Vance Arnold 'You Better Move On'

[athy 10]

The second half of the Sixries did indeed witness tons of pseudo-sophisticated bands who took themselves far too seriously. If they had talent, they sometimes got away with it.

My dictionary (S.O.D.) does not include your definition of sophomoric. Where did you get it from?

[rubydazzler 11]

My dictionary (S.O.D.) does not include your definition of sophomoric. Where did you get it from?

 

Free Online dikker has this ...

 

soph·o·mor·ic(sf-môrk, -mr-, -mr-)

adj.

1. Of or characteristic of a sophomore.

2. Exhibiting great immaturity and lack of judgment:

 

another from Webster?

 

Function: adjective

1 : conceited and overconfident of knowledge but poorly informed and immature <a sophomoric argument>

2 : of, relating to, or characteristic of a sophomore <sophomoric humor>

 

Sophomoric reasoning - could this also be called "SF reasoning"?

Sophomoric reasoning is rationalizing about what one understands poorly. It's often apologetics (starting with a conclusion). Though not highly regarded, it's superior to parroting aphorisms. If one's understanding is below freshman level, sophomoric reasoning may seem a desirable achievement. Nonetheless it shouldn't be regarded as an educational achievement. Among certain groups it masquerades as "critical thinking".

[athy 10]

Well, s.o.d. my old boots - thanks, Ruby, I have learned something new. As I have spent many years teaching languages, I'm rather ashamed to admit that I had never heard "sophomoric" used in that way; my Shorter Oxford is a fairly modern one (1980's) and does not include that sense of the word at all.

I think, though I am not sure, that Webster's Dictionary is of American origin; as "sophomore" in its more usual sense of "second-year undergraduate" is more widely used over there, so this second meaning may well have developed in the States.

Were Tangerine Ayr soporific as well as sophomoric?

[sirglyn 11]

We seem to have gotten seriously off topic but anyway I just meant that a sophomoric person thinks he knows it all when in fact he doesn't.Maybe 'smartarse' would also be a good description.Now to get a little closer back to the topic,the other co-author of 'Not Like a Proper Job' is Martin Lilleker and a CD featuring Joe's and Delroy's performances from the Mojo rag show comes with the book.Joe sings 'Saved' which was the last number of the night and as they were way behind schedule there were only about 30 people left in the audience so we had to cheer and clap like crazy to make it sound like a lot more.

[athy 10]

I'll check A&R Booksearch to see if they have stock - they are, in my experience, the best mail-order music bookshop around.

[punctualP 10]

Arthur Alexander's version of that song was great, the best version, definitely. I had it on an EP that I got from Violet May's on City Road in 1962/63. Unfortunately, some time later, I left it on the floor near the fire and it warped *sob*

 

I've still got Arthur Alexander's 2 EP's and 1 LP.

Found out about him after coming across his single "Anna" in Violet Mays.

That was after enjoying "Anna" on the Beatles LP.

[rubydazzler 11]

I've still got Arthur Alexander's 2 EP's and 1 LP.

Found out about him after coming across his single "Anna" in Violet Mays.

That was after enjoying "Anna" on the Beatles LP.

 

I'm envying you now ... but carcrash has very kindly offered to make me a copy of "You Bettter Move On" which I'm very much looking forward to hearing it again after so many years.

[WhiteFender 12]

Anybody witnessed Vance Arnorld / Joe Cocker perform "You Better Move On" in 1963? I am writing a chapter in my new Dutch book (the successor to my book "Grijsgedraaid") on that song and am trying to trace how the Rolling Stones got that song. I find Cocker/Arnold singing the song in 1963 (on the 2000 release "Vance Arnold and the Avengers 1963 live", the Stones recorded it end 1963. I also find Cocker played support act to the Hollies (recorded the song on their first album) and the Stones in Sheffield. Any connection there?

I played with Joe for 4 and a half yrs;and was on all his Sheffield City Hall appearances,(An Avenger),I owned the first white Fender in Sheffield,inspired by Bernie Dewry's,Shane Fenton and the Fentones.They all played them.The Shadows had salmon pink Fenders.We played with Wayne Fontana and The Mindbenders,The Hollies,and The Rolling Stones, they were bill toppers and we were 2nd.(Joe bought the record 'You'd better move on'),probably from Violet May's,he spent all his Sat:afternoons in there) He played it to us once at a practise, and told us we were to play it at some pub: or dance that night. I am considering writing a "Joe's early days" book as his official biography is not completely accurate.No disrespect to his author but I was there and he wasn't.He has missed a lot of stories whilst we were on the road from 1961 to 64.

Edited March 13, 2009 by WhiteFender

[athy 10]

Great story, WF!

The Stones got the song 'You Better Move On' from its originator Arthur Alexander; they loved rhythm & blues and bought many of the original US records. Arthur toured Britain about 1964 so maybe they saw him singing it on stage in one of the London clubs.

[mikeG 16]

I played with Joe for 4 and a half yrs;and was on all his Sheffield City Hall appearances,(An Avenger),I owned the first white Fender in Sheffield,inspired by Bernie Dewry's,Shane Fenton and the Fentones.They all played them.The Shadows had salmon pink Fenders.We played with Wayne Fontana and The Mindbenders,The Hollies,and The Rolling Stones, they were bill toppers and we were 2nd.(Joe bought the record 'You'd better move on'),probably from Violet May's,he spent all his Sat:afternoons in there) He played it to us once at a practise, and told us we were to play it at some pub: or dance that night. I am considering writing a "Joe's early days" book as his official biography is not completely accurate.No disrespect to his author but I was there and he wasn't.He has missed a lot of stories whilst we were on the road from 1961 to 64.

 

Hi WF,

You must have played at St Columbas, Crosspool and at the Fleur at Totley. So I must have seen you a few times. Missed the bus once after a Sat. night in the Fleur and tried to walk home to Fulwood. Not a good idea after too many 'Stones'. I was at school, the year above Joe at Lydgate Lane early/mid 50's. I was in the Raiders who played every other week at St. Columbas. Compared to you, we were awful. If you did get round to writing a book I'd certainly buy a copy, as would several of my old mates from Sheffield who I'll be seeing at Chester races in May. Regards, Mike.

[WhiteFender 12]

Hiya Mike. Thanks for reading my "drivel" on Joe.

Yes, we played at St Columbas many times,It was always one of my favourite venues. With Joe being the 'local hero' we always went down 'a storm' there.The Fleur was another place we loved, as you'll remember it was always packed and it was our first 'residency', I think the landlord was a bit worried that the place wasn't big enough for the crowd we used to attract.Re: Your band, unforunately I never saw "The Raiders",also thank you for the compliment but don't forget everybody has to start somewhere. We weren't that good to start with, but we were all dedicated and of course we had "Vance" (Joe) which helped at the time.

Great to hear from ya fella.!!

[Bushbaby 11]

In the last few months, Brian Matthew, on his essential "Sounds of the Sixties" show, has featured both "Anna" and "You'd Better Move On". They are indeed glorious. My mate Blind Trev, whose knowledge of late 50s early 60s music is second to none, rates Arthur very highly. I think it's time for the release of a definitive collection. Who should I pester?