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Why Is Sheffield So Far Behind Many Other Uk Cities?

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3 minutes ago, SheffieldForum said:

It wouldn't feasibly go up Brook Hill I don't think - I would imagine it would be easier to have it run straight along Glossop Road from the existing track where it turns from the West Street side of Glossop Road towards the University Roundabout. A stop for the Hallamshire would be on Glossop Road/B6547 near the multi-storey car park, I'd imagine in this scenario.

 

I think it would be fairly easy then to run up towards Broomhill and maybe out to either Crosspool or Fulwood (or even up to Crookes)? 

 

If the NIMBYs didn't complain of course...

I'd suspect that would be a certainty.   

 

Firstly, you are going to need to be stopping both directions of traffic on hanover way every time a tram needs to cross. Even now just with a cross over one side it causes mayhem and blocks the roundabouts.  

 

There would need remodeling of Glossop Road to fit in the tram stops plus the concern of traffic which occurs when people are entering the side roads and back out of the hospital.   At busy periods now it can take long enough to get out  with cats backed up all the way to the multi-story exit.  I can only imagine what it would be like with frequent trams stopping and blocking up the road until they are ready to leave.   

 

In a perfect world, the whole thing should have gone underground but of course being Sheffield geographically that's not easy as our landscape doesn't really equate to mass underground tunnels sprawling all over the city.  Certainly not without great expense and complex engineering.

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1 hour ago, SheffieldForum said:

I would make more sense for the Tram to run to Stocksbridge on the train tracks wouldn't it?

Only because there’s an existing line / track bed to use.

 

The problem with that approach, is that to maximise the benefits of a tram extension, it needs to run close enough to a sufficient number of people. The generally accepted standard is that people won’t walk much more than 400m to access public transport.

 

The existing rail line is located some distance  from most of the settlements on that route, so many people who live out there would probably not find it useful.

 

The level of benefits you can achieve will impact on the benefit / cost ratio which is a key factor in government funding decisions. Schemes normally need to achieve a “Good” benefit cost ratio which means producing monetised benefits of twice the scheme cost over the appraisal period ( usually 60 years).

 

The initial line of the midlands metro tram system ran up an existing rail line and didn’t get good passenger numbers.

 

Personally, I’d doubt whether a tram extension out to Stockbridge would be viable.

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4 hours ago, RollingJ said:

Then why even mention it - although I do acknowledge that even you accept it is a crazy idea?

There's nothing crazy about the idea. It's the lack of money and the disruption that will stop it happening. But then you can apply that to anything. 

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Just now, Anna B said:

There's nothing crazy about the idea. It's the lack of money and the disruption that will stop it happening. But then you can apply that to anything. 

Italicised bit - there's lots crazy about it.

 

Emboldened bit - exactly.

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20 minutes ago, RollingJ said:

Italicised bit - there's lots crazy about it.

 

Emboldened bit - exactly.

Are you suggesting that the council give a fig about disruption?

They certainly didn't care when they built the original tram network.

Edited by Anna B

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Just now, Anna B said:

Are you suggesting that the council ive a fig about disruption?

They certainly didn't care when they built the original tram network.

Slow to learn as they are, they are learning, but the 'proposal' above is impractical anyway, and they know it.

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4 hours ago, Anna B said:

Are you suggesting that the council give a fig about disruption?

They certainly didn't care when they built the original tram network.

The council didn’t build the tram network. It was the PTE. A completely different organisation

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7 hours ago, Planner1 said:

The council didn’t build the tram network. It was the PTE. A completely different organisation

But, to be a little pedantic, the City Council must have agreed the plan?

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My retired parents walk half a mile to the tram stop regularly.
Outer areas would use trams if bicycles were allowed to park or be racked on trams

 44849_stuttgartstadlerzt4.2racktram3_509

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2 hours ago, RollingJ said:

But, to be a little pedantic, the City Council must have agreed the plan?

Yes, they are the highway authority so need to approve any work in the highway, same as for any proposals which involve that.

 

Installing a tram system in an urban environment will entail a lot of disruption.
 

Construction methods have evolved since Supertram was built to try to reduce this, but, as we have seen elsewhere like in Edinburgh and Nottingham, it still causes significant disruption. It’s something you have to factor into decision making and stakeholder engagement and be open about.

 

Tram systems are still seen as being worth the disruption and effort though.

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2 hours ago, Findlay said:

My retired parents walk half a mile to the tram stop regularly.
Outer areas would use trams if bicycles were allowed to park or be racked on trams

 44849_stuttgartstadlerzt4.2racktram3_509

Yeah some will walk further, others won’t or can’t. It’s a rule of thumb. 
 

People planning mass transit systems do look closely at how far people will have to walk to get to stops as it directly affects the business case and benefits calculations.

 

Cycle facilities would be considered a lot more now than they might have in the past when our tram system was designed and built. The issue of taking cycles on our trams  has been looked at in recent years I believe, but they decided against it.

 

Where is the pic?

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9 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

 

Tram systems are still seen as being worth the disruption and effort though.

By whom? Although the Sheffield one doesn't appear (from my observations) to cause significant problems in operation, they are restricted on where they go, and, as you should know, quite expensive to construct and maintain.

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