£200 shopping vouchers for women who breast feed.

[harvey19 541]

It can be for several reasons. For some women it can be extremely painful.

It can also take up to 24 hours for the milk to replenish in some women. For this reason some women just don't have the patience to take it easy by allowing this natural process to take place, especially in today's busy world and if women have to return to work.

 

A bribe doesn't change any of this.

I fully appreciate there are good reasons why some women do not breastfeed but find it incomprehensible why a bribe is necessary to encourage those who are able to when they are aware of the benefits.

It is a sad day when we as a society have to bribe a mother to do what is best for their child.

[aliceBB 10]

It is a sad day when we as a society have to bribe a mother to do what is best for their child.

 

I take your point, but the UK is almost bottom of the league internationally when it comes to breastfeeding - it simply isn't part of the culture for many families. The reasons why are many and complex, but anything that can be done to reverse the prevailing attitude that breasts are the preserve of p3 and that breastfeeding is a weird, fringe activity has to be encouraged.

 

Its no different from offering free gym membership on the NHS to people who need to lose weight or free nursery places for toddlers. You are encouraging people to lead a healthier lifestyle/give their kids the best start.

 

In any case, breastfeeding mother do need extra calories, ie more food. Poorer bottle-feeding mothers qualify for free formula, so why shouldn't breastfeeding mothers get some help too?

Edited November 12, 2013 by aliceBB

[harvey19 541]

I take your point, but the UK is almost bottom of the league internationally when it comes to breastfeeding - it simply isn't part of the culture for many families. The reasons why are many and complex, but anything that can be done to reverse the prevailing attitude that breasts are the preserve of p3 and that breastfeeding is a weird, fringe activity has to be encouraged.

 

Its no different from offering free gym membership on the NHS to people who need to lose weight or free nursery places for toddlers. You are encouraging people to lead a healthier lifestyle/give their kids the best start.

 

In any case, breastfeeding mother do need extra calories, ie more food. Poorer bottle-feeding mothers qualify for free formula, so why shouldn't breastfeeding mothers get some help too?

 

I still fail to see why able mothers do not breastfeed when they aware of the benefits.

What are the many and complex reasons for not doing so when the mother is capable ?

Who considers breast feeding is a weird and fringe activity ?

I have never come across these views.

[strongsteve 10]

Indeed. Only women with nice perky tits should breast feed, right.

 

 

 

 

totally agree

[aliceBB 10]

I still fail to see why able mothers do not breastfeed when they aware of the benefits.

What are the many and complex reasons for not doing so when the mother is capable ?

Who considers breast feeding is a weird and fringe activity ?

I have never come across these views.

 

Believe me, I was a breastfeeding counsellor for 20 years and there are more people who think it's more normal to bottlefeed than to breastfeed. Only 1% of UK babies are exclusively breastfed for 6 months, which is the WHO recommmendation for optimal health benefits.

 

The many and complex reasons why women don't breastfeed? I wrote a thesis on this and it's hard to condense it into a few lines! But the main reasons are:

 

1 Not part of the culture in the mother's family (dating back to 60s when women were told bottle feeding was 'scientific' and 'better') - so no role models or encouragement to breastfeed. If a woman's own mother or mother in law bottle-fed, they often undermine her attempts to breastfeed with negative comments/attitudes (Are you sure he's getting enough?' 'I'd top him up with a bottle, if I were you' etc.)

 

2 Not part of the culture in society generally. As long as breastfeeding mothers are expected to feed in toilets or out of sight, we know we have a problem. As long as womens' breasts are seen in the media primarily as sex objects, ditto.

 

3 Fear of failure. Over 99% of women are physically capable of successfully feeding their babies, but only about 50% think they can. Of that 50%, many fear it will be painful, tiring etc., or that they won't have enough milk. None of these things are inevitable or even likely, but if people think they are, it undermines confidence and makes breastfeeding success less likely.

 

4 Attitude of partner is crucial to the mother's success or failure. Jealousy on father's part (of baby's physical bond with mother) is more common than you'd think. If father sees woman's breasts as 'his' territory, conflict arises and breastfeeding is made more difficult

 

5 Lack of useful help/support while establishing breastfeeding and if problems do arise later (mothers tend to leave hospital very early these days), community midwife support for breastfeeding is still patchy. Most new mothers do not know about NCT breastfeeding counsellors (trained, experienced and free!)

