Caswall   7 #37 Posted October 14, 2021 9 minutes ago, altus said: No it doesn't - the government says it applies to all roads. These rules weren't made up by some militant cycling organisation - they are from The Department of Transport. I didn't suggest the rule only applies to narrow lanes - I meant to need to hog the middle only applies then, but cyclists often do so from poor (or selfish and stubborn) judgement when keeping left would allow safe space for an overtake. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Rockers rule   673 #38 Posted October 14, 2021 9 hours ago, Findlay said: When I ride my bike to work, like people drive to work, I am often greeted with "Get to the edge of the road!"  I am not going to ride in the gutter    2 hours ago, Carbuncle said: Motorists and cyclists don't belong on the same road lanes.  Truth is, our roads aren't fit for purpose. Where we are, there are some excellent cycle/ pedestrian friendly routes. We ain't got the topography of Sheffield & as a general rule cyclist and pedestrians coexist on, not all pavements, but those where roads are busy.  I cycle, ride & drive & the state of our roads especially the gutters are hardly fit for any of us. So back on subject, should shouting at a cyclist be a specific hate crime? NO. The percentage of bad and inconsiderate cyclist and car drivers must be about level, there are good and bad in both.  Keep safe out there    Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
altus   540 #39 Posted October 14, 2021 2 minutes ago, Caswall said: I didn't suggest the rule only applies to narrow lanes - I meant to need to hog the middle only applies then, but cyclists often do so from poor (or selfish and stubborn) judgement when keeping left would allow safe space for an overtake. (Some) Motorists often from poor (or selfish and stubborn) judgement attempt overtakes when it's not safe (for the cyclist) for them to do so. It's a lot easier to decide an overtake is safe if you're in a metal box and are not the one who will suffer the effects of you getting it wrong. That is why the government have made the rules they have. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
cuttsie   1,091 #40 Posted October 14, 2021 so who kills who on the roads , lets have some stats eh . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Rockers rule   673 #41 Posted October 14, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, cuttsie said: so who kills who on the roads , lets have some stats eh . As a recovery driver I've picked up a lot more damaged cars than cycles I think the percentage will show car drivers have the edge on killing themselves.  Keep safe out there Edited October 14, 2021 by Rockers rule additional info Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Delbow   700 #42 Posted October 14, 2021 1 hour ago, Caswall said: Unfortunately your sense of entitlement and selfish attitude, deliberately obstructing car drivers by driving in the middle of the lane, is exactly why so many drivers loathe cyclists.  As someone who cycles and drives, it's not entitlement to move out into the road to block an unsafe overtake, it's self-defence. The classic is the approach to a traffic island. Some drivers think they can safely squeeze in between a cycle and a traffic island - safe for them maybe, not for me. So I will move out to close that option off, soon as I'm past the island I'll move back in so you can overtake. If there are people so emotionally fragile that this ruins their whole day, there's therapy and/or buses Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Guest sibon   #43 Posted October 14, 2021 2 hours ago, Caswall said: Unfortunately your sense of entitlement and selfish attitude, deliberately obstructing car drivers by driving in the middle of the lane, is exactly why so many drivers loathe cyclists.  No.  Some drivers loathe cyclists because they are nobs.  The drivers, I mean. Not the cyclists.  A cyclist is entitled to ride anywhere in the lane. A motorist, in charge of a tonne of metal should have the skill to pass safely, or a lot of patience.  When did you become the most important person on the road? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Findlay   116 #44 Posted October 14, 2021 It goes without saying that the majority of drivers are good people willing to share the road with other road users and can spare the time to overtake safely. What we are talking about here is a minority of drivers that cause someone to be injured or killed every day on Sheffield's roads. No cyclist is Sheffield has caused death or serious injury or even the threat of serious injury so the argument for a reflective hate crime is ludicrous. If a same sex couple holding hands is set upon by someone who doesn't agree with their lifestyle how is that different from someone intentionally driving or pushing them off their bike because they don't like their mode of transport or their position on the road? Archaic driving laws are not fit for purpose. Getting points on a licence is not going to solve the social problem so making the attitude socially unacceptable will work better. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
RollingJ   2,040 #45 Posted October 14, 2021 2 minutes ago, Findlay said: It goes without saying that the majority of drivers are good people willing to share the road with other road users and can spare the time to overtake safely. What we are talking about here is a minority of drivers that cause someone to be injured or killed every day on Sheffield's roads. No cyclist is Sheffield has caused death or serious injury or even the threat of serious injury so the argument for a reflective hate crime is ludicrous. If a same sex couple holding hands is set upon by someone who doesn't agree with their lifestyle how is that different from someone intentionally driving or pushing them off their bike because they don't like their mode of transport or their position on the road? Archaic driving laws are not fit for purpose. Getting points on a licence is not going to solve the social problem so making the attitude socially unacceptable will work better. Bolded bit - you have documented proof of that claim? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Findlay   116 #46 Posted October 14, 2021 https://roadtraffic.dft.gov.uk/custom-downloads/road-accidents/  Accident year Casualty severity Local authority Road user Casualties  2020 Slightly injured Sheffield Pedestrian 85  2020 Seriously injured Sheffield Pedestrian 57  2020 Killed Sheffield Pedestrian 3  2020 Slightly injured Sheffield Pedal cycle 83  2020 Seriously injured Sheffield Pedal cycle 40  2020 Seriously injured Sheffield Motorcycle 28  2020 Slightly injured Sheffield Motorcycle 27  2020 Killed Sheffield Motorcycle 2  2020 Seriously injured Sheffield Car (Includes taxis and minibus) 114  2020 Slightly injured Sheffield Car (Includes taxis and minibus) 470  2020 Killed Sheffield Car (Includes taxis and minibus) 3  2020 Slightly injured Sheffield Bus or coach 31  2020 Seriously injured Sheffield Bus or coach 5  2020 Seriously injured Sheffield Van / Goods 3.5 tonnes mgw or under 1  2020 Slightly injured Sheffield Van / Goods 3.5 tonnes mgw or under 12  2020 Slightly injured Sheffield HGV 2  2020 Slightly injured Sheffield Other vehicle 5  2020 Seriously injured Sheffield Other vehicle 2      970  Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
RollingJ   2,040 #47 Posted October 14, 2021 OK - from last years figures, I accept that 123 were slightly/seriously injured, but unless the year has got shorted to 4 months, that is not 'every day' and I note there are no pedal cyclist deaths reported. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Jim117   72 #48 Posted October 14, 2021 Many moons ago when I was a motorcycle instructor we used to teach riders to ride in the middle of the lane. The rationale was that you were midway between hazards. Eg. Dozy pedestrians stepping off the kerb and oncoming traffic. The thing is even a learner motorcycle is easily capable of keeping up with traffic flow and hence is not slowing anyone down. I personally advised people not to get a 50cc moped restricted to 30mph at 16 years old. Fast enough to get into trouble but not fast enough to get you out. I get the advice to cyclists and don’t close pass them but Jesus Christ guys, if you are a recreational cyclist and think it’s okay to plod up Baslow hill with a half mile of traffic grinding along in second gear behind you then you really need to have a good think about that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...