Attic Room Conversion, Without Regulations

[IvyMay 0]

Hiya - I tried to do a little search on this forum but couldnt find it easily - apologies if this has been asked before. In the midst if trying to complete a purchase a three bed house, whereby room 3 is converted attic. Unclear when the conversion was done, but there is some evidence of other changes in 2013, and a newer-ish roof which might back up this estimate. Unlikely to be an original feature. Unfortunately, the current owners didn't make these changes, and bought the place knowing there were no regs. This has now become my own knowledge fairly late on the buying process. Is this something that is common in Sheffield? Is it cause for serious concern - or par for the course with old properties? I am looking to use this as an office/spare room, so ideally want a safe and functional room, and also don't want to get totally screwed if and when we resell on one day. Any thoughts..? 

[Jim Hardie 533]

13 minutes ago, IvyMay said:

Hiya - I tried to do a little search on this forum but couldnt find it easily - apologies if this has been asked before. In the midst if trying to complete a purchase a three bed house, whereby room 3 is converted attic. Unclear when the conversion was done, but there is some evidence of other changes in 2013, and a newer-ish roof which might back up this estimate. Unlikely to be an original feature. Unfortunately, the current owners didn't make these changes, and bought the place knowing there were no regs. This has now become my own knowledge fairly late on the buying process. Is this something that is common in Sheffield? Is it cause for serious concern - or par for the course with old properties? I am looking to use this as an office/spare room, so ideally want a safe and functional room, and also don't want to get totally screwed if and when we resell on one day. Any thoughts..? 

I don’t know if this is relevant as the house was a new build, but when I purchased it seven years later the vendor told me that originally the roof space was built as a second floor bedroom.
The staircase went all the way up to the second floor which has two central heating radiators and a dormer window. This arrangement couldn’t have been compliant with the approved plans as Building Control made them take out the last flight because the stairs were not within a protected shaft and the travel distance for escape was too great.
They were given no choice but to access the loft by a pull-down stair from a trap door in one of the first floor bedrooms.

[littlebasher 11]

Judging by the number of 'Attic rooms for storage' which are clearly used as bedrooms in Estate Agents descriptions, it seems to be a way of getting it done while bypassing all the building regs.

[Arthur Ritus 30]

Yes very common, some of the old terraced houses originally had stairs and end with window or small apexed dormers 120 years ago but still not good enough to be classed as a bedroom. 

As far as fire safety you can work that out yourself, your in attic with fire bellow coming up the stairs, what do you do? Many people are very blase about it costing peoples lives, should always say what if rather than probably won't happen.

They usually aren't very well insulated, freezing cold in winter and red hot in summer, a large radiator with a thermostatic valve helps, you get a lot of heat rising, a door at the bottom of the stairs helps with that. Recommend air con, I have a portable one which heats /cools and dehumidifies, we dry washing up there with it on.

Another common problem is the joist usually aren't beefy enough, it's not that you are going to go through just the greater amount of movement tends to crack plastered ceilings below, a suspended ceiling can eliminate that.

[IvyMay 0]

21 minutes ago, Arthur Ritus said:

Yes very common, some of the old terraced houses originally had stairs and end with window or small apexed dormers 120 years ago but still not good enough to be classed as a bedroom. 

As far as fire safety you can work that out yourself, your in attic with fire bellow coming up the stairs, what do you do? Many people are very blase about it costing peoples lives, should always say what if rather than probably won't happen.

They usually aren't very well insulated, freezing cold in winter and red hot in summer, a large radiator with a thermostatic valve helps, you get a lot of heat rising, a door at the bottom of the stairs helps with that. Recommend air con, I have a portable one which heats /cools and dehumidifies, we dry washing up there with it on.

Another common problem is the joist usually aren't beefy enough, it's not that you are going to go through just the greater amount of movement tends to crack plastered ceilings below, a suspended ceiling can eliminate that.

That's really helpful thanks! I guess I was a bit worried about the joists somehow meaning the floor might come crashing down on us! Fire safety looks fairly straightforward to make safe, which is good... 

[Jeffrey Shaw 90]

On 17/05/2023 at 10:28, IvyMay said:

Hiya - I tried to do a little search on this forum but couldnt find it easily - apologies if this has been asked before. In the midst if trying to complete a purchase a three bed house, whereby room 3 is converted attic. Unclear when the conversion was done, but there is some evidence of other changes in 2013, and a newer-ish roof which might back up this estimate. Unlikely to be an original feature. Unfortunately, the current owners didn't make these changes, and bought the place knowing there were no regs. This has now become my own knowledge fairly late on the buying process. Is this something that is common in Sheffield? Is it cause for serious concern - or par for the course with old properties? I am looking to use this as an office/spare room, so ideally want a safe and functional room, and also don't want to get totally screwed if and when we resell on one day. Any thoughts..? 

First. consult your Chartered Surveyor and/or Architect.

If you proceed to complete, ensure that your Solicitor obtains appropriate Indemnity Insurance Policy cover.

