School grump 2: 4 is too young (especially for boys)

[cosywolf 10]

My meaning obviously wasnt perfectly clear - it blatently went over your head! You keep up the act that boys arent as clever or whatever as girls - or whatever it actually is youre trying to say. I cant comment on that, as I have said already - because my son isnt at this

 

This makes it clear that you aren't even attempting to understand what I'm saying. Which is a pity, as I think everyone with boys should make it their business to at least be aware of the studies.

 

Gina, I have never called you stupid. I have no idea who this other forummer is, as I have other things to do with my time than worry about Forum vendettas.

I am insulted because you insist on blaming the parents and children for something which is a proven physical issue. And I am suggesting that as the mother of a son you find out more.

Edited July 12, 2010 by cosywolf
Pmt.

[gina2007 10]

This makes it clear that you aren't even attempting to understand what I'm saying. Which is a pity, as I think everyone with boys should make it their business to at least be aware of the studies.

 

The rest of your post, being defensive and in places quite rude, isn't worth my time, so I won't respond to it.

 

No im not attempting to read what the internet has to say thank you. Your opinions seem very much highly pressured upon by whats said on the net. Your child isnt ready - not every boy isnt ready. Studies this that and the other - thats all its about now. I dont go into studies because theyre a general sweeping statement about overall children - it could be 51% reacted to X therefore X is the best thing possible and gullible people will listen to it.

 

Whos sticking their head in the sand now?

 

Absolutly childish that you think your view is the right one and thats how it is. If you dont like the education system, do something about it. Stop complaining about it, just do something about it. Change areas where the education layout is set differently. End of, im not replying anymore - im perfectly capable of bringing up my son (nor matter what anyone thinks or SAYS about me on that!)

[Lucy-Lastic 10]

I too feel that for a lot of boys, 4 years old is too young and they are not ready. It is a well understood fact that boys generally lag behind girls in the development of their fine motor skills up until at least key stage 2 - unfortunately children are assessed in large parts on what they write and if they can not control a pencil that is going to be very difficult resulting in frustrations from the child, the teacher and the parents. I realise that in reception, much of the work is based on learning through play - but this is not everything from what I have seen and the children are still expected to be able to read and write before some are ready. In many other countries, children do not start at this very early age and it seems to benefit their early development (and the development right through school).

[PAUL-ROOFER 10]

some of my friends have girls the same age as my son and the difference is very present, with a lot of key stages including potty training,speaking and even walking all took place before my son, and as a first time mum this can be frustrating i spoke to a healthvisitor and expressed my concerns and she said much the same as you boys dont tend to devolp at the same pace as girls, which was refreshing to hear however now where at school were again these differences are again present, and now he is picking up on these differences i do a lot at home with him and he is really clever (to me!!) but he is still only 4 and i think he is too young!

[hennypenny 10]

It seems to be far too young to me to be away all day, and especially if they are giving them home work as well.

 

I wonder who it was that decided that children learned best by sitting at a desk and doing "school work"? In my experience (24 years of home educating my children) they learn incredibly well when given the chance to run around, touch, smell, explore, play and totally ignore "busy work".

 

I love the freedom my children had, and I would never have given that up for them. I see tiny children being taken to school and it breaks my heart. We used to childmind and I watched the children we minded change when they went to school, they became more subdued, less happy, less freespirited, and I felt so sad for them when compared with my own children and the other home educated children we minded who were still free to play all day

 

Other countries don't start until they are 7 and they have better literacy rates, so how does that work?

 

I believe that children are not evolved to leave their parents until they are 7 or 8 and that it should be the child's choice when they strike out on their own, not someone else's choice to force them to part. By allowing my children to decide for themselves when they wanted to leave being with me, I have ended up with two supremely confident, happy and secure children who did leave me without a backwards glance when they felt ready.

 

It has been commented that not everyone can afford to home educate - well we couldn't afford it, but we did it anyway. There is always a way to manage if you have to. Children appreciate their parent's time far more than posh holidays or brand new clothes etc. Use freecycle, join thrifty recipe forums, eat lentils if need be!

 

Just my opinion

[PAUL-ROOFER 10]

what i dont understand is that surley a happy child is better off than a child that is academically abled at 4, why does a child need to be a font of knowledge at such a young age? my 4year old can write his name, is starting to read small words can count say the alphebet but he can also play! climb trees swim and interact with other kids and people which to me is far more important than sticking to a school sylubus at 4 years old, their academic time will come later on. I know i would be far happier watching him learn through play than taking him to school everyday in his uniform which he hates wearing!

