Phoenix One

Eurozone crisis 'threatens EU' Herman van Rompuy, the EU president, says 27-nation bloc will not survive if it fails to overcome the debt crisis. Last Modified: 16 Nov 2010 15:37 GMT The European Union will not survive if it fails to overcome a debt crisis plaguing the euro single currency area, the bloc's president Herman Van Rompuy has said. Hours from a meeting of finance ministers in Brussels on Tuesday, Van Rompuy said that the EU and eurozone were in danger from alarm in the financial markets. The meeting was called to grapple with an exploding debt crisis that has already brought Greece to its knees, and now threatens Ireland and Portugal. "We all have to work together in order to survive with the eurozone, because if we don't survive with the eurozone we will not survive with the European Union," Van Rompuy said in a speech in Brussels. Read more: http://english.aljazeera.net/business/2010/11/20101116101849606475.html -------------------------------- The EU and eurozone are fighting to survive with EU President Van Rompuy adding substance that both are under serious threat and fighting to survive. The debt crisis is posing a very real threat to continued survival of euro and EU. The question posed is not will the euro and EU fall but when.

Ireland crisis could cause EU collapse, warns president Herman Van Rompuy, president of the EU, has warned it faces a 'survival crisis', with the risk of contagion spreading from Ireland across the continent * guardian.co.uk, Tuesday 16 November 2010 09.18 GMT The president of the European Union has warned that the EU could collapse unless the debt crisis that is gripping the region is resolved. Herman Van Rompuy, president of the European Council, raised the stakes ahead of this evening's showdown talks between finance ministers in Brussels. With Ireland and Portugal both on the brink of seeking a bailout, Van Rompuy warned that there is a serious risk of contagion spreading across the continent. Read more: http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2010/nov/16/ireland-bailout-government-says-no-need-to-panic --------------------------------- Things are looking very volatile for EU and eurozone.

I recall when Farage (UKIP) informed the people about this, and he did so long before Dispataches went with it. He told everyone publically how he made over a £million over a decade (10 years), but few listened, and when they finally took notice there was enough spin put on it to show him as an offender. Go figure! But your right, UKIP MEP's are among the worst offenders. Note I said among. Lib Dem, Conservatives, New Labour, and even the BNP are all doing it, and amongst the worst offenders. What really embarresses me is fact that the majority of worst offenders are all British MEPs.

I think the following snippet sums up the euro situation quite well. The euro has turned into a bankruptcy machine. Quote: Euro Dominos Will Fall Until Currency Is Split: Matthew Lynn By Matthew Lynn - Nov 16, 2010 12:00 AM GMT Tue Nov 16 00:00:00 GMT 2010 Bloomberg Opinion Who’s next? First Greece went bust. Now Ireland is on the brink of a bailout from the European Union and the International Monetary Fund. When it happens, we’ll hear plenty of soothing words about how contagion has been stopped, the euro area has been put on a firmer footing, and the single currency saved. There will be a lot of grand rhetoric about the importance of the European project. Stern condemnations of the speculators will ring out across the continent. Don’t listen to a word of it. The euro has turned into a bankruptcy machine. Once the markets have finished with Ireland, they will simply move on to Portugal and Spain, and after that to Italy and France. Read more: http://www.bloomberg​.com/news/2010-11-16​/euro-dominos-will-f​all-until-currency-i​s-split-commentary-b​y-matthew-lynn.html