 

6 The need (whether financial or social) for the mother to go back to full time work when baby is still very young - not necessarily the death knell to breastfeeding, but often makes it difficult/impossible

 

7 (Bit contentious this one) The over-sanitising of natural bodily functions. Over the 20 years in which I worked with mothers, the idea that b/feeding was 'animal' and even 'disgusting' was expressed with increasing frequency. To breastfeed successfully you have to accept that another little life is physically dependent on your body, with all the associated flowing of juices, etc. Some women find that psychologically uncomfortable/repellent and prefer the sterilisable certainty of glass/plastic and powdered milk. It seems to be associated with the need to have more than one shower per day, as is increasingly the norm.

 

8 The fact that the formula milk companies' advertising/promotion budget is many, many times that of the NHS's budget for promoting breastfeeding.

 

9 Health professionals are unwilling to educate parents about the disadvantages/health risks of bottle feeding, for fear of making people who bottle feed, feel guilty about it. So people get the impression it is an equal choice, when nutritionally, it is not.

Edited November 12, 2013 by aliceBB

[Epic Fail 10]

Believe me, I was a breastfeeding counsellor for 20 years and there are more people who think it's more normal to bottlefeed than to breastfeed. Only 1% of UK babies are exclusively breastfed for 6 months, which is the WHO recommmendation for optimal health benefits.

 

The many and complex reasons why women don't breastfeed? I wrote a thesis on this and it's hard to condense it into a few lines! But the main reasons are:

 

1 Not part of the culture in the mother's family (dating back to 60s when women were told bottle feeding was 'scientific' and 'better') - so no role models or encouragement to breastfeed. If a woman's own mother or mother in law bottle-fed, they often undermine her attempts to breastfeed with negative comments/attitudes (Are you sure he's getting enough?' 'I'd top him up with a bottle, if I were you' etc.)

 

2 Not part of the culture in society generally. As long as breastfeeding mothers are expected to feed in toilets or out of sight, we know we have a problem. As long as womens' breasts are seen in the media primarily as sex objects, ditto.

 

3 Fear of failure. Over 99% of women are physically capable of successfully feeding their babies, but only about 50% think they can. Of that 50%, many fear it will be painful, tiring etc., or that they won't have enough milk. None of these things are inevitable or even likely, but if people think they are, it undermines confidence and makes breastfeeding success less likely.

 

4 Attitude of partner is crucial to the mother's success or failure. Jealousy on father's part (of baby's physical bond with mother) is more common than you'd think. If father sees woman's breasts as 'his' territory, conflict arises and breastfeeding is made more difficult

 

5 Lack of useful help/support while establishing breastfeeding and if problems do arise later (mothers tend to leave hospital very early these days), community midwife support for breastfeeding is still patchy. Most new mothers do not know about NCT breastfeeding counsellors (trained, experienced and free!)

 

6 The need (whether financial or social) for the mother to go back to full time work when baby is still very young - not necessarily the death knell to breastfeeding, but often makes it difficult/impossible

 

7 (Bit contentious this one) The over-sanitising of natural bodily functions. Over the 20 years in which I worked with mothers, the idea that b/feeding was 'animal' and even 'disgusting' was expressed with increasing frequency. To breastfeed successfully you have to accept that another little life is physically dependent on your body, with all the associated flowing of juices, etc. Some women find that psychologically uncomfortable/repellent and prefer the sterilisable certainty of glass/plastic and powdered milk. It seems to be associated with the need to have more than one shower per day, as is increasingly the norm.

 

8 The fact that the formula milk companies' advertising/promotion budget is many, many times that of the NHS's budget for promoting breastfeeding.

 

9 Health professionals are unwilling to educate parents about the disadvantages/health risks of bottle feeding, for fear of making people who bottle feed, feel guilty about it. So people get the impression it is an equal choice, when nutritionally, it is not.

 

Here we go...

[aliceBB 10]

Here we go...

 

Meaning..?

 

Which of these do you dispute and why?

[strongsteve 10]

I think it was the job title Breastfeeding Councillor that had Epic Fail foaming at the mouth.

 

It all sounds like the nanny state with well paid non jobs, such as councellor for going to the toilet for the over 25s

[Bubble3082 10]

I'm so glad that these comments take into account the fact that some women can't actually breastfeed. When I had my daughter, I was absolutely CRUSHED when I couldn't feed her myself because of essential medication I had to take. I went on parenting forums looking for support, but even before I posted (as I was looking through previous threads) it seemed women were jumping over themselves to declare that breast was best, they wouldn't dream of feeding their newborn anything from a four legged animal, that bottle feeding mothers were subjecting their children to possible health problems, that the bond between mother and child is compromised, etc. That, together with post pregnancy hormones, devastated me. I know breast is best, but it seems many are eager to make generalised statements that can really hurt, especially when the choice is taken away from you. So thank you to everyone who has understood not everyone can actually do it.

Edited November 12, 2013 by Bubble3082

[sunshiner 10]

I breast fed cuz I wanted too it helped bon mummy and baby this is silly

[missflirtuk 10]

As a measure to save the NHS money in the long term it is an excellent idea.