[claire1976 10]

Gina you seem to be completely missing the point which is that it's been identified that boys aged 4/5 are not developed enough to cope with school full time. Physically as much as anything. Nothing to do with 'parental guidance'

 

 

Could you provide some links to evidence this please? I am curious because the evidence I have seen of my own son and nephews contradicts this.

My own experience, as I said before, is that my son who was 4 yrs 2mths old when he started school was perfectly physically and emotionally developed enough to be ready.

He was potty trained by 2,completely dry overnight by 2.5 and had a wide vocabulary range. He has just turned 8 now and has over achieved consistantly since starting school, he has a reading and writing age of 9/10 and his maths skills are at the top range of what can be expected so it has been of no detriment to start at 4.

I believe parents should support learning and its never to early to start if structured correctly. I always read to my son from being very young and we have an active outdoors life, I believe children can learn a lot from nature and travel.

I used to help out in the reception class and I don't recall seeing any evidence that the younger boys were struggling, if anything it was the girls who seemed tired and grumpy by the end of the day and those were the ones crying when left by their mums.

[cosywolf 10]

This makes it clear that you aren't even attempting to understand what I'm saying. Which is a pity, as I think everyone with boys should make it their business to at least be aware of the studies.

 

Gina, I have never called you stupid. I have no idea who this other forummer is, as I have other things to do with my time than worry about Forum vendettas.

I am insulted because you insist on blaming the parents and children for something which is a proven physical issue. And I am suggesting that as the mother of a son you find out more.

 

Gina, I would like to draw your attention to the above edit. That last bit was previously stroppier than I intended.

I would also like to point out that you simply do not feature in my life enough for me to hold a personal grudge or even dislike of you. I simply dislike what you are saying.

 

I'm interested in the breakdown here...it does seem to be the parents of boys in the majority who feel the school age is too young. I wonder if that is because the development issues really bring the issue home more starkly.

Or are girls really ready even emotionally more quickly...perhaps we should have gender based intakes.

[Lpsmum 10]

Could you provide some links to evidence this please? I am curious because the evidence I have seen of my own son and nephews contradicts this

Can't help you there - was just going on what cosywolf said "Studies have shown that children (particularly boys) can suffer developmental issues for the rest of their educational careers if forced to learn to write before they are physically ready. Their fine motor schools often don’t develop until they are six or seven. "

[cosywolf 10]

 

It has been commented that not everyone can afford to home educate - well we couldn't afford it, but we did it anyway. There is always a way to manage if you have to. Children appreciate their parent's time far more than posh holidays or brand new clothes etc. Use freecycle, join thrifty recipe forums, eat lentils if need be!

 

Just my opinion

 

I'm sorry but life simply isn't that simple. In many cases there are no posh holidays and new clothes to give up.

I can no more afford to home school my children than I can afford to buy them a private jet. The will cannot always make a way, no matter how many lentils you eat.

 

However, the education system could certainly learn a huge amount from the achievements of home schooled children.

[claire1976 10]

Can't help you there - was just going on what cosywolf said "Studies have shown that children (particularly boys) can suffer developmental issues for the rest of their educational careers if forced to learn to write before they are physically ready. Their fine motor schools often don’t develop until they are six or seven. "

 

My bold - can suffer - not neccessarily - and couldn't the same be said for girls?? Some of them must surely struggle.

 

Forced? That has never been the case in our reception class, no child at the age of 4/5 would be forced to read or write, just encouraged through play.

 

I am not convinced until I see evidence of these studies,what range was used and how they concluded this result.

[cosywolf 10]

Can't help you there - was just going on what cosywolf said "Studies have shown that children (particularly boys) can suffer developmental issues for the rest of their educational careers if forced to learn to write before they are physically ready. Their fine motor schools often don’t develop until they are six or seven. "

 

Give me a few hours, I'm doing tea, wind down and bedtime. I'll get back to you.

 

My information came originally from a good friend who is a head of year and pastoral carer for a secondary school. The development of boys is of particular interest to her because she gets to deal with the fallout - boys who are completely disenfranchised from the education system by their early learning experiences. She has attended many seminars on the subject, and has kindly shared the information with me. But it is out there. Bear with me