Transforming Travel In The City Centre

[Irene Swaine 1,072]

8 hours ago, pfifes said:

Fargate is horrendous for pedestrians now with people being funnelled into narrow pathways between plastic barriers.  I just hope the end result is worth because it has looked a total mess for ages now.  And it wouldn’t surprise me if the whole lot is dug up again in 10 years time for the next ‘transformation’!!  I wonder how much money they spent on getting the Italian craftsmen to put the cobbles on Fargate in the 90’s?  All dug up now.

I totally agree. It's like a maze trying to navigate round Fargate. Poorly planned construction works, if they had done it in set blocks, they could have maintained a straight path. And yes, it's a waste to dig up those cobbles and all that investment from the 1990s just to replace them with more cobbles/paving. It's a vanity project to make the councillors feel good. The cobbles were never the problem with Fargate.

[Andy C 86]

1 hour ago, SheffieldForum said:

Here we go:

 

"The proposed works on Rockingham Street have not changed but construction was brought forward building on the success of Pound’s Park and tie in with Kangaroo Works both completed in December 2023. Works on Rockingham Street are due to be completed in the summer which will include the installation of new bus shelters with real-time information creating a ‘mini bus hub’ on the street.

 

"The current routes for buses into and across the city centre will remain in place. We only propose minor changes for buses accessing the city centre via West Street.

 

"Instead of using Carver Street – Division Street – Rockingham Street, we will change the junction of West Street and Rockingham Street to allow buses to turn into Rockingham Street to provide a quicker, more direct route. Rockingham Street, which is currently one-way when travelling from Division Street towards West Street, will be made two-way and a bus gate will be introduced between Devonshire Lane and Wellington Street, to allow access for buses travelling towards Charter Row only. We will retain access to all premises on Rockingham Street. These changes are planned for implementation in the summer."

Ah, exactly as per the consultation, it will have taken nearly 5 years to become reality though!

[RollingJ 2,048]

1 minute ago, Andy C said:

Ah, exactly as per the consultation, it will have taken nearly 5 years to become reality though!

See my posts above re: Arundel Gate.

[Irene Swaine 1,072]

6 hours ago, SheffieldForum said:

Use the connect bus to get around the centre?

 

The general thinking is to segregate cycle lanes from roads now. 
 

I walked down Charter Row just yesterday and didn’t see a problem with the cycle lanes v pedestrian footpath? I actually thought to myself how well designed it was with plenty of room for both and clearly designated!

I shouldn't have to use a bus to get around the city centre because the pavements are plagued with illegal electric bicycles. 

 

The pavements can barely accomodate crowds of people at busy times. The north eastern end of Ecclesall Road is a nightmare with half of a narrow pavement being designated for cyclists. It doesn't help that when you get to the underpass, the cycle lane changes to the opposite side! Charter Row cycle lane takes up far too much of the pavement, especially for a city centre street and said design leaving the bus stop space marooned at the other side has been criticised on safety grounds when used in other cities. The pavement should be a place of safety and priority for pedestrians. Period.

[Irene Swaine 1,072]

1 hour ago, SheffieldForum said:

Here we go:

 

"The proposed works on Rockingham Street have not changed but construction was brought forward building on the success of Pound’s Park and tie in with Kangaroo Works both completed in December 2023. Works on Rockingham Street are due to be completed in the summer which will include the installation of new bus shelters with real-time information creating a ‘mini bus hub’ on the street.

 

"The current routes for buses into and across the city centre will remain in place. We only propose minor changes for buses accessing the city centre via West Street.

 

"Instead of using Carver Street – Division Street – Rockingham Street, we will change the junction of West Street and Rockingham Street to allow buses to turn into Rockingham Street to provide a quicker, more direct route. Rockingham Street, which is currently one-way when travelling from Division Street towards West Street, will be made two-way and a bus gate will be introduced between Devonshire Lane and Wellington Street, to allow access for buses travelling towards Charter Row only. We will retain access to all premises on Rockingham Street. These changes are planned for implementation in the summer."

