John Lewis

[Planner1 442]

15 hours ago, prince al said:

Which clown got it listed?

As I understand it, Historic England themselves conducted a review of department store buildings of this period to decide whether any merited listing.

 

The 20th Century Society had been campaigning for many years to have this one listed.

[Mr Bloke 1,445]

Hmmm...

OK, here's a bit of an 'off the wall' idea.

We're always complaining how rubbish Sheffield is, and that we don't have anything 'different' that anyone would want to see.

Well instead of squabbling about wanting the building knocked down, to no doubt be replaced by yet another anonymous office block like any other office block in any other city...
... why aren't we taking advantage of this unique opportunity?

While other cities are pulling down their bits of history, why don't we, just for once, take the iniative and NOT follow others?

I'm sure there are loads of people with loads of imaginative ideas of what uses the building could have.

Yep! It'll not be a 'quick fix' to 'renovate' the building and it'll cost lots of money...
... but it could also be an investment and something that may benefit Sheffield for 'generations'.

If it's possible to get some 'investors' to build an office block, why wouldn't it be possible to get backers to invest in a totally unique project?

More importantly, it'll take someone with a bit of courage and vision to pop their head above the trenches and support a well thought through idea...
... but that's not going to be the easy option, and is going to involve a lot of hard work and guts.

It needs to be lead by someone who has imagination, leadership skills and drive!

And that's where this idea falls down - where in SCC is there such an individual?

[HeHasRisen 3,412]

If nobody wants to invest in a run down listed building full of asbestos, thats hardly the fault of the local authority isnt it? And the minute the local authority spend the money to do so, people would be straight on here to moan what a waste of money it is, so they cant really win.  Think calling it a "historic" building is a bit of a stretch too tbh.

 

They have been very clear that all potential plans involve the building coming down (or most of it far beyond what the listing allows), you cant polish a turd, whoever listed it is an irresponsible moron.

Edited August 18, 2022 by HeHasRisen

[HeHasRisen 3,412]

7 minutes ago, Mr Bloke said:

 

While other cities are pulling down their bits of history

 

https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/news/leeds-news/leeds-house-fraser-store-set-24262259

 

Only 5 objections for a department store that has stood since the 1950s on the major shopping street in Leeds. Much more sensible.

Edited August 18, 2022 by HeHasRisen

[Mr Bloke 1,445]

14 minutes ago, HeHasRisen said:

If nobody wants to invest in a run down listed building full of asbestos, thats hardly the fault of the local authority isnt it? And the minute the local authority spend the money to do so, people would be straight on here to moan what a waste of money it is, so they cant really win.  Think calling it a "historic" building is a bit of a stretch too tbh.

 

They have been very clear that all potential plans involve the building coming down (or most of it far beyond what the listing allows), you cant polish a turd, whoever listed it is an irresponsible moron.

Hmmm...

And this is the sort of blinkered response I was expecting!

Think about it - a 'historic building' is not 'historic' at the time it's built.

People only moan because they're fed up with the same old people doing the same old things and perhaps not surprisingly...
... producing the same old results!

And whoever listed the building is only thought to be an 'irresponsible moron' by those who don't like the idea...

[Mr Bloke 1,445]

15 minutes ago, HeHasRisen said:

https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/news/leeds-news/leeds-house-fraser-store-set-24262259

 

Only 5 objections for a department store that has stood since the 1950s on the major shopping street in Leeds. Much more sensible.

Hmmm...

But doesn't that just prove my point?

In years to come, when all the large department stores have disappeared...

... Sheffield would have a 'tourist attraction' that many cities will be thinking maybe they should have also kept!

[HeHasRisen 3,412]

25 minutes ago, Mr Bloke said:

 

And whoever listed the building is only thought to be an 'irresponsible moron' by those who don't like the idea...

Literally almost everyone else.  Be honest, you only agree with the listing to be contrary because the Council dont agree The listing procedure in this country isnt fit for purpose.

 

What is so special about a decaying ex-department store built in the (I think) 1960s? Absolutely nothing.  Something something Cole Brothers something something.

Edited August 18, 2022 by HeHasRisen

[Mr Bloke 1,445]

16 minutes ago, HeHasRisen said:

Literally almost everyone else.  Be honest, you only agree with the listing to be contrary because the Council dont agree The listing procedure in this country isnt fit for purpose.

 

What is so special about a decaying ex-department store built in the (I think) 1960s? Absolutely nothing.  Something something Cole Brothers something something.

Hmmm...

I'm not saying that I agree with the listing...
... just that SCC have now been presented with a golden opportunity to 're-think' the potential benefits there may be in keeping the building.

Ask yourself why the council don't agree - it's because it's going to cost them us money...
... and them a bit lot of hassle!

They seem to think that a few shipping containers will get people back into Sheffield (although that seemingly 'simple' project is probably a good indication why they feel ill-equipped to handle anything a bit more 'substantial')
... so why wouldn't a renovated department store, one of a dwindling number left in the country?

And by 'renovating' it, I don't necessarily mean fully returning it to it's original purpose...

[HeHasRisen 3,412]

Listing a building like this presents a "golden opportunity"?

 

Really dont think many are going to agree with you mate, but keep smoking whatever it is you are on.  Kommune mk 2 isnt going to bail them out this time.

Edited August 18, 2022 by HeHasRisen

[Mr Bloke 1,445]

6 minutes ago, HeHasRisen said:

Listing a building like this presents a "golden opportunity"?

 

Really dont think many are going to agree with you mate, but keep smoking whatever it is you are on.

Hmmm...

Yep - it makes SCC revisit their earlier 'easy option' of just getting rid!

Anyway, I can see you've now run out of any valid points you may have had...

... so I think it's time for me to leave until someone with some fresh ideas pops up!

[HeHasRisen 3,412]

I am just surprised you want them to potentially spend a shed load of money (money they dont have btw, have you seen the defecit figures?) to get round the listing when the easy (and cheaper) option is for it not to be listed in the first place by an absolute cretin, it contradicts everything you have ever posted about the esteemed local authority.

Edited August 18, 2022 by HeHasRisen

[AndrewC 310]

I actually don't mind a lot of the building - I don't think there's anything wrong with the Barker's Pool frontage at all, that a good clean and fresh windows wouldn't solve, but I don't agree with the listing, as it's going to massively stifle the involvement of private developers who - after all - are the ones with the money to do anything with it, whether retaining part/all of the building or starting anew.

 

Some of the bidders put forward plans that did retain some of the existing structure but even they have apparently been put off by the listing itself, and the general feeling that there is mismanagement of the whole process by the council since this listing has moved the goalposts deep into the bidding process (not entirely the councils fault of course, but hey-ho).

 

Also, even if some proposals intended to retain some or all of the shop section, virtually none of them had any interest in working with the car park section. It's out-of-date as a car park, it's facades and ground level is completely at odds now with the old and new buildings around it which all have or will have active frontages, and bringing cars in to the city via that route is also feeling more outdated the more other areas around there become pedestrianised.

 

There are a host of new car parks which are modern and in much better locations and more easily accessible. It's really not needed or suitable, and it's listing is a cause for concern. I imagine the council/developers will still try and get it (the car park) demolished - it's just that process becomes much more difficult now.