Riding Europe's Gravy Train On the same day the British public heard details of the unprecedented cuts in government spending that will affect almost everyone in the country, taxpayers also learnt they'd have to pay extra hundreds of millions of pounds a year to Brussels, as MEPs voted in favour of an increase in their budget. Calling the proposed 5.9% increase 'completely irresponsible and unacceptable', David Cameron has just managed to get the EU to limit the budget rise to 2.9%. Dispatches reveals that, despite the worldwide credit crunch, it's still possible to get rich out of Europe. The programme details the exceptionally generous package of salary, pension and expenses that MEPs receive and how some have abused the rules to pocket as much cash as possible. While Westminster has tightened up on the expenses system, Brussels still hands out some cash allowances without the need for receipts. The programme also looks at the system of agricultural payments, which are supposed to help those British farmers struggling to earn a livelihood and continue producing food. Dispatches shows how millions of pounds in grants have ended up going to some of the best known - and richest - landowners in the country. Dispatches also examines how money meant to help deprived areas has actually been spent. In one case the programme discovers that hundreds of UK workers are being laid off and their jobs moved to Poland, funded in part by a multi-million-pound European grant. In another case the programme investigates allegations of fraud when a man with a criminal conviction for dishonesty ended up running a project given hundreds of thousands of pounds of EU money. Clips from Riding Europe's Gravy Train: http://www.channel4.com/programmes/dispatches/episode-guide/series-58/episode-4 This episode: Monday 15 Nov 2010 8pm on Channel 4 http://www.channel4.com/programmes/dispatches/4od#3139895

The immigration problem is not unique to UK, and I had ben involved in a number of these debates too. Examples supplied include those from Italy, Ireland, Greece, Germany, Neherland, France, etc. However, noting LOOb's post, I disagree with blaming immigrants, and always have. If I were in many of those countries, I too would take advantage of immigration policies to immigrate to another country to work and provide for my own family. The blame lays squarely with government. Government's elected to represent the best interest of the nation and people within. I, and others within UK, and I think it safe to say the same can be said for citizens of each member state, are largley concerned with their own countries. Note France and Dutch voted against the EU Constitution which was later revamped to Lisbon treaty. Further, the Irish rejected the Lisbon treaty, and were compelled to vote again. Of 27 member states in the EU only Ireland had a referendum on Lisbon treaty, twice. Note eurosceptism is growing throughout Europe, including Germany. In UK there is a growing majority for an in/out referendum on EU, and latest ComRes poll showed 75% of British people wanted the UK to withdraw from EU. I would hardly call such statistics fanciful, and as for links, the given links were to think tanks, and those think tanks support findings with references, direct references, to that of the EU Parliament.

November 8, 2010 Brussels Leak Reveals Britain to Take Major Share of Indian IT Workers Documents leaked from the European Commission reveal the true state of negotiations with India for the preferential admission of IT workers to the EU. The UK's quota for some worker categories is 40% of the entire EU commitment – almost three times that of Germany and almost seven times that of France. Read more: http://www.migrationwatchuk.org/pressReleases

Foreign worker numbers surge to a record 2.4m as Easter Europeans return to Britain Posted by Steve Doughty on Wednesday, October 20th, 2010 at 11:24 am. This summer, the total topped 2.4million for the first time after thousands arrived from abroad in the spring. Some of them were Poles and other Eastern Europeans. * Eastern European workers reaches record of 551,000 * 2.401million non-UK nationals active in the economy The number of foreigners working in Britain has hit an all-time high despite the fragile state of the recovery. This summer, the total topped 2.4million for the first time after thousands arrived from abroad in the spring. Some of them were Poles and other Eastern Europeans who began to return to the UK. The number of Eastern European workers also reached a record – of 551,000. It means the workforce of foreigners has surged by more than a *million in only seven years. By contrast the number of Britons in jobs fell by hundreds of thousands during the recession. The growing total of foreign workers comes at a time of deepening concern over the five million British adults who do not work and the intensification of Government efforts to persuade many that jobs are preferable to a life of benefits dependency. The rush to take jobs in Britain is also adding to immigration and concerns over population growth and overcrowding. Read more: http://www.fmwf.com/taxonomy/smallbusiness/2010/10/foreign-worker-numbers-surge-to-a-record-2-4m-as-easter-europeans-return-to-britain/

That debate belongs to other thread, and I stand by what I said. There is no evidence supporting smoking causes cancer. Believe what you want.

