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New Road Needed To City Centre

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1 hour ago, Rockers rule said:

I could do with a Counselor.

 

So, come the day all the 'air polluting' cars have gone leaving only electric cars and those who's pollution is 'acceptable' .

& no one is paying more than £20 as a contribution to the  wear and tear of the roads they are using. The amount of tax  'We 

all pay for the upkeep of the roads'  will have to be increased to compensate for the lack of revenue.

 

The fallacy that electric cars, don't make as much impact on a road surface than a car with the same size of wheels weight and floor plan,

is hog wash.  

 

Explain the tax based on emissions being 'perfectly acceptable and the Governments ever so nice decision for us Classic Car owners 

with vehicles that require no MOT, pay no Road tax and qualify for very good deals on cheap insurance.

 

As a recovery driver I don't think there is much you can tell me about crashed vehicles and the cost to repair them.

Of course the magical 'Electric' car is going to be exempt from crashes once we have the perfect road net work.

 

Keep safe i'm off to buy a Smart car.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Why are you discussing car crashes in relation to electric cars? Has anybody suggested they would be less susceptible to crashes?

 

Why are you discussing wear and tear in relation to electric cars, who has suggested that wear and tear is any different?

 

I would imagine that once electric cars are more common, specific taxation on them will increase to fill the gap in tax income.

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1 hour ago, carosio said:

 

Even if private motoring ended tomorrow, that same road infrastructure would still have to be maintained to a good standard for use by the police, ambulance, fire service, taxis, vans, buses, lorries (electric or not) and lots of cyclists, and there would be a big increase in delivery vehicles to plug the gap left by private cars.

 

Well, the more people and deliveries that use bikes and cargo bikes the better for the road because the downward pressure of a vehicle is exponential depending on weight; the downforce of a person on a bike is a minute fraction of that of the same person in a car (and even though the cargo would be weighty, the cargo bikes themselves are much lighter than their van counterparts).

 

You seem to be suggesting the extra buses and delivery vans would add up to the same amount of wear & tear as the cars they replace, but that doesn't seem to play out in reality in cities which have forged ahead with reducing car dependancy.

 

Whatever the situation with wear & tear, it definitely would lead to fewer vehicles overall and of course bikes take up a fraction of the space cars do, both on the road and in terms of parking. Imagine the section of Ecclesall Road from Pomona Street to the ring-road, but with just buses and a few delivery vans & lots of cyclists using. You wouldn't need half the space it takes up now. And then start imaging the land you save by not needing half the parking space for cars.

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True, likely to be less wear, although wind, rain, snow and ice, salt and floods will still do its damage nevertheless.

 

I suspect that many of the cars and some vans/lorries travelling down Eccy Rd will not so much be going to city center, but on longer journeys to join Parkway/motorway or A61.

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1 hour ago, Rockers rule said:

I could do with a Counselor.

 

So, come the day all the 'air polluting' cars have gone leaving only electric cars and those who's pollution is 'acceptable' .

& no one is paying more than £20 as a contribution to the  wear and tear of the roads they are using. The amount of tax  'We 

all pay for the upkeep of the roads'  will have to be increased to compensate for the lack of revenue.

 

The fallacy that electric cars, don't make as much impact on a road surface than a car with the same size of wheels weight and floor plan,

is hog wash.  

 

Explain the tax based on emissions being 'perfectly acceptable and the Governments ever so nice decision for us Classic Car owners 

with vehicles that require no MOT, pay no Road tax and qualify for very good deals on cheap insurance.

 

As a recovery driver I don't think there is much you can tell me about crashed vehicles and the cost to repair them.

Of course the magical 'Electric' car is going to be exempt from crashes once we have the perfect road net work.

 

Keep safe i'm off to buy a Smart car.

I don't know where half of what you're going on about there has come from?!

 

EVs pay less tax because they impact air pollution less. Nothing to do with the wear & tear on the roads. In fact, you're right, they still create noise pollution and create particle pollution from brakes and tyre friction etc. More in fact, some people argue, because the batteries are so heavy so, like-for-like EVs tend to be heavier than petrol counterparts.

 

I dare say you're right about revenues from fuel duty and tax. I suspect as CO2 emissions become less of an issue as more people use EVs, then Vehicle Tax may be changed to be based on vehicle weight and potentially dimensions, in order to 'tax' based on wear & tear of the roads.

 

The only green car is no car at all. But all things considered, if we could snap our fingers and theoretically replace every petrol/diesel car overnight with electric, that would be a good thing to do. The pros just about outweigh the cons. I'd still try to encourage people to try and leave their electric cars at home though because of all the other impacts on society that they still have, and the production of battery technology and of course the source power from power stations is still questionable.

 

No one said EVs had fewer crashes, or caused less damage when they crash?! I was talking about car crash damaged compared to the damage bikes, pedestrians do, and fewer crash occurrences compared to those involving public transport vehicles.. The more people out of cars and on to bikes, buses and walking, then the fewer  crashes and a massive reduction in money lost to damage on our roads.

 

As a man in the industry, do you know how much money is spent each year in the UK on recovering cars & vans following crashes, compared to how much is spent on recovering bicycles?

 

 

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I'm 62.  I've never learned to drive and therefore never owned a car.  Perfectly happy with all that. Cars are necessary to some but a luxury (and in some cases a penis extension) to many more. 

 

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What a load of futuristic, simplistic idealist nonsense and something that is never going to happen in our lifetime, Thankfully.

