PW Botha,gone but not forgotten.

[plekhanov 10]

You have an extraordinary view of the world which says that black immigration is good and white immigration is bad.

Do you really not understand that I was simply pointing out that if Roy James was genuine in his claims to be a supporter of indigenous rights and not a racist he would have supported the ANC and be calling for PW Botha and all the Afrikaners in South Africa to be deported back to Holland and Britain?

 

The way I see it, PW was representing the interests of those that voted for him and as such was no more culpable for apartheid policies as the couple of million pro-apartheid white electorate.

Of course he’s more culpable, he personally ordered and presided over mass human rights abuses, many whites in South Africa are tainted by guilt for apartheid but PW Botha spent his entire adult life in politics fighting to preserve apartheid and also gain personal power.

 

He is no great loss to the world but he hasn't been relevant since 1990. I find the personal nature of the attacks on him a bit odd.

Those attacks are made in the context of a thread started praising PW Botha as a ‘good man’ when he was clearly anything but, do you really think it odd that people would react negatively to praise for a man who dedicated his life to denying the blacks of South Africa their human rights?

[Tricky 10]

Do you really not understand that I was simply pointing out that if Roy James was genuine in his claims to be a supporter of indigenous rights and not a racist he would have supported the ANC and be calling for PW Botha and all the Afrikaners in South Africa to be deported back to Holland and Britain?

 

The black people formerly represented by Mr Mandela are no more indigenous than the white people formerly represented by Mr Botha, certainly in the Cape region. What I objected to was the assumption that blacks had more right to settle the area than whites.

 

Whether you want to react to Roy James' posts is up to you, but phrases like "...he was a member of an immigrant community and headed a government which brutally suppressed the indigenous population..." undermines the validity of your post.

[Cuddly Boy 10]

can we stop this stuff about racism and show some respect? whatever you think of him a former world leader has died and many people admired and respected him

[plekhanov 10]

The black people formerly represented by Mr Mandela are no more indigenous than the white people formerly represented by Mr Botha, certainly in the Cape region.

And outside the Malay population? On what grounds do you claim that the Black African population is no more indigenous than descendents of European immigrants?

 

What I objected to was the assumption that blacks had more right to settle the area than whites.

I made no such assumption I was simply pointing out the inconsistently in Roy’s claimed positions.

 

Whether you want to react to Roy James' posts is up to you, but phrases like "...he was a member of an immigrant community and headed a government which brutally suppressed the indigenous population..." undermines the validity of your post.

On what grounds do you make this claim?

[Tomataheeed 10]

can we stop this stuff about racism and show some respect? whatever you think of him a former world leader has died and many people admired and respected him

 

Respect? I'm not revelling in his death, but I haven't changed my opinion of the man just because he's met his maker. He wasted his life spreading hate.

[plekhanov 10]

can we stop this stuff about racism and show some respect?

PW Botha is being given all the respect an unrepentant white supremacist and serial violator of human rights deserves.

 

whatever you think of him a former world leader has died

What difference does it make that he’s died? He was a hateful bigot to the last.

 

and many people admired and respected him

So what if they did?

[seriessix 10]

can we stop this stuff about racism and show some respect? whatever you think of him a former world leader has died and many people admired and respected him

 

 

I think not - his passing has recieved a very muted reception in S.A.

[scottf 21]

lol- roy certainly knows how to get everyone going!!

[TeaFan 10]

The only good white supremacist is a dead one.

[Heyesey 11]

PW Botha is being given all the respect an unrepentant white supremacist and serial violator of human rights deserves.

 

 

How much respect is due to a politician who abolished the hated Pass Laws, legalised inter-racial marriages, and permitted the formation of trade unions for blacks?

 

 

He wasn't entirely a devil. In hindsight, he may have done as much for the black cause as he could possibly have got away with at the time; certainly he took the first steps on a long, difficult road that, eventually, led to South Africa being the *only* country which has emerged from imperial Africa without a civil war of some kind or other. We'd all like it to have happened earlier, and faster; but at least it happened, and he gets some of the credit for making it happen.

 

Offset against that credit is a long, LONG list of evils which were still perpetrated in his time. I just think we should bear in mind that things aren't often so - excuse the pun - black and white.

[royjames 10]

lol- roy certainly knows how to get everyone going!!

 

Hey just trying to stimulate good conversation:hihi: I will raise a toast to the man.

[Halibut 12]

Hey just trying to stimulate good conversation:hihi: I will raise a toast to the man.

 

Without responding to any of the questions your wholehearted support of the man has raised; no surprises there then.