Obelix Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 at that warehouse where they store all the artifacts in the Indiana Jones movies <splutters coca-cola all over his keyboard> Genius sir! pure geniosity! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plekhanov Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Nope ... I said atrophy. Look ... things have been turning into fossil fuels every second of every day for hundreds of millions of years ... since the earliest forms of life evolved. They live, they die, they degrade back into forms of carbon we call fuel. Humans have been digging it up and using it for the most infinitesimal amount of that time. You seriously can't tell me that you think that over the past couple of hundreds of years we've used up the sum total energy of everything that's ever lived? And "the sum total energy of everything that's ever lived" has been fossilised has it? I would imagine that every day, billions and billions of tons of bio matter dies ... enough to power all our needs for ages ... even if you made a big bonfire out of it! It goes back into the ground, gets compressed and turns into fossil fuel as it's done forever. Humans have no say in the matter! ... we just borrow the carbon for a short while for our own needs before it inexorably continues on its cycle And every bit of those "billions and billions of tons of bio matter" get turned into fossil fuels do they? Your whole deeply stupid argument rests upon the risible premise that everything that dies inevitably gets turned into fossil fuels. This is not the case,. The fossil fuels that our current civilisation is so reliant upon took many millions of years to accumulate. At the rate we are using them we are likely to run out of oil, gas & coal in decades to centuries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Nope ... I said atrophy. Okay, so you were just using the wrong word then? Look ... things have been turning into fossil fuels every second of every day for hundreds of millions of years ... since the earliest forms of life evolved. They live, they die, they degrade back into forms of carbon we call fuel. Errm, under certain conditions, that Nagel already explained, like the outflow points of large rivers. Most dead biomass is consumed, either in a macro fashion or by bacteria and invertebrates. Humans have been digging it up and using it for the most infinitesimal amount of that time. At an incredible rate. You seriously can't tell me that you think that over the past couple of hundreds of years we've used up the sum total energy of everything that's ever lived? The sum total of everything that ever got converted in oil you mean? Well no, if we had we'd have already run out. Do you have information about oil reserves that the rest of the world doesn't though? I would imagine that every day, billions and billions of tons of bio matter dies ... enough to power all our needs for ages ... even if you made a big bonfire out of it! Imagination is a wonderful thing, maybe you could write fiction. It goes back into the ground, gets compressed and turns into fossil fuel as it's done forever. Humans have no say in the matter! ... we just borrow the carbon for a short while for our own needs before it inexorably continues on its cycle Hmm, back in the ground is correct at least, but as I already said, most of it is then consumed by bacteria and burrowing creatures, that which wasn't consumed before it somehow got back in the ground (most creatures don't bury there dead). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obelix Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Hmm, back in the ground is correct at least, but as I already said, most of it is then consumed by bacteria and burrowing creatures, that which wasn't consumed before it somehow got back in the ground (most creatures don't bury there dead). I'd have to check my numbers but from waht I recall of teh carbon cycle for every 40,000 units of organic carbon that gets sequestered inot long term storage, 0.2 units of that get turned into fossil fuels.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alcoblog Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Okay, so you were just using the wrong word then? Errm, under certain conditions, that Nagel already explained, like the outflow points of large rivers. Most dead biomass is consumed, either in a macro fashion or by bacteria and invertebrates. At an incredible rate. The sum total of everything that ever got converted in oil you mean? Well no, if we had we'd have already run out. Do you have information about oil reserves that the rest of the world doesn't though? Imagination is a wonderful thing, maybe you could write fiction. Hmm, back in the ground is correct at least, but as I already said, most of it is then consumed by bacteria and burrowing creatures, that which wasn't consumed before it somehow got back in the ground (most creatures don't bury there dead). Your puerile, patronising and sarcastic comments amuse me (as I'm sure others on