 

Breastfed babies are healthier on average than bottle-fed infants and suffer less from asthma, ezcema, and allergic diseases generally. They are more naturally immune to infectious diseases such as measles, mumps, whooping cough and chicken pox. Bottle fed infants are twelve times as likely to be admitted to hospital with gastroenteritis (not because of poor bottle cleaning, but because the human gut is not really designed to digest cows milk and tends to object to it, especially when babies are very young).

 

Breastfeeding also promotes optimal brain development and maxillo-facial development (mouth/jaw muscles) so the child's speech is likely to be better. Breastfed babies tend not to need/be given dummies, so they speak earlier, on average.

 

It's all good.

My daughter was breastfed, only for about 5 weeks as she was constantly needing feeding and I was exhausted so had to stop for both of our sakes. She has asthma, had eczema as a baby, and she's had chicken pox. I thought by breastfeeding her she would have hopefully avoided some or all of these things but no. Although saying that she started talking early and hasn't stopped since .

[aliceBB 10]

I think it was the job title Breastfeeding Councillor that had Epic Fail foaming at the mouth.

FFS. It is Counsellor, not Councillor, for a start (there's a big difference).

 

It all sounds like the nanny state with well paid non jobs, such as councellor for going to the toilet for the over 25s

Breastfeeding counsellors are experienced and trained volunteers, a bit like Community First Responders or Samaritans, who give up their time and energy unpaid. They support/counsel mothers who want to breastfeed, but are struggling. They usually offer information and support over the phone, as many other kinds of counsellors do, and they make home visits if the mother wants them to.

 

Blimey, the ignorance on this forum is shocking!

 

---------- Post added 13-11-2013 at 09:20 ----------

 

My daughter was breastfed, only for about 5 weeks as she was constantly needing feeding and I was exhausted so had to stop for both of our sakes. She has asthma, had eczema as a baby, and she's had chicken pox. I thought by breastfeeding her she would have hopefully avoided some or all of these things but no. Although saying that she started talking early and hasn't stopped since .

 

Even 5 weeks' breastfeeding will have given her the best start, so well done. I was careful not to claim that breastfeeding prevents allergic diseases in all children (it doesn't) - but the evidence (across populations) from epidemiological studies is that the incidence of those diseases is lower in breastfed children than in formula-fed ones and when breastfed infants do suffer form ezcema and asthma, it is usually less severe than it would otherwise have been.

 

The immunity to infectious diseases isn't lifelong (although some doctors think it may be for some diseases) - just for the period in which they are exclusively breastfed, which can be for up to six months (although not, it seems, in the UK). By that point most babies have been immunised anyway, but if for whatever reason a baby is not vaccinated/immunised against infectious diseases, breastfeeding offer greater natural immunity than not being breastfed.

 

---------- Post added 13-11-2013 at 09:32 ----------

 

I'm so glad that these comments take into account the fact that some women can't actually breastfeed. When I had my daughter, I was absolutely CRUSHED when I couldn't feed her myself because of essential medication I had to take. I went on parenting forums looking for support, but even before I posted (as I was looking through previous threads) it seemed women were jumping over themselves to declare that breast was best, they wouldn't dream of feeding their newborn anything from a four legged animal, that bottle feeding mothers were subjecting their children to possible health problems, that the bond between mother and child is compromised, etc. That, together with post pregnancy hormones, devastated me. I know breast is best, but it seems many are eager to make generalised statements that can really hurt, especially when the choice is taken away from you. So thank you to everyone who has understood not everyone can actually do it.

 

I am sorry that you were made to feel like that. I agree that the pro-breastfeeding 'movement' needs to be more tactful in the way they deal with individuals who for medical reasons are not able to breastfeed.

 

It's a difficult one, though. For decades women who have wanted to breastfeed have been made to feel odd/antisocial and in some cases, publicly reviled for doing it. Remember the mother who had a bucket of dirty water thrown over her when feeding her baby on a bench outside a shop? In a culture where attitudes like this have to be overcome, perhaps it is unavoidable that the pro-breastfeeding lobby comes across as evangelical.

 

In the end, although this is probably no consolation to you, for most babies breast is best (nutritionally at least, the 'bonding' argument is cobblers, imo) but if you are taking drugs which keep you healthy - even if it means you have to bottlefeed in order to keep your baby healthy, that has to be the compromise you settle for. Don't beat yourself up about it. You did the best by your baby and that is what matters.

 

I would also balance the argument by saying that what you put into your child for the 16 or so years after he or she is weaned is at least as important to their health as how they were fed as infants.

Edited November 13, 2013 by aliceBB