boyface Posted May 18, 2009 Share Posted May 18, 2009 I touched on it in another thread, but the Newcastle fans that think they have a god given right to be in the Premiership have only supported them since they have been in the premiership. The Newcastle fans who supported them before Ruport Murdoch told everyone else to join in are under no illusions and know Newcastle have won diddly squat for decades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFKvsNixon Posted May 18, 2009 Share Posted May 18, 2009 By this I mean banging on about.... Deserving to be in a higher league Having the best or most passionate fans Being victimised by the authorities Having a 'pedigree' of football (when they clearly don't) How they have always been a big side (despite a lack of trophies and years in the lower league to dispute this. In my opinion, Chelsea fans are the worst by a mile. Prior to the Russian Mafia taking over, their last league title win was in 1955, and they spent much of the 1980s kicking around the second division. Ken Bates bought a modicum of success during his wreckless tenure, but rather than spout on about how they are this footballing Leviathan, it might be worth the average blue remembering that they were teetering on the point of oblivion before Roman came along, and could be just another Leeds United now if it weren't for the grace of God. As a Chelsea fan, I can't really see were you are coming from. I don't buy into this "we are one of the big four thing" anyway. You are only a member of the big four if you finish in the top four, and no club has a god given right to be in the top four. I know that Abramovich has spent a lot of money on Chelsea and that is his prerogative, a lot of it was wasted but he wanted to turn Chelsea into genuine title contenders straight away; and he backed his managers at the time. It's nice being in the your clubs most successful period ever, but it's not something that I take for granted. I remember vividly the twelve years of supporting Chelsea when the only silverware that I could celebrate was the "Simod cup" and the division two championship. Personally, I don't care if we are a considered big club or not, as being considered a big club doesn't guarantee winning trophies; or even challenging for trophies on a consistent basis. Just ask Liverpool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CockneyMafia Posted May 18, 2009 Author Share Posted May 18, 2009 As a Chelsea fan, I can't really see were you are coming from. I don't buy into this "we are one of the big four thing" anyway. You are only a member of the big four if you finish in the top four, and no club has a god given right to be in the top four. I know that Abramovich has spent a lot of money on Chelsea and that is his prerogative, a lot of it was wasted but he wanted to turn Chelsea into genuine title contenders straight away; and he backed his managers at the time. It's nice being in the your clubs most successful period ever, but it's not something that I take for granted. I remember vividly the twelve years of supporting Chelsea when the only silverware that I could celebrate was the "Simod cup" and the division two championship. Personally, I don't care if we are a considered big club or not, as being considered a big club doesn't guarantee winning trophies; or even challenging for trophies on a consistent basis. Just ask Liverpool. Then you clearly have a lot more humility than some. I have been to see Chelsea several times this season and last (as a corporate guest supporting the away team in the home end - an interesting experience) and the fans seem oblivious to a) just how lucky they are to be in their current privileged position and b) how deluded they are about being this huge successful side. Kenyon is an egotistical tyrant, and perhaps the most deluded of all. His scoffing pseudo Clough quote about "this year’s title challengers coming from a pool of one", shortly after Ambramovich pumped in £300m made him a laughable figure of hate, and seems to embody the current arrogance engulfing Stamford Bridge. I am not saying all Chelsea fans view things this way (indeed some openly long for the days of desperate 1-0 away wins courtesy of a Frank Sinclair deflection) but the vast majority of Chelsea fans I have encountered are sailing on an ego trip right now which God willing will burst when Abramovich takes his money and buggers off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFKvsNixon Posted May 18, 2009 Share Posted May 18, 2009 Then you clearly have a lot more humility than some. I have been to see Chelsea several times this season and last (as a corporate guest supporting the away team in the home end - an interesting experience) and the fans seem oblivious to a) just how lucky they are to be in their current privileged position and b) how deluded they are about being this huge successful side. Kenyon is an egotistical tyrant, and perhaps the most deluded of all. His scoffing pseudo Clough quote about "this year’s title challengers coming from a pool of one", shortly after Ambramovich pumped in £300m made him a laughable figure of hate, and seems to embody the current arrogance engulfing Stamford Bridge. I am not saying all Chelsea fans view things this way (indeed some openly long for the days of desperate 1-0 away wins courtesy of a Frank Sinclair deflection) but the vast majority of Chelsea fans I have encountered are sailing on an ego trip right now which God willing will burst when Abramovich takes his money and buggers off. It may me a case of the issue being the difference between perception and reality. Sure we have our own fair share of idiot fans (I must say though I prefer this set of idiot fans to our last set, when if you didn't join in the racist chants you were branded a 'commie red' and open to extreme abuse by some)but which club doesn't? The success on the pitch has come through hard work on the training ground, and it was no coincidence that when the hard work eased up under the Scolari regime the success dropped off. Maybe Man City, Newcastle and the rest of the top teams who are under achieving should realise this, as there is no short cut to successs other than hard work. Success is relative though, and maybe the fans are just basking in the current success. For me success is when you are still in the hunt for major trophies when the season comes to an end, I have too many memories of our season being over in January. Or maybe too many memories of dull 1-0 wins achieved via a last minuet miss-hit by Sinclair. I do not know one fan who likes or respects Kenyon, every one I know wants shot of the slimy snake. I was so hoping that he would be loured away by Man City's Billions. The rumours coming from Chelsea is that he has lost Abramovich's confidence and as such will be on his way soon. Scolari was his appointment and he was sacked when Kenyon was away on holiday, with Hiddink installed as a result of negotiations directly by Abramovih. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackerz Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 sheffield united are the biggest bunch of winers ever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