this thread) I love sarcasm! I'm not gonna spend too long on this though as I'm losing the will to live. In very simplistic terms, organisms die ... wether it be an eohippus, caelocamph, eryops, meta sequoia, or Thomas the cat. They all end up in the ground! (unless, as of very recently, they get 'buried' in space in the front end of a rocket). I think we can agree on this? I forgot to say (very foolishly as it seems) ... I presumed most people are aware how living things (once dead) are transformed into their component parts by micro-organisms. Maybe we can agree on that? These micro-organisms then die and either end up at the bottom of riverbeds or are directly used up as nutrients by plant life etc which starts the whole process again. Before you start ... other stuff can be preserved without being broken down fully in non-oxygenated water (apart from the oxygen atoms that are bonded to the hydrogen atoms, before you get picky) This forms lignite and higher variations of coal (yes ... and gas!). I really can't be bothered to go into the whole carbon cycle thing as it's just stuff that you should've learned in junior school. Suffice to say, humans cannot slow down the carbon recycling process ... it's what the planet does without our puny intervention! Nothing is created and nothing is destroyed. There's a sum total of atoms on this planet and it'll never change in realistic terms. (Obviously you could argue that meteorite hits would add to the amount if you wanted to be pedantic, or that satellites have taken stuff away from the earth) Your point of view comes from one sided stuff you've read in books and the internet, stuff you've chosen to accept without contemplating the other theories. Look how people panicked about the depletion of the ozone layer due to selective thought! Do you hear about it anymore? ... NO! ... it fixed itself in a natural cycle! Now people are panicking about the world heating up ... too much ozone I guess! Help! ... we're running out of oil! ... claptrap! I really don't think I'm gonna comment anymore on this thread as it's like banging my head against a wall! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JarvisS8 Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Your puerile, patronising and sarcastic comments amuse me (as I'm sure others on this thread) I love sarcasm! I'm not gonna spend too long on this though as I'm losing the will to live. In very simplistic terms, organisms die ... wether it be an eohippus, caelocamph, eryops, meta sequoia, or Thomas the cat. They all end up in the ground! (unless, as of very recently, they get 'buried' in space in the front end of a rocket). I think we can agree on this? I forgot to say (very foolishly as it seems) ... I presumed most people are aware how living things (once dead) are transformed into their component parts by micro-organisms. Maybe we can agree on that? These micro-organisms then die and either end up at the bottom of riverbeds or are directly used up as nutrients by plant life etc which starts the whole process again. Before you start ... other stuff can be preserved without being broken down fully in non-oxygenated water (apart from the oxygen atoms that are bonded to the hydrogen atoms, before you get picky) This forms lignite and higher variations of coal (yes ... and gas!). I really can't be bothered to go into the whole carbon cycle thing as it's just stuff that you should've learned in junior school. Suffice to say, humans cannot slow down the carbon recycling process ... it's what the planet does without our puny intervention! Nothing is created and nothing is destroyed. There's a sum total of atoms on this planet and it'll never change in realistic terms. (Obviously you could argue that meteorite hits would add to the amount if you wanted to be pedantic, or that satellites have taken stuff away from the earth) Your point of view comes from one sided stuff you've read in books and the internet, stuff you've chosen to accept without contemplating the other theories. Look how people panicked about the depletion of the ozone layer due to selective thought! Do you hear about it anymore? ... NO! ... it fixed itself in a natural cycle! Now people are panicking about the world heating up ... too much ozone I guess! Help! ... we're running out of oil! ... claptrap! I really don't think I'm gonna comment anymore on this thread as it's like banging my head against a wall! Well it won't do you any harm. Actually after reading your post it might even knock some sense into you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Your puerile, patronising and sarcastic comments amuse me (as I'm sure others on this thread) I love sarcasm! I'm not gonna spend too long on this though as I'm losing the will to live. In very simplistic terms, organisms die ... wether it be an eohippus, caelocamph, eryops, meta sequoia, or Thomas the cat. They all end up in the ground! (unless, as of very recently, they get 'buried' in space in the front end of a rocket). I think we can agree on this? No, they