Bus Lane Cameras Ecclesall Road

[Fraxie 10]

Hi there - just a warning and if someone is an expert on rules of introducing cameras on bus lanes.

 

Got a PCN through yesterday. Couple of weeks ago hubby turned from William Street onto Ecclesall Road. There's no filter there to let you join traffic and he saw a gap and went for it, only for the driver on Eccy Road to put his foot down and close the gap. This forced my husband onto bus lane and as a bus was coming down, he panicked as he couldn't join the traffic outside the bus lane and drove down it.

 

Now, we know he shouldn't be driving in the bus lane, but it is a bad junction to join Eccy Road. However, we've done a bit of research and apparently there should be warning signs on William Street that cameras are in use and there aren't (they are a very recent addition to that end of Eccy Road). There is an A4 sized sign saying CCTV is in use, not camera enforcement. Also the PCN says he's on Moore Street Bus Lane and he wasn't, he was on Eccy Road (You can see Sheaf Island and Waitrose to his right in the pic).

 

The camera in use is not the usual yellow, highly visible camera, just a discreet normal CCTV camera. The signage does not display the Camera graphic that is usual either. Also, you can't get out of that junction without crossing the bus lane.

 

Any info or advice would be appreciated.

[No User Name 10]

Surely an incorrect location on the PCN is grounds for the ticket to be cancelled.

[Fraxie 10]

I'm thinking that too. Apparently the location has to be explicit, but it says Moore Street Bus Lane. The lane leads down to Moore Street Roundabout but is on Eccy Road. Hanover Way and St Mary's Gate also serve that roundabout so is not explicitly for Moore Street and isn't ON Moore Street.

 

The inadequate signage and intention for use of cameras (just saying CCTV) i feel cannot be legal either.

[Bonjon 10]

Just looking on street view, https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.373264,-1.4826734,3a,75y,145.54h,71.24t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sQhEVlILW5kSt_QcMokItMQ!2e0 and can clearly see sign saying bus lane etc. (not camera enforcement though).

[Fraxie 10]

Hi Bonjon - yes, there is a black and white sign stating bus lane (although I've read it should be further back from the junction than it is). But no warning from that approach that it is now enforced by cameras. That junction can be a nightmare to get out of. You have no option but to cross the bus lane and rely on the goodwill of fellow road users to let you in as there is not filter.

 

It is more to do with the fact that there is no camera signage and the incorrect location on the PCN.

 

I've never challenged a ticket before (mind you, I've only ever got one parking ticket). So don't know how successful challenges are.

[*_ash_* 88]

The location isn't incorrect.

 

If he turned left off William Street, then he turned onto Moore Street, not Ecclesall Road.

[Fraxie 10]

Hi Ash - my map says it's Ecclesall Road, the A625?

[No User Name 10]

The location isn't incorrect.

 

If he turned left off William Street, then he turned onto Moore Street, not Ecclesall Road.

 

Moore Street is on the opposite side of the roundabout, it certainly is Eccy Road

 

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/53.3736688,-1.4828737/53.3732758,-1.4810135/@53.3733303,-1.4830313,18z/data=!4m4!4m3!1m0!1m0!3e2

[*_ash_* 88]

Hi Ash - my map says it's Ecclesall Road, the A625?

 

Ecclesall Road used to go down to where Baan Thai is (hence its address of 1 Ecclesall Road). The road split somewhere near the old Devonshire Arms, and the name stayed the same - Moore Street.

[No User Name 10]

The Wetherspoons down there is advertised as being on Eccy Road and that is just a little past the junction in my map, are they wrong then?

 

here is a slightly better one:

 

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/53.3736688,-1.4828737/53.3730559,-1.4822367/@53.3733303,-1.4830313,18z/data=!4m4!4m3!1m0!1m0!3e2

 

Just after you turn left you are still on Eccy Road, the point on my map being 118 Eccy Road.

[*_ash_* 88]

The Wetherspoons down there is advertised as being on Eccy Road and that is just a little past the junction in my map, are they wrong then?

 

No, because Ecclesall Road used to go down to the corner, so it will be on Ecclesall Road regardless, so no building on that side would be considered to be on Moore Street.

 

here is a slightly better one:

 

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/53.3736688,-1.4828737/53.3730559,-1.4822367/@53.3733303,-1.4830313,18z/data=!4m4!4m3!1m0!1m0!3e2

 

Just after you turn left you are still on Eccy Road, the point on my map being 118 Eccy Road.

 

Just. I'm not sure of the position of the camera, or the wording on the fine. In the OP it says 'Also the PCN says he's on Moore Street Bus Lane and he wasn't, he was on Eccy Road'; that section is likely to be called Moore Street Bus lane even if a few yards of it are still considered Ecclesall Rd.

 

---------- Post added 24-09-2014 at 13:32 ----------

 

Either way, I'm not sure of the reasoning that the OP is giving specifically, there seems to be a few.

 

Might be worth arguing and see if can get away with it.

 

But which reason?

 

There's no filter there to let you join traffic and he saw a gap and went for it, only for the driver on Eccy Road to put his foot down and close the gap. This forced my husband onto bus lane and as a bus was coming down, he panicked as he couldn't join the traffic outside the bus lane and drove down it.

 

What kind of filter was he expecting?

 

-

 

he panicked as he couldn't join the traffic outside the bus lane and drove down it.

 

Now, we know he shouldn't be driving in the bus lane

 

I wouldn't write this in the challenge.

 

-

 

However, we've done a bit of research and apparently there should be warning signs on William Street that cameras are in use and there aren't (they are a very recent addition to that end of Eccy Road). There is an A4 sized sign saying CCTV is in use, not camera enforcement.

 

Can you share this? Whilst there may have to be warnings of cameras, I want to see the wording that says there must be a sign saying that the camera is enforced.

 

-

 

Also the PCN says he's on Moore Street Bus Lane and he wasn't, he was on Eccy Road (You can see Sheaf Island and Waitrose to his right in the pic).

 

This we're currently discussing. If anyone could let us know the position of the camera it would help.

 

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The camera in use is not the usual yellow, highly visible camera, just a discreet normal CCTV camera. The signage does not display the Camera graphic that is usual either.

 

As isn't the one at Hillsborough bus/tram gate, and I think all the challenges against this one have been tried by now.

 

-

 

Also, you can't get out of that junction without crossing the bus lane.

 

Any info or advice would be appreciated.

 

Yes you can (unless it's been remarked incorrectly recently). Bus lanes always have a split in them at junctions - see here with this one

[Squiggs 11]

Hi Bonjon - yes, there is a black and white sign stating bus lane (although I've read it should be further back from the junction than it is). But no warning from that approach that it is now enforced by cameras. That junction can be a nightmare to get out of. You have no option but to cross the bus lane and rely on the goodwill of fellow road users to let you in as there is not filter.

 

It is more to do with the fact that there is no camera signage and the incorrect location on the PCN.

 

I've never challenged a ticket before (mind you, I've only ever got one parking ticket). So don't know how successful challenges are.

 

So do you only think traffic signs and laws apply when they are on camera?

 

If the signage or PCN is incorrect then that is one thing; circumstances of being in the lane are another - but there being no camera signage has no bearing on it