Improving Economic Growth

[El Cid 221]

It has just been stated on radio four that the UK has the lowest birthrate in Western Europe, that will be the excuse for the 300,000+ immigration, from Labour and the Tories.

[ads36 219]

This should surprise no-one at all - who can afford kids these days?

[despritdan 241]

3 hours ago, El Cid said:

If you reduce VAT, the Government will have less money for the NHS, so the waiting list will increase!

I've made this point countless times already; since Thatcher came to power the Tories have been manipulating the tax system to ensure those on the highest salaries pay less whilst those on the lowest salaries pay more. They've reduced income tax, which being progressive is the fairest form of tax from 33% to 20%. This means the more you earn, the better off you are. At the same time, they've increased VAT, which being regressive, is the unfairest form of tax from 8% to 20% which means the lower your income, the more of that income goes in VAT. I would like the incoming Labour government to reverse those changes by lowering VAT whilst increasing income tax. The intake would be the same or even a bit higher but the burden would be transferred back to those on the highest incomes as it used to be.

[hackey lad 3,991]

On 25/03/2024 at 15:23, despritdan said:

I've made this point countless times already; since Thatcher came to power the Tories have been manipulating the tax system to ensure those on the highest salaries pay less whilst those on the lowest salaries pay more. They've reduced income tax, which being progressive is the fairest form of tax from 33% to 20%. This means the more you earn, the better off you are. At the same time, they've increased VAT, which being regressive, is the unfairest form of tax from 8% to 20% which means the lower your income, the more of that income goes in VAT. I would like the incoming Labour government to reverse those changes by lowering VAT whilst increasing income tax. The intake would be the same or even a bit higher but the burden would be transferred back to those on the highest incomes as it used to be.

What did Labour do in their time since Mrs Thatcher  ? 

[Anna B 1,417]

1 hour ago, hackey lad said:

What did Labour do in their time since Mrs Thatcher  ? 

Not a lot. Tony 'we're all middle class now' Blair and his New Labour party, was the start of the demise of socialist Labour and representation for the working class. He did nothing to counter Thatcher's policies and embraced the Capitalist extremism of the Tory party. 

He was however a young charismatic Leader, and popular with the public and the party. He was a 'winner' and so allowed to discard the old values of the Labour party which he deemed to be old fashioned and unnecessary. He ploughed ahead with Free Market Economics, and  privatisation thinly disguised with spin and obfuscatio, such as PFI and investment bank funding for major projects, both of which have come back to bite us. He also joined Bush in his expensive proxy war against Sadam Hussein.

 

We are now seeing the results of 40+ uninterupted years of Thatcherism and the decline of true democracy. We now virtually have a one party system with little to differentiate between Tory and Labour parties. Free Market Economics has morphed into Neoliberalism from which there is no way back, and unfortunately we are no longer on the winning team. Hence our general decline and fall into extremism with the small number of super rich and powerful controlling vast sums of money at one end, and the encroaching poverty creeping up the social scale at the other. 

[ECCOnoob 1,051]

Just now, Anna B said:

Not a lot. Tony 'we're all middle class now' Blair and his New Labour party, was the start of the demise of socialist Labour and representation for the working class. He did nothing to counter Thatcher's policies and embraced the Capitalist extremism of the Tory party. 

He was however a young charismatic Leader, and popular with the public and the party. He was a 'winner' and so allowed to discard the old values of the Labour party which he deemed to be old fashioned and unnecessary. He ploughed ahead with Free Market Economics, and  privatisation thinly disguised with spin and obfuscatio, such as PFI and investment bank funding for major projects, both of which have come back to bite us. He also joined Bush in his expensive proxy war against Sadam Hussein.

 

We are now seeing the results of 40+ uninterupted years of Thatcherism and the decline of true democracy. We now virtually have a one party system with little to differentiate between Tory and Labour parties. Free Market Economics has morphed into Neoliberalism from which there is no way back, and unfortunately we are no longer on the winning team. Hence our general decline and fall into extremism with the small number of super rich and powerful controlling vast sums of money at one end, and the encroaching poverty creeping up the social scale at the other. 

Wow.  All the buzzwords in one load of doom monger waffle.  I need to start a bingo card.  

 

You really are not going to give up your delusion that a 'socialist Labour' is what people want and will solve all the problems.

 

The People have spoken many times and they clearly do not want what your lot are selling.

 

Oh and for the record, voter preference for Conservatives over any form of Labour has been going on a lot longer than simply post 1980s .

Go wise up on your political history and you will see how many more conservative prime ministers have been in power over Labour.   Does that not tell you something? 

[hackey lad 3,991]

14 minutes ago, Anna B said:

Not a lot. Tony 'we're all middle class now' Blair and his New Labour party, was the start of the demise of socialist Labour and representation for the working class. He did nothing to counter Thatcher's policies and embraced the Capitalist extremism of the Tory party. 

He was however a young charismatic Leader, and popular with the public and the party. He was a 'winner' and so allowed to discard the old values of the Labour party which he deemed to be old fashioned and unnecessary. He ploughed ahead with Free Market Economics, and  privatisation thinly disguised with spin and obfuscatio, such as PFI and investment bank funding for major projects, both of which have come back to bite us. He also joined Bush in his expensive proxy war against Sadam Hussein.

 

We are now seeing the results of 40+ uninterupted years of Thatcherism and the decline of true democracy. We now virtually have a one party system with little to differentiate between Tory and Labour parties. Free Market Economics has morphed into Neoliberalism from which there is no way back, and unfortunately we are no longer on the winning team. Hence our general decline and fall into extremism with the small number of super rich and powerful controlling vast sums of money at one end, and the encroaching poverty creeping up the social scale at the other. 

I’m sure you’ve posted that before. 

[El Cid 221]

On 25/03/2024 at 15:23, despritdan said:

I've made this point countless times already; since Thatcher came to power the Tories have been manipulating the tax system to ensure those on the highest salaries pay less whilst those on the lowest salaries pay more. They've reduced income tax, which being progressive is the fairest form of tax from 33% to 20%. This means the more you earn, the better off you are. At the same time, they've increased VAT, which being regressive, is the unfairest form of tax from 8% to 20% which means the lower your income, the more of that income goes in VAT. I would like the incoming Labour government to reverse those changes by lowering VAT whilst increasing income tax. The intake would be the same or even a bit higher but the burden would be transferred back to those on the highest incomes as it used to be.

Income tax, the top rate is set at 45%

The rich can pay less tax, because they dont pay income tax, they pay lower rates in capital gains tax.

Its not easy to tax the rich, but we can do better, Labour will do better, the Tories are looking after the people that fund their party.

If we taxed domestic high energy use ate 20%, the richer households with large houses would pay more.

[Anna B 1,417]

10 hours ago, El Cid said:

Income tax, the top rate is set at 45%

The rich can pay less tax, because they dont pay income tax, they pay lower rates in capital gains tax.

Its not easy to tax the rich, but we can do better, Labour will do better, the Tories are looking after the people that fund their party.

If we taxed domestic high energy use ate 20%, the richer households with large houses would pay more.

I hope you're right, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

If the rich paid all their tax at 30% like the rest of us all our financial problems would be solved. 

But of course they won't. They prefer the system as it is,  where they can exploit the many tax loopholes and avoid most of the tax they owe alltogether.