don't. Mostly they get eaten by other creatures. Maybe this is the funamental logical flaw in your reasoning. Although assuming that other people are being sarcastic, puerile or patronising when they aren't won't have helped you. I forgot to say (very foolishly as it seems) ... I presumed most people are aware how living things (once dead) are transformed into their component parts by micro-organisms. Maybe we can agree on that? No, the micro organisms don't just break down dead things, they are biomass themselves and the consume the biomass of dead things. These micro-organisms then die and either end up at the bottom of riverbeds or are directly used up as nutrients by plant life etc which starts the whole process again. Okay, so there's a huge amount of biomass which ends up back in soil and is then used by plant life. This biomass is not available for the formation of fossil fuel is it! Before you start ... other stuff can be preserved without being broken down fully in non-oxygenated water (apart from the oxygen atoms that are bonded to the hydrogen atoms, before you get picky) This forms lignite and higher variations of coal (yes ... and gas!). I really can't be bothered to go into the whole carbon cycle thing as it's just stuff that you should've learned in junior school. Hmm, kettle, meet sarcastic puerile comments from pot. Suffice to say, humans cannot slow down the carbon recycling process ... it's what the planet does without our puny intervention! Nothing is created and nothing is destroyed. True, but not all biomass, not even most ends up being converted in fossil fuel, which is the assertion you've made and got upset about when contradicted. There's a sum total of atoms on this planet and it'll never change in realistic terms. (Obviously you could argue that meteorite hits would add to the amount if you wanted to be pedantic, or that satellites have taken stuff away from the earth) Your point of view comes from one sided stuff you've read in books and the internet, stuff you've chosen to accept without contemplating the other theories. Whereas your point of view comes from? Stuff you read that wasn't in a book or on the internet, maybe youTube videos? Look how people panicked about the depletion of the ozone layer due to selective thought! Do you hear about it anymore? ... NO! ... it fixed itself in a natural cycle! A natural cycle of us stopping the production of CFC's worldwide... And it hasn't fixed itself actually, it's still there. But hey ho, don't let facts get in your way. Now people are panicking about the world heating up ... too much ozone I guess! Help! ... we're running out of oil! ... claptrap! I really don't think I'm gonna comment anymore on this thread as it's like banging my head against a wall! Indeed, a wall of rational thought and logic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alcoblog Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Well it won't do you any harm. Actually after reading your post it might even knock some sense into you Oooh! you witticism has sent me into paroxysms of uncontrolled laughter! ... I put in the comment about banging my head on a wall intentionally to see who was incapable of continuing the discussion! I knew someone would fall for it! ... congratulations for being the first person with nothing to say! :hihi: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alcoblog Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 No, they don't. Mostly they get eaten by other creatures. Maybe this is the funamental logical flaw in your reasoning. Although assuming that other people are being sarcastic, puerile or patronising when they aren't won't have helped you. No, the micro organisms don't just break down dead things, they are biomass themselves and the consume the biomass of dead things. Okay, so there's a huge amount of biomass which ends up back in soil and is then used by plant life. This biomass is not available for the formation of fossil fuel is it! Hmm, kettle, meet sarcastic puerile comments from pot. True, but not all biomass, not even most ends up being converted in fossil fuel, which is the assertion you've made and got upset about when contradicted. Whereas your point of view comes from? Stuff you read that wasn't in a book or on the internet, maybe youTube videos? A natural cycle of us stopping the production of CFC's worldwide... And it hasn't fixed itself actually, it's still there. But hey ho, don't let facts get in your way. Indeed, a wall of rational thought and logic. As I've said ... I thrive on sarcasm! Especially from people who make a fool of themselves on the forum with inane and ill thought comments!:hihi: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 The funny thing is though, I'm answering you seriously, but you think I'm being sarcastic. You also seem to think that I'm wrong, which is quite amusing, although you've declined to say how or why, which is telling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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