Open Europe publishes another 50 examples of EU waste 10 November 2010 Ahead of a likely agreement on an increase to the 2011 EU budget tomorrow, Open Europe has produced a list of 50 new examples of ‘EU waste’. The list is by no means comprehensive, but designed to show the types of peculiar projects on which the EU has spent money in the past. They give a light-hearted illustration of what is wrong with the EU budget, and the need for fundamental reform. Despite its inherent flaws and the absence of any substantial reform of how or where the money is spent, the EU budget continues to rise year on year. This year, Open Europe has also published a handful of examples of good spending, illustrating that when the EU does focus its attention on where it really adds value, good things can happen. Open Europe Director Mats Persson said: “The EU’s budget is irrational, overly complex and hopelessly out of date. Despite the austerity measures sweeping Europe, huge amounts of money are wasted on projects which do nothing to help the EU economy to get back on track.” “There should be no talk whatsoever of budget increases until the problems with waste and mismanagement in the EU’s spending programmes are stamped out once and for all. MEPs and the Commission need to wake up to the economic reality around them.” “The tragedy is that Europe could do so many good things with this money, such as channelling more of it towards research and development.” Click here to read Open Europe’s list of wasteful EU projects: http://www.openeurope.org.uk/research/top50euwaste2010.pdf http://www.openeurope.org.uk/media-centre/pressrelease.aspx?pressreleaseid=151 -------------------------------- Open Europe is a think tank often accessed by the media. Another is "Statewatch" that monitor the state and civil liberties in Europe [ http://www.statewatch.org/ ]. These two I had accessed often to support debates and threads over the years. Much of what I and others said would happen did, and the information to support such debates came from these, and the archives of EU and UK Parliament.

Extract from government site. The following relates to Quote: Coming to work in the UK Nearly all European Economic Area (EEA) and Swiss nationals are free to enter and live in the United Kingdom without the need to apply for permission. http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Employment/Understandingyourworkstatus/Migrantworkers/DG_181870

I have been watching another debate on another site, which I believe may prove of interest here. Note I did not contribute to that debate. Just watching. Anyway, here is post #1 from that site: 52 Reasons to leave the EU We joined the EU (EEC) in 1972. After 36 years inside we now know: 1. The European Union’s six constitutional treaties build a dictatorship. 2. The EU has the laws of a police state - enforced after the Lisbon Treaty, from 1st January 2009. 3. The EU's 120,000 regulations will bring us a soviet style command economy and abject poverty. 4. Unelected EU dictators will control the nuclear weapons of former nations of Britain and France. 5. The EU 's six treaties will compel us to hand over all our armed forces to the EU. 6. Our armed forces and police have been told they will swear a new oath to the EU, or be fired. 7. The EU’s 120,000 regulations will rigidly control our personal lives - more than any nation in history. 8. EU regulations now cost us £100 billion a year. (Better Regulation Commission annual report 2005) 9. When enforced, those regulations will destroy most of our 4.5 million small businesses. 10. Up to 13.5 million will be unemployed after EU regulations close small businesses. 11. The 120,000 regulations will make us subject to continual arrest (SOCPA 2005). 12. There are now 3,095 "Crimes against the EU state" on the British statute book. 13. We will be stopped on the street for continual checks on our EU ID cards after 2009. 14. The EU’s Constitutional treaties replaced the British Constitution on 1st January 2009. 15. The EU treaties will close our Westminster Parliament after its 5 years expire on 5th May 2010. 16. The EU's Road Pricing and then ID chips will keep the state informed of our exact position. 17. Huge taxes/fines by the EU's Road Pricing, Congestion Charging and global warming policies. 18. The EU Regionalisation Plan will abolish England and our 48 counties in favour of 9 EU regions. 19. The 9 EU regions will report direct to Brussels, not to Westminster, which will be defunct. 20. The EU Regionalisation Plan will abolish our 19,579 councillors. 23. British common law mainly replaced by EU corpus Juris by 1992. Government is now above the law. 21. Police have shot 30 innocent people dead since 1992 and have not been successfully prosecuted. 22. 1,100 deaths in police custody since 1992 and no successful prosecutions. 24. Police Shoot to Kill policy now in force; illegal under British common law, OK under EU corpus juris. 25. EU conceived in Germany from 22nd June 1940 as the EEC - speech by Hermann Goering. 26. First EEC conference Berlin University 1942, 13 nation summit Berlin 1943 run by von Ribbentrop 27. After fall of Germany, the Germans switched the EU from a Nazi to a communist basis in1946. 28. Hitler's Deutsche Verteiderungs Dienst Intelligence Department (DVD) still controls EU development. 29. Edward Heath, Geoffrey Rippon, Roy Jenkins recruited by the DVD in 1958 as saboteurs. 30. DVD has arranged finance to put pro-EU ownerships into British newspaper groups. 31. EU has been sabotaging Britain with German Frankfurt School techniques since the 1950's. 33. The EU's main subversive organisation in Britain, Common Purpose, was run from the ODPM. 34. The EU's Common Purpose has trained 30,000 local leaders for "the post democratic era" 35. Common Purpose has been inside the NHS for 20 years, controls it, and has wrecked it. 36. Common Purpose has 400 staff inside the BBC censoring out anti-EU news and and current affairs. 37. Common Purpose has staff in hundreds of local newspapers censoring out anti-EU news 38. Common Purpose is transferring power from councillors to the unelected council executives. 39. Common Purpose has built the EU gravy trains inside local and national government. 40. Common Purpose has built most of Britain's 8,500 quangos costing us £167 billion pa 41. These quangos bribe compliant, pro EU local officials and businessmen with £150,000+ salaries. 42. EU quangos are the reason your council tax is going through the roof. 43. The EU is utterly corrupt and cannot account for 95% of its expenditure (yes, ninety five % lost) 44. The EU has over 200,000 offshore bank accounts from which it pays bribes. 45. We now lose £45 billion a year trading with the EU. Outside, we had an even balance of payments. 46. EU Constitution is similar to the Soviet. And EU Commissioners similar to Soviet Politburo members. 47. The EU parliament is a sham with no power - just like the old Soviet parliament. 48. The leadership of the Conservative Party has been controlled by the EU since the 1960's. 49. The Labour and Lib Dem leaderships EU controlled for 20 years - that's why your vote doesn't count. 50. The Amsterdam Treaty 1997 gave the EU control of our immigration, now running at 2.6 million pa. 51. Our infrastructure can't cope with the 10 million immigrants the EU has let in since 1997. 52. 380,000 highly qualified British emigrate annually to escape from the EU and its overcrowding.

