BNP megathread (again)

[Halibut]

Whilst holding no truck with the BNP it does appear that bully boy tactics have been used to get this meeting cancelled,as far as im concerned free speech is far too important to be sacrificed by ANYONE be they left or right wing.

Those responsible for this ought to be brought to book and made to face the law and be dealt with accordingly,my grand father fought and died for this country so we ALL have the right to live in a free society and not to have some kind of facist or marxist state telling us what we can and cant do.

It matters not one jot if they are BNP, labour, tory or the monster raving loony party,its not acceptable.

 

As far as I'm aware, phoning a social club and telling the secretary that you don't approve of the people who want to hire the venue isn't illegal - nor should it be. The meeting went ahead anyway so I'm not sure why you're so outraged really.

[Halibut]

And for those who've not heard the story before and who like a good laugh.......http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/article99134.ece

[Glamrock]

Considering the purges that happen to anyone that opposes him, Roger Robertson being the latest example of many, ordained perhaps goes some way to describing the way the party treat him. Democracy it certainly isn't.

 

 

 

Take a look at the speech from

, where Nick Griffin talks about Islam being primarily spread by rape.

 

Whilst the law decided it was insufficient to convict Nick Griffin, the speech was clearly based on a lie and was given to stir up hatred. Which says something about the inadequacy of the law, but also clearly illustrates why people should object to Nick Griffin speaking.

 

But the point I was making was about the right to protest not legal issues. The BNP condemned the muslim community for allowing Abu Qatada to speak, a legitimate argument except for the fact they did prevent him from speaking. Similarly the public should be applauded for condemning Nick Griffin's speeches and protesting about what he says.

I dont know hw to do multiple quotes so I will number my answers

1...primarily spread by rape.....I didnt interpret his words that way

2...the speech was clearly based on a lie...never read the koran but I may just grab a copy and have a look see

3. I dont know about stirring up hatred,if what he says about the contents of the Koran is true ,he is merely stating facts.if it is true why is stating the truth wrong

Re Abu Qatada and his preachings about killing etc,I didnt hear Griffin condoning the killings of muslims anywhere.

I wonder how you mind works when you can come on a forum and publicly defend the rights of someone who condones the killing and violent maiming of what could be your own countrymen and try to use the defense to make a point, and is also wanted worldwide on terrorism charges...unbelievable

[Wildcat]

I dont know hw to do multiple quotes so I will number my answers

1...primarily spread by rape.....I didnt interpret his words that way

2...the speech was clearly based on a lie...never read the koran but I may just grab a copy and have a look see

3. I dont know about stirring up hatred,if what he says about the contents of the Koran is true ,he is merely stating facts.if it is true why is stating the truth wrong

Re Abu Qatada and his preachings about killing etc,I didnt hear Griffin condoning the killings of muslims anywhere.

I wonder how you mind works when you can come on a forum and publicly defend the rights of someone who condones the killing and violent maiming of what could be your own countrymen and try to use the defense to make a point, and is also wanted worldwide on terrorism charges...unbelievable

 

1. I can't see how you can deny it. After a rant about sword arms the Koran and rape he goes on to say "Any woman they can take by force or guile is theirs. If they get a non-muslim girl pregnant then her community doesn't want her and the child generally grows up a muslim and that is the way that this wicked vicious faith has expanded from a handful of cranky lunatics about 1300 years ago till it is sweeping country after country before it all over the world"

 

2 and 3. Do read a copy of the Koran, but that is not the point. The point is Griffin has just summed up the expansion of Islam as being primarily to do with rape. The point I object to is not a discussion of the contents of the Koran but his blatantly false analysis of history.

 

Re Abu Qatada where have I defended his rights?

 

I have never publicly defended "the rights of someone who condones the killing and violent maiming of what could be your own countrymen and try to use the defense to make a point"

 

You won't win an argument by putting words in to my mouth, because there is no argument. Your attempt to do so says something about your integrity.

 

What I have said is that Nick Griffin should be condemned in exactly the same way that I say Abu Qatada should be condemned.

[boyfriday]

It'd be interesting to see if anyone from the BNP, or who's sympathetic towards them would take a crack at answering this one......from my recollection of the 'black DJ incident' the answer would not be hugely positive...

 

Well I was canvassing people to chaperone me to the last BNP meeting in Barnsley (when most of Barnsley was in Liverpool for the FA Cup match!), but no one was forthcoming...and I thought it was only my former mother in law who was embarrassed to be seen out with me in public!

 

Seriously though, I would have been quite happy to attend and have rational discussions with BNP members, I have nothing to fear..but it would only take a minority at such a meeting to upset the apple cart and turn it into something threatening.