They obviously don't listen to their public. Everyone I have spoken to said the original route for buses along Leopold Street and Pinstone Street was better. The current route on Carver Street and Division Street has proven troublesome with traffic and partygoers on Friday & Saturday nights rendering the route unsafe and diversions needing to take place. Service 51 East bound now goes nowhere near High Street or Fargate as a result. Journey times on buses have increased, just like they did when they closed Gel Street and made the buses take the tight and congested turn down Durham Road. Rockingham Street again will be a tight turn for buses , especially two way and with north Rockingham Street traffic thrown in to the mix. And it still leaves Orchard Square, Fargate etc unserved eastbound. The council do what they want in their fantasy game of managing a city. It's a joke.

[Resident 1,195]

2 hours ago, RollingJ said:

C&P'd from a source I find much more accurate and trustworthy than SYMCA/SCC:

 

Leopold Street/Pinstone Street was closed permanently by SCC. Not ever going to re-open, same for Surrey Street.

SYMCA are not going to pay money themselves to remove the redundant shelters, disconnect them from the local power grid and remove them. To connect to the national grid per shelter is £22k alone. I believe its waiting on funding from SCC and works/plans have just been drawn up for new bus shelters on Arundel Gate, along with a new outbound bus gate on Furnival Gate.

As part of this works, the bus lane will be flipped on Arundel Gate, with 2 new shelters provided opposite the library and 1 new shelter provided at AG12. This is also related to the new shipping container development between the o2 Academy and Odeon. The current AG123 stop will be removed, with I believe the 75/76, 76A, 86, 97/98 moving to AG9 and the 20, 24/25 moving to the improved AG12 alongside existing 43/43A, 44, X17 services. This will keep Chesterfield Road services on one stop and also allow the Woodseats services to be better spaced with bus stops next to each other.

There will also be the new SC1/SC2 city centre shuttle routes that are fully funded by Sheffield City Council, operating around most parts of the city centre to link up interchange points et

SYMCA have been systematically removing bus shelters, ones already connected and in operation and replacing them with just a singular pole around the county for about 2 years now. 

 

Many of these removed  illuminated shelters have been in areas where there is a lack of street lighting or dark areas caused by other sources (trees, buildings etc) 

 

Coppard keeps saying he's trying to improve offerings for bus passengers, lying through his teeth whilst removing infrastructure and replacing it with inferior facilities. 

[RollingJ 2,048]

2 minutes ago, Resident said:

SYMCA have been systematically removing bus shelters, ones already connected and in operation and replacing them with just a singular pole around the county for about 2 years now. 

 

Many of these removed  illuminated shelters have been in areas where there is a lack of street lighting or dark areas caused by other sources (trees, buildings etc) 

 

Coppard keeps saying he's trying to improve offerings for bus passengers, lying through his teeth whilst removing infrastructure and replacing it with inferior facilities. 

I know all that very well, but he's a (not very good) politician, and we all know his ilk can call black white (and actually believe it), and expect us to be as stupid.

[Planner1 438]

1 hour ago, redruby said:

Since when did city centres need ‘refurbishing’ on a regular basis like a kitchen or bathroom 😂

Should we really be digging up and resurfacing city centre pedestrianised areas every 10-20 years or so?  Is that a good use of money and resources?  Is it environmentally friendly?

I know some people moaned about the cobbles.  I believe it was at least partly due to concerns about trips and falls (particularly for elderly/ disabled) and wheelchair access.  But the cobbles were put down regardless of the concerns and 30 years later they are dug up.  I believe at least in part for aforementioned reasons. And perhaps the cost of maintaining them.  Perhaps the moaners were correct after all then.

For as long as I can remember, areas of public realm in the city centre have been refreshed/refurbished on a fairly regular basis. The Moor is one example.

 

30+ years isn’t too bad a lifetime for public realm when you look at how frequently things get changed around. Nowadays people expect public areas to look good. It attracts investment.

 

Fargate is being regenerated to bring it up to date and attract more footfall, new businesses and investment. The paving and public realm is just one part of it.
 