websters gue Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 sheffield united are the biggest bunch of winers ever Why don't you keep quiet and let people think your an idiot rather than make a post and remove all doubt. Going back to the main question,it's got to be Newcastle for me.I was listening to 606 on radio 5 a few weeks ago and a Geordie commented on how Hull should go down solely because their gates are half the size of Newcastle's.I remember when Newcastle were getting gates half the size of Hull City's present attendances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CashBack13 Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 By this I mean banging on about.... Deserving to be in a higher league Having the best or most passionate fans Being victimised by the authorities Having a 'pedigree' of football (when they clearly don't) How they have always been a big side (despite a lack of trophies and years in the lower league to dispute this. In my opinion, Chelsea fans are the worst by a mile. Prior to the Russian Mafia taking over, their last league title win was in 1955, and they spent much of the 1980s kicking around the second division. Ken Bates bought a modicum of success during his wreckless tenure, but rather than spout on about how they are this footballing Leviathan, it might be worth the average blue remembering that they were teetering on the point of oblivion before Roman came along, and could be just another Leeds United now if it weren't for the grace of God. You've Just Described the Blunts Perfectly with those Points! ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zomoniac Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 And won the league in 1992 to be fair. Leeds are a big club, bigger than both Sheffield clubs (and I say that as an adopted South Sheffielder with no axe to grind) and certainly too 'big' for League 1 based on fanbase alone. Unfortunately for them, they are a League one side on the park. As one of their fans eloquently pointed out on another thread, the sooner the majority of fans forget about their recent history, which was based on a gamble that spectacularly backfired, the sooner they can start managing their expectations properly. I presume I'm the fan in question? Certainly I think we belong in the list. Not to the extent of Newcastle, because we have had a history. Two UEFA Cups, losing a CWC final because of a bribed referee who ended up in prison, losing a European Cup final in somewhat similar circumstances to Chelsea's CL semi defeat, a few league titles, as recently as 1992, and a CL semi appearance a few years back. But that's all history, Forest have won two European Cups, but because they've been a nothing team for a lot longer than we have they've learnt to accept it. The memory of beating teams like AC Milan is still too fresh in the mind for most of our fans to see us as a team that 'belongs' playing the likes of Hartlepool. But it will come. Whilst I think it's impressive that we are the only non-Premiership team to feature in the top 10 UK clubs by registered fans, you're only as big as your success, which is only as good as your players, who are rubbish. But, that said, in the last 50 years few English teams have had league domination and cup runs on the levels we have had. Liverpool and Man Utd obviously far outrank us, and Arsenal have proved a major force in the last 12 years, but that's it really. We were a massive club for a while, so it's sort of understandable, if unjustifiable, that many of our fans carry an air of nostalgic arrogance. Newcastle fans, on the other hand (not all of them, making an unfair generalisation here) have an idea that they are a massive Premiership team. Yes, they have a lot of fans and a big stadium, but you are only as big as your successes, and... Newcastle haven't won the league in over 80 years, the FA Cup in over 50 years, and a UEFA Cup win in 1969 is their most recent trophy. Not really much to be arrogant about. Likewise Sheffield United. Whilst their fans love to come on here and tell me I'm delusional, their one and only league win was over 110 years ago! They haven't actually taken any silverware beyond lower league titles since 1925. Same with Wednesday, though to a much lesser extent. They've had good runs, and were a decent team in the early days of the Premiership (their two-cup-final season was great entertainment), but the reality is that other than a League Cup win in 1991, it's been 75 years since they won anything. How many of their fans who see so fit to preach to me about how much Leeds have failed have even lived to see them lift more than that one trophy? Anyway, I think I'm just nitpicking now as some sort of petty way of revenge for all the abuse I've gotten in the last year from people here, gives me an excuse to have a dig back Sorry everyone, no offence intended! I don't actually know if United and Wednesday fans really have the arrogance and delusions of grandeur that they imply on here, or if they just put them on to try and make me feel worse about being a Leeds fan But certainly if someone devised a formula to calculate the arrogance and expectations of fans against the successes of the club, Newcastle would come out on top by a country mile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plekhanov Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 But, that said, in the last 50 years few English teams have had league domination and cup runs on the levels we have had. Liverpool and Man Utd obviously far outrank us, and Arsenal have proved a major force in the last 12 years, but that's it really. We were a massive club for a while, so it's sort of understandable, if unjustifiable, that many of our fans carry an air of nostalgic arrogance. 'League domination'? Since when does coming 2nd a lot count as 'domination'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zomoniac Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 'League domination'? Since when does coming 2nd a lot count as 'domination'? Fair point I always think we won it more times than we actually did during that era, then am always disappointed when I go and look at it! Still, in the space of 10 years we had two league titles, 5 second places, an FA Cup, three FA Cup runner-ups, a League Cup, a European Cup unjustified second place, a CWC illegal second place (our MEP is currently trying to get the result changed in European Court!), two UEFA Cups and a UEFA Cup second place. An awful lot of almosts but not quite (it's just the Leeds way!), but that's still an impressive record. Not a Liverpool or Man Utd record, but still one that most teams have never come close to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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