 

I think when the day comes when all people can attend these meetings without fear of intimidation then they'll find their public presence can pass off without a problem.

[Glamrock]

1. I can't see how you can deny it. After a rant about sword arms the Koran and rape he goes on to say "Any woman they can take by force or guile is theirs. If they get a non-muslim girl pregnant then her community doesn't ant her and the child generally grows up a muslim and that is the way that this wicked vicious faith has expanded from a handful of cranky lunatics about 1300 years ago till it is sweeping country after country before it all over the world"

 

2 and 3. Do read a copy of the Koran, but that is not the point. The point is Griffin has just summed up the expansion of Islam as being primarily to do with rape. The point I object to is not a discussion of the contents of the Koran but his blatantly false analysis of history.

 

Re Abu Qatada where have I defended his rights?

 

I have never publicly defended "the rights of someone who condones the killing and violent maiming of what could be your own countrymen and try to use the defense to make a point"

 

You won't win an argument by putting words in to my mouth, because there is no argument.

 

I have said Nick Griffin should be condemned in exactly the same way that I say Abu Qatada should be condemned.

Abu Qatada is a known terrorist who advocates destruction,murder and terrorism,whatever his faults you cannot compare Griffin in the same light,in doing so you are saying that terrorists should be allowed freedom of speech as Griffin is,Griffin is a politician,whether you agree with him or not is irrelevant..He is not a terrorist and it is statements like you are making along with your obvious PC inflections that is helping fuel racial hatred.

I dont make an habit of prying into peoples private lives and you are quite free to tell me its none of my business,but I am trying very hard to understand why you are virtually defending the rights of a wanted terrorist, but are you a muslim by any chance? because if you are you are totally against what I have read on here about Islam being a peaceful religion.

[Wildcat]

Those responsible for this ought to be brought to book and made to face the law and be dealt with accordingly,my grand father fought and died for this country so we ALL have the right to live in a free society and not to have some kind of facist or marxist state telling us what we can and cant do.

 

The war your grandfather fought included us locking up Oswald Mosley. We didn't fight for the rights of Nick Griffin to speak without consequence.

[Glamrock]

Well I was canvassing people to chaperone me to the last BNP meeting in Barnsley (when most of Barnsley was in Liverpool for the FA Cup match!), but no one was forthcoming...and I thought it was only my former mother in law who was embarrassed to be seen out with me in public!

 

Seriously though, I would have been quite happy to attend and have rational discussions with BNP members, I have nothing to fear..but it would only take a minority at such a meeting to upset the apple cart and turn it into something threatening.

 

I think when the day comes when all people can attend these meetings without fear of intimidation then they'll find their public presence can pass off without a problem.

It may help the situation and controvesey surrounding the BNP if people like yourself did attend a BNP meeting to actually hear from the horses mouth,so to speak, what the BNP had to say instead reading the media hype,if they have nothing to hide they shouldnt be any trouble,as a neutral I would gladly accompany you..if it goes off I daresay we can both leg it

[Wildcat]

Abu Qatada is a known terrorist who advocates destruction,murder and terrorism,whatever his faults you cannot compare Griffin in the same light,in doing so you are saying that terrorists should be allowed freedom of speech as Griffin is,Griffin is a politician,whether you agree with him or not is irrelevant..He is not a terrorist and it is statements like you are making along with your obvious PC inflections that is helping fuel racial hatred.

I dont make an habit of prying into peoples private lives and you are quite free to tell me its none of my business,but I am trying very hard to understand why you are virtually defending the rights of a wanted terrorist, but are you a muslim by any chance? because if you are you are totally against what I have read on here about Islam being a peaceful religion.

 

Again you come back with the same accusation. Can you not read? I am not defending Abu Qatada's rights. Abu Qatada was rightly convicted for supporting terrorism. If anything I am saying the law he was convicted on is to weak.

 

Just as Nick Griffin was rightly convicted of making a re-write of history to exonerate Hitler's involvement in the killing of around 6 million Jews.

[Glamrock]

Again you come back with the same accusation. Can you not read? I am not defending Abu Qatada's rights. Abu Qatada was rightly convicted for supporting terrorism. If anything I am saying the law he was convicted on is to weak.

 

Just as Nick Griffin was rightly convicted of making a re-write of history to exonerate Hitler's involvement in the killing of around 6 million Jews.

Of course you are defending his rights by your comparison of him to Griffin,I repeat Griffin is not a terrorist and as suach should be allowed freedom of speech,Abu Qatada is a terrorist and therefore forfeits his rights,maybe you shouldnt have used an extremist such as Abu Qatada as a comparison,its like comparing a NF thug from the seventies to Adolf Hitler