 I think most would agree Fargate hasn’t  been doing too well in recent years. The council are using government funds specifically for regenerating high street areas. 
 

Would you rather they didn’t bid for this type of investment? I’d think they would be criticised if they didn’t, bearing in mind that other towns and cities nearby are regenerating their town and city centres utilising this funding.

[Planner1 438]

1 hour ago, Irene Swaine said:

I totally agree. It's like a maze trying to navigate round Fargate. Poorly planned construction works, if they had done it in set blocks, they could have maintained a straight path. And yes, it's a waste to dig up those cobbles and all that investment from the 1990s just to replace them with more cobbles/paving. It's a vanity project to make the councillors feel good. The cobbles were never the problem with Fargate.

So pushing the refreshments trolley on a train gives you a better insight into  planning highway works than those who do it for a living? Do give it a rest with your ill informed twaddle.

 

It’s not a vanity project at all. It’s utilising specific government funding to regenerate a city centre area that wasn’t doing too well. The paving and public realm is just one part of it and it is important to businesses and investors who are looking for somewhere to locate.

[redruby 280]

22 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

For as long as I can remember, areas of public realm in the city centre have been refreshed/refurbished on a fairly regular basis. The Moor is one example.

 

30+ years isn’t too bad a lifetime for public realm when you look at how frequently things get changed around. Nowadays people expect public areas to look good. It attracts investment.

 

Fargate is being regenerated to bring it up to date and attract more footfall, new businesses and investment. The paving and public realm is just one part of it.
 

 I think most would agree Fargate hasn’t  been doing too well in recent years. The council are using government funds specifically for regenerating high street areas. 
 

Would you rather they didn’t bid for this type of investment? I’d think they would be criticised if they didn’t, bearing in mind that other towns and cities nearby are regenerating their town and city centres utilising this funding.

No I don’t think pedestrianised areas in a city centre should be dug up and ‘refurbished’ on a regular basis.  Apart from the reasons given previously around cost and environmental concerns there is also the fact that people and businesses have to live with considerable mess and inconvenience for lengthy periods whilst the work is going on.  I’m sure most of us are prepared to put up with it  as a one off but it’s ridiculous to suggest that it needs ‘refurbishing’ regularly with a similar lifespan of a fitted kitchen!! 
I’m sure most people do want city centres to look good and attract investment but I would argue that this should done sustainability.  That is as a  high quality investment which can be maintained by future generations.  Not a relatively short term vanity project that will look shabby in 10 years and have to be ripped up and started again ad nauseum.  You surely can’t think that is sensible if purely from an environmental perspective?  It is very wasteful.

Edited March 8 by redruby

[AndrewC 308]

2 minutes ago, redruby said:

No I don’t think pedestrianised areas in a city centre should be dug up and ‘refurbished’ on a regular basis.  Apart from the reasons given previously around cost and environmental concerns there is also the fact that people and businesses have to live with considerable mess and inconvenience for lengthy periods whilst the work is going on.  I’m sure most of us are prepared to put up with it  as a one off but it’s ridiculous to suggest that it needs ‘refurbishing’ regularly with a similar lifespan of a fitted kitchen!! 
I’m sure most people do want city centres to look good and attract investment but I would argue that this should done sustainability.  That is as a  high quality investment which can be maintained by future generations.  Not a relatively short term vanity project that will look shabby in 10 years and have to be ripped up and started again ad nauseum.  You surely can’t think that is sensible if purely from an environmental perspective?  It is very wasteful.

 

Do you really consider every 30 years to be 'on a regular basis'?

[redruby 280]

14 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

So pushing the refreshments trolley on a train gives you a better insight into  planning highway works than those who do it for a living? Do give it a rest with your ill informed twaddle.

 

It’s not a vanity project at all. It’s utilising specific government funding to regenerate a city centre area that wasn’t doing too well. The paving and public realm is just one part of it and it is important to businesses and investors who are looking for somewhere to locate.

Perhaps if some of those who expressed concerns about the cobbles were listened to instead as being branded as ‘moaners’ and ‘ill informed’ we wouldn’t now be having them all dug up!!