Being TUPE'd, advice please!

[beansfeast 10]

Hi one and all

 

I have a current job situation that I would appreciate any advice anyone may have for me!

 

I am a permanent employee on a contract that my firm (A) has just lost to another firm (B).

Due to European law I am automatically transferred to firm B, unfortunately their base is at least an hour away from where I live and the pay I am on means travel costs really aren't feasable, I would also much rather stay with firm A.

 

What really bugs me is that my current firm A has several of the same positions open for contractors that I have already done previously. But, they say I cannot just transfer internally and can only apply to jobs advertised wether they be internally or externally. Putting these jobs out of my reach... the only way I can see of getting these jobs would be to quit and start again as a contractor!!

 

I am in a rush to have long term permanent employment as I am currently in the process of signing contracts on a new house and can't afford to even have the risk of being out of work (as per another thread I started yesterday).

 

Anyone have any ideas how I stand with respect to being transferred internally without waiting for jobs to be advertised etc?

 

(Sorry this is soooo long!)

[willman 10]

this is a similar problem for contract cleaners & security guards, unfortunately i think that as an employee on a particular job contract you become part of the contract. it is apparently to protect the employee when there is a takeover of contracts.

sorry but that probably doesn't help you at all.

[Strix 11]

My sister and Mr Strix have both been in this situation. If you want another job, you have to apply like everybody else, otherwise you move companies with your existing post.

[Cyclone 10]

firstly they can't just tell you that your new base is x, they are obliged to offer you terms that are in no way worse than your old t's&c's, and you aren't obliged to accept them either.

 

So it would be reasonable to ask for compensation for the extra time and money spent travelling.

 

As to applying to jobs internally, there are plenty of grey area's around it, but there are laws which are supposed to force companies to advertise jobs externally as well.

Of course there's nothing to stop you applying for as many jobs internal and external as you like whilst still being employed. You don't have to be unemployed to apply for a job.

 

This means you've still got a job for the purposes of sorting out your mortgage and as a fall back option, but you have the chance of getting a transfer (and if you're good at the job then your existing managers should snap you up).

[beansfeast 10]

That strikes me as just crap. You would've thought your current company would want to keep you (providing you do a good job!). Considering I'd also be being transferred to a rival company... it makes no sense. And I have never had any complaints about what I do!

 

 

 

[ Wrote this before seeing your reply Cyclone! lol, cheers]

[Cyclone 10]

Originally posted by Briano

That strikes me as just crap. You would've thought your current company would want to keep you (providing you do a good job!). Considering I'd also be being transferred to a rival company... it makes no sense. And I have never had any complaints about what I do!

 

 

 

[ Wrote this before seeing your reply Cyclone! lol, cheers]

 

the problem is for your original company that if they lost a big contract and kept the employee's they'd have loads of people with no work for them.

And secondly, no supplier would ever bid for a running contract if they knew that key staff wouldn't come with it, as it would be impossible to service. So once a company had a contract it would be impossible for them to loose it, which isn't good for competition.

 

They do often (we tupe people in, hence i have some understanding), offer people the chance to change roles and stay with the original organsation, but they can never offer enough for everyone on the contract.

[Strix 11]

Well as it's illegal to do anything but...

they have to interview all suitable candidates for any job, but if you really are an asset to the company, your application may be (unofficially) treated with more weight

 

Or they may have a vacancy coming up that will be created by the person they select for the job you've got your eye on, that they think you'll fit into nicely... but the same application process still applies.

 

Think how narked off you'd be if you weren't permitted to apply for a job because they were moving somebody into it to keep them in the company, although you believe you can do a better job.

[beansfeast 10]

I understand what you're saying Cyclone but there are only a few people who are in the same situation as me. We work as a small team doing part of a job in this part of the country.

There are another couple of hundred who work at the other end of the country which also happens to be where Firm B's base is. I'm sure these couple of hundred people are delighted because not a lot changes for them except they work in a different office.

 

We are the odd ones out so to speak, which is why I am so concerned with staying with firm A. I can just see us moving to firm B and then being made redundant because they want all the employee's in one place i.e on the other side of the country! A move over there is out of the question.

 

 

I also understand what you're saying Strix, that legally I am bound to apply for jobs advertised. However these jobs that I have previously done are being offered to contractors without being advertised. Therefore I would need to quit and join the agency before I could do a job that I already have experience off!!

I think at some point if nothing is done to help my situation at firm A, I may be writing to someone a lot higher up and making my position and thoughts quite clear.

If a firm is willing to replace experienced permanent staff with new contractors who would need training up, without attempting to bend the rules so they could keep the permanent staff, something is seriously wrong. The only thing I can think is that I am not seen as a 'valuable' employee... which also stinks because I've now been here 5 years and never been told the job i do is not good enough!

[Bourne 10]

The TUPE regs apply here by the sounds of it. These rules protect your T&Cs when transferring from firm A to B.

 

Is it in your T&Cs (written or in practice) to travel? If no then an hours drive may be an unfair change, making it unlawful.

 

You need proper advice, though, so consult the usual suspects. I found Citizens Advice very helpful when I was in the same position.

 

Good luck.

 

B

[D2J 10]

I don't know the Ins and Outs but my job recently went for Tupe till they find out that I was actually detached from another post so I wasn't offered TUPE in the end (nor would I have accepted itanyway)

 

My Housemate (LimpetBoy) on here has just recently gone through it all, Im sure he wouldn't mind if you sent him a PM

[Strix 11]

Having spoken to Mr Strix, he suggests that it's all a huge grey area, and the ins and outs are usually negotiated by the union.

 

Have you spoken to your union rep?

 

The terms of TUPE are a transfer of your conditions to the new company from day one. Unfortunately, on day 2 they can insist that if you wish to remain in employment you must sign a new contract agreeing to new terms and conditions. A rather nasty loophole

 

It sounds like the roles you are interested in within your campany are short-term or ongoing (unsecure) contracts, rather than permanent jobs. It's only necessary to advertise them if they are to become permanent.

 

Sorry I can't come up with anything that helps your case much