[nightrider 13]

On 17/05/2023 at 10:28, IvyMay said:

Hiya - I tried to do a little search on this forum but couldnt find it easily - apologies if this has been asked before. In the midst if trying to complete a purchase a three bed house, whereby room 3 is converted attic. Unclear when the conversion was done, but there is some evidence of other changes in 2013, and a newer-ish roof which might back up this estimate. Unlikely to be an original feature. Unfortunately, the current owners didn't make these changes, and bought the place knowing there were no regs. This has now become my own knowledge fairly late on the buying process. Is this something that is common in Sheffield? Is it cause for serious concern - or par for the course with old properties? I am looking to use this as an office/spare room, so ideally want a safe and functional room, and also don't want to get totally screwed if and when we resell on one day. Any thoughts..? 

Where is the house? Many terraced houses in Walkley have original attic rooms. 
 

The new roof might just be a replacement - they don’t last forever.

 

how old is the house?

[IvyMay 0]

On 24/05/2023 at 20:40, nightrider said:

Where is the house? Many terraced houses in Walkley have original attic rooms. 
 

The new roof might just be a replacement - they don’t last forever.

 

how old is the house?

Crookes/walkey side, yes. Early 1900. I did ask this- surveyor felt was more likely to be an addition, rather than original attic. True re: roof, tho also told this replacement should also have regs. Wondering if a previous owner was quite keen on doing their own renovations..

[mafya 250]

53 minutes ago, IvyMay said:

Crookes/walkey side, yes. Early 1900. I did ask this- surveyor felt was more likely to be an addition, rather than original attic. True re: roof, tho also told this replacement should also have regs. Wondering if a previous owner was quite keen on doing their own renovations..

Is the house registered with the land registry as a 2 bedroom or a 3 bedroom house?

if it’s registered as a 3 bedroom end house then the surveyor is being a jobsworth and the house did originally have 3 bedrooms when built.

If it’s registered as a 2 bedroom end house then the attic room has been converted and building regs will be an issue.

[nightrider 13]

12 hours ago, IvyMay said:

Crookes/walkey side, yes. Early 1900. I did ask this- surveyor felt was more likely to be an addition, rather than original attic. True re: roof, tho also told this replacement should also have regs. Wondering if a previous owner was quite keen on doing their own renovations..

is surveyor local? If not, they won't know anything about what was built in Walkley. When I sold mine I was warned by the estate agent about this and told to make sure the estate agent pushes back on any buyer who claims the attic had been converted.

 

One thing you can check is whether on the same road all the terraced houses have an attic room. If they do, that's a sign they are all likely original.

11 hours ago, mafya said:

Is the house registered with the land registry as a 2 bedroom or a 3 bedroom house?

if it’s registered as a 3 bedroom end house then the surveyor is being a jobsworth and the house did originally have 3 bedrooms when built.

If it’s registered as a 2 bedroom end house then the attic room has been converted and building regs will be an issue.

That's not true. The house I sold was a 2 bedroom house - bedroom 2 was in the attic and was original. On the middle floor there 3 rooms - a bedroom, a bathroom and a room that was too small to call it a bedroom legally.

Edited May 26, 2023 by nightrider

[IvyMay 0]

11 hours ago, nightrider said:

is surveyor local? If not, they won't know anything about what was built in Walkley. When I sold mine I was warned by the estate agent about this and told to make sure the estate agent pushes back on any buyer who claims the attic had been converted.

 

One thing you can check is whether on the same road all the terraced houses have an attic room. If they do, that's a sign they are all likely original.

That's not true. The house I sold was a 2 bedroom house - bedroom 2 was in the attic and was original. On the middle floor there 3 rooms - a bedroom, a bathroom and a room that was too small to call it a bedroom legally.

Thanks these were helpful thought. The surveyor was a local one, yes. Ive looked at a few on the road- while some have had attic spaces, these were more crawl spaces than a room. So I'm more inclined to believe it would have been an addition later, though it may well have been a long while ago...

On 24/05/2023 at 20:40, nightrider said:

Where is the house? Many terraced houses in Walkley have original attic rooms. 
 

The new roof might just be a replacement - they don’t last forever.

 

how old is the house?

Crookes/walkey side, yes. Early 1900. I did ask this- surveyor felt was more likely to be an addition, rather than original attic. True re: roof, tho also told this replacement should also have regs. Wondering if a previous owner was quite keen on doing their own renovations..

23 hours ago, mafya said:

Is the house registered with the land registry as a 2 bedroom or a 3 bedroom house?

if it’s registered as a 3 bedroom end house then the surveyor is being a jobsworth and the house did originally have 3 bedrooms when built.

If it’s registered as a 2 bedroom end house then the attic room has been converted and building regs will be an issue.

Interesting! I had a look on land registry site, but it didn't seem to have any data on how many BRs. A good thought though...

Edited May 26, 2023 by IvyMay

[Jeffrey Shaw 90]

On 26/05/2023 at 23:20, IvyMay said:

Interesting! I had a look on land registry site, but it didn't seem to have any data on how many BRs. A good thought though...

HMLR does not record anything about the internal layout of properties (other than flats). Ignore post #09.