Why did communism fail?

[Bassman62 10]

At the time when Russia was in control of east Germany it certainly looked to the whole world as a communist state.

According to the western proppoganda, all it was as other enlightened members have pointed out was nothing more that a dictatorial police state.

[Bassman62 10]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iuchi_Zien

Sometimes your ignorance is breathtaking,

.

 

So please answer, Do you believe/accept that the DDR was a communist state?

 

I'n still wating for you to answer.

[Shogun 10]

When I was in the army we did a lot of training and studying of what the Russians were all about, and I can tell you if they wanted to take over Europe at the time there would have been nothing we or the Americans would have been able to do, there power and capacity was frighting at the time,they said that every solder in the British army would have to have killed 3000 Russian solders on the first day of battle just to make an impression on them,they could have done anything they wanted at the time,communism did work for them at the time it made them the most powerful nation on earth.

Edited July 1, 2011 by Shogun

[No dice 10]

When I was in the army we did a lot of training and studying of what the Russians were all about, and I can tell you if they wanted to take over Europe at the time there would have been nothing we or the Americans would have been able to do, there power and capacity was frighting at the time,they said that every solder in the British army would have to have killed 3000 Russian solders on the first day of battle just to make an impression on them,they could have done anything they wanted at the time,communism did work for them at the time it made them the most powerful nation on earth.

 

America and the UK would have nuked them if they even attempted it.

[plekhanov 10]

Most full time workers have health plans through their employers which also cover spouses and dependents up to the age of 26. The company pays a portion and so does the employee.

I've heard horror stories of people being denied treatment mainly from Michael Moore but if it was so widespread as he claims then it would be a major issue and in the news on a daily basis.

"Nearly 59 million Americans went without health insurance coverage for at least part of 2010". You have millions with no coverage, millions with limited coverage and millions who think they have coverage only to find the insurance companies wriggle out of it when they come to make a major claim.

 

It is a major issue, the monumental efforts the Democrats went through to pass healthcare legislation to try and improve the situation woudl suggest quite a few other people in the US also regard it as a "major issue". You just seem not to have noticed, after all why should you care? You've got government healthcare.

[plekhanov 10]

Dont take you long to start the name calling does it? What's your problem.?The missus get too many headaches? Chill out or shut up.

 

Anyway Medicare although government run administers money taken from Social Security checks and pays it directly into the privately administered individual health plans

That's it's only involvement. It doesn't subsidize hospitals or pay the salaries of hospital staff

You just argued that:

 

"The worst thing that could happen is if some govt bureaucrat took over the [government] plan. No thanks"

 

That is an argument only a lunatic can make.

[plekhanov 10]

Well I'm a centrist of the John Smith or Ken Livingstone at a stretch variety so I have no passionate desire to defend communism. I think 'the great leap forward' was just witch hunting with a political tag added on.

Regardless of the precise variant of your socialism it's clear that you are motivated by your socialism to try and deny the clear causative link between revolutionary socialism and atrocities.

 

As to my final quote it's a key element of Buddhist philosophy and no I'm not one of those either but I understand its meaning eg we can argue all we like but we'll have been dead a long time in a hundred years and historians of the future and maybe communism of the future will settle the debate.

The "debate" about whether or not communism led to massacres was settled long ago. The link between communism and mass murder is as clear as that between Nazism and mass murder. In each case the only people denying the murders and the ideology in questions culpability for that murder are agenda driven cranks. I find each variety of denialist equally distasteful.

[Nagel 10]

Did Communism really fail?

 

It created China which is ruled by the Communist Party and looks set to overtake the USA as the most successful economy in the world.

 

I'm well aware that China is far removed from Marx's original concept of Communism, but according to the Chinese it is still Communism and the biggest Communist country in the world.

[plekhanov 10]

Do you understand the difference between communism and a police state?

I understand that Communist produced many of the most comprehensively repressive police states.

 

Were you also taken in by the 'DDR'? what was democratic about post war East German police state?

 

So if I put a 'Rolls Royce' badge on my car does it make it a 'Rolls Royce'?

Of course not you'll note for example that I made no mention of the attrocities of the German "National Socialist Party" because I know that regardless of the name that the Nazis were in no meaningful sense "socialist" just as the DDR was in no meaningful way "democratic".

 

In contrast the communist governments of Russia, China, Cambodia... which murdered so many and tyrannised many more were "communist" and "socialist" in very meaningful ways in that they turned their societies upside down in an attempt to implement communist/socialist economic policies.

 

Please note I said "were communist" because I realise that whilst the "Communist Party" may still be in power in China it is no longer meaningfully communist/socialist having ditched communist economic policies.

[plekhanov 10]

Did Communism really fail?

 

It created China which is ruled by the Communist Party and looks set to overtake the USA as the most successful economy in the world.

 

I'm well aware that China is far removed from Marx's original concept of Communism, but according to the Chinese it is still Communism and the biggest Communist country in the world.

China is communist in the same sense that North Korea is democratic.

[Harleyman 12]

You just argued that:

 

"The worst thing that could happen is if some govt bureaucrat took over the [government] plan. No thanks"

 

That is an argument only a lunatic can make.

 

I was talking about the idea of an American equal to the NHS in which the complete health system would be administered by the Federal government and which would be a monumental disaster.

I would have to wait 3 years for any non-life threatening surgery just like my old dad did under the NHS.

It will never happen but if the present system was abolished in favour of a UK type system the cost would be astronomical and taxes would skyrocket to pay for it. Compared to what healthcare costs now, which is costly enough, a national health care system would probably be unsustainable after a decade or so.

Canada's national healthcare system is already in trouble and that with a population of only 34 million.

[plekhanov 10]

I was talking about the idea of an American equal to the NHS

Well then you expressed your self in the manner of a particularly ill-informed crazy person.

 

in which the complete health system would be administered by the Federal government and which would be a monumental disaster.

The British state provides comprehensive healthcare for it's entire population for a fraction of the cost of what your country pays for patchy coverage of part of the population. If the British state can manage this why would it be beyond the government which put a man on the moon?

 

I would have to wait 3 years for any non-life threatening surgery just like my old dad did under the NHS.

When was this exactly? My wife had a none life threatening back problem recently, she went from GP to specialist within a week then specialist to MRI scan within a month, physiotherapy within a fortnight. All this a zero charge to us in a healthcare system that costs considerably less by any measure than your appallingly inefficient private dominated system.

 

It will never happen but if the present system was abolished in favour of a UK type system the cost would be astronomical and taxes would skyrocket to pay for it. Compared to what healthcare costs now, which is costly enough, a national health care system would probably be unsustainable after a decade or so.

Canada's national healthcare system is already in trouble and that with a population of only 34 million.

Man you really swallow everything Fox News feeds to you don't you.

 

As I have already pointed out to you the UK healthcare system is massively cheaper than yours, if you adopted our system it would cost much, much less than your current disaster of a system.

 

In 2006 the breakdown was as follows:

 

"Health care spending per person per annum: ... UK $2,389; US $5,711"

 

Contrary to what you seem to imagine $2,389 is less not more than $5,711.