, and the Retail Quarter will fail.

 

If you don't believe this answer one question, why did developers go ahead with the development of Trinity and the Victoria Qtr in Leeds but left Sheffield to rot? Because they knew this to be true. Simple.

[smiggs]

What Dutch is saying (and I agree with him) is that you walk out of Leeds station and there is something immediately in front of you to go at. Namely Trinity, which connects to Briggate and Headrow. With Sheffield that isn't the case as it's hampered by geography. Your only link into the retail / theatre / restauarant / bar section of town is a hike up Howard Street or a tram to Cathedral / West Street. Neither of these give immediate access to the Moor. So if you want to get visitors from out of town to the Moor you need a direct transport link.

 

I know people will say 'go across to the Howard and jump on a bus there', but seriously how many out of towners would know this? It needs fixing. or the Moor, and the Retail Quarter will fail.

 

I don't think the Moor is really for out of towners it's the bargain basement section of town, we need to prioritise parking, and local access via tram (we can but dream) and bus over a link from the railway station. The retail quarter is a bit more highend and needs strong connection to the tram from either Catherdral or City Hall. The reinstatement of the freebee bus would be nice but a better option from a retail perspective would be to offer free tram travel between the station and university for anyone holding a train ticket with destination Sheffield for that day.

[dutch]

Maybe the reason we mention the moor is because it is the only little place where a little bit of development is happening.

The rest of Sheffield centre is asleep.