The folly of mass immigration The argument of the ‘People Flow’ report that mass immigration is normal, irreversible and beneficial to host societies is a damaging illusion. Rather, the current experience of developed western countries, faced with huge inflows of people – refugees, asylum-seekers, economic migrants – from poorer parts of the world, is unprecedented and damaging. The process can and should be stopped, in the interests of the rich diversity of nations it will otherwise crush. Read more: http://www.opendemocracy.net/people-migrationeurope/article_1193.jsp

UK banks as exposed to eurozone troubles 'as France and Germany' 15 November 2010 | By Stefanie Eschenbacher British banks are as exposed to troub*led eurozone nations as their French and German peers, according to the annual International Monetary Fund (IMF) report on Britain. British banks’ exposure to the Greek, Irish, Spanish and Portuguese economies accounts for 14% of national GDP, the same figure as for French and German banks. Britain’s exposure is more concentrated in Ireland, says the IMF, while that of France and Germany is more focused on Greece. http://www.fundstrat​egy.co.uk/markets/uk​-banks-as-exposed-to​-eurozone-troubles-a​s-france-and-germany​/1021484.article -------------------------- Greece not fears default, possible withdrawal from Eurozone in negotiations: PM English.news.cn 2010-11-15 http://news.xinhuane​t.com/english2010/wo​rld/2010-11/15/c_136​06454.htm -------------------------- Portugal Foreign Affairs Minister Threatens "Euro Zone Exit" Sunday, November 14, 2010 3:46 PM http://news.uk.msn.com/forum/thread.aspx?board=00000071-0328-0000-0000-000000000000&thread=cc593a8d-8be3-42c4-9e00-2c255ac2e14b

[1] I stand corrected. [2] I stated as much. So stand by what I said on that issue. [3] I believe that issue is wide open to opinion, and I certainly could not say for certain that your opinion is wrong. Have to wait and see what happens on that issue.