Sheffield's topography is hardly Cycle friendly and don't pretend it is. 

Me and my brother used to cycle from Highfields as youngster usually to the rocks at Burbage Edge and as far as Castleton.

Did we ride all the way - No. the end part of Psalter lane, the B'tm part of Ringinglow Rd and back up from Hathersage would be were the push part of 'push bike' comes in.

Who are all these cyclists that are magically going to appear?

People going to the many cutlery firms? and other places of mass employment? the ones that no longer exist!

We've all seen grainy footage of hoards of bicyclist flooding out of the factory gates, and they are exactly that, scenes from a distant age.

Most people worked near to where they lived so cycling or walking wasn't a problem.

I used to work at the S&E Archer Rd complex, a major employer at the time and often ran or cycled from Highfields to Millhouses.

4am starts and no public transport left no other option (pre 1st motorcycle).

Back on Subject. The need for a new road into the city centre was more about highlighting the build up of traffic and congestion around Woodseats and Meadowhead (other areas have since been included) and solving that problem.

The 'New Rd' question has been answered - there is no feasible place where a 'New Rd' could be built.

Encouraging people onto busses (even totally ignoring how Coronavirus continues to affected peoples movements) in theory is a great idea, but the practicalities and why so many people are suddenly going to want to use public transport or cycle just doesn't make sense.

Do more people want to go 'Shopping' into the city centre by bus? hardly practical, 'full shop' and compete with others for space on the return journey, when so many 'shopping' centres are nearer to home, offer free parking and excellent choice of goods not only food, all in one place. 

Pedestrianise  Ecclesall Rd, except for goods vehicles, cycles and buss' then what?

Where does all the traffic from Greystones, Ecclesall rd south and surrounding areas get routed to????

Sorry I forgot they'll be on the 'Buss' or cycling, silly me!

I can just see the more affluent of Fullwood, Ranmoor and Lodge moor after a hard day at the office pushing their bicycles back home.

 

Are you one of the secret Cyclist?

The ones polishing their mighty steeds just waiting for all of Sheffield's many Hills to magically flatten themselves overnight.

Best of luck! don't hold your breath.

 

Martin C at 62 i'm glad you don't need that extension.

Me I'm off to buy a 4.2 Jag🧐:blush::hihi:8)

 

Keep safe

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Rockers rule said:

Are you one of the secret Cyclist?

not so secret.

 

i drive most journeys, almost entirely because there are so few safe routes.

 

(the hills are no problem at all, bikes have gears)

 

i'd be very happy to make more journeys by bike, it's simply the danger from vehicles that puts me off.

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2 hours ago, Rockers rule said:

 

Sheffield's topography is hardly Cycle friendly and don't pretend it is. 

Me and my brother used to cycle from Highfields as youngster usually to the rocks at Burbage Edge and as far as Castleton.

Did we ride all the way - No. the end part of Psalter lane, the B'tm part of Ringinglow Rd and back up from Hathersage would be were the push part of 'push bike' comes in.

 

 

Sheffield's topography is fine, a cycle with appropriate gearing will get up any hill here.

The biggest problem for cyclists, by far, is the gross excess in motorised transport which is highly dangerous for cyclists.

During the first lockdown when the roads were almost empty of cars, I did LOADS of cycling- often heading out to places like Oughtibridge with it's very steep hills- no problem as I have appropriate gearing.

I cycle much less now, because it carries too much risk from the gross excess in motorised transport which has now become the norm again.

2 hours ago, Rockers rule said:

 

Me and my brother used to cycle from Highfields as youngster usually to the rocks at Burbage Edge and as far as Castleton.

Did we ride all the way - No. the end part of Psalter lane, the B'tm part of Ringinglow Rd and back up from Hathersage would be were the push part of 'push bike' comes in.

 

 

Then you nad your brother didn't have appropriate gearing for steep hills- if you did, you'd have had no problems cycling up them.

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3 minutes ago, ads36 said:

not so secret.

 

i drive most journeys, almost entirely because there are so few safe routes.

 

(the hills are no problem at all, bikes have gears)

 

i'd be very happy to make more journeys by bike, it's simply the danger from vehicles that puts me off.

Even with gears, you'd tackle the likes of Woodseats Rd and progress on to Scarsdale Rd?

Meersbrook Rd etc, etc, etc, etc.

1 minute ago, onewheeldave said:

Sheffield's topography is fine, a cycle with appropriate gearing will get up any hill here.

 

Then you nad your brother didn't have appropriate gearing for steep hills- if you did, you'd have had no problems cycling up them.

Rubbish 

&

Nothing wrong with 3sd Sturmey Archer

 

End of.

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2 minutes ago, Rockers rule said:

Even with gears, you'd tackle the likes of Woodseats Rd and progress on to Scarsdale Rd?

Meersbrook Rd etc, etc, etc, etc.

 

Can, and do. Along with Blake street and basically any hill in sheffield with a road on it- straightforward with low enough gearing.

3 minutes ago, Rockers rule said:

 

Rubbish 

&

Nothing wrong with  

 

End of.

No, 3sd Sturmey Archer has lots of merits- simple, very low maintenance, good range [for 3 gears].

However most bikes with 3sd Sturmey Archer are not going to be geared for steep hills.

I don't see why a bike with 3sd Sturmey Archer couldn't be modified so the gearing is low enough to do steep hills- simply swap the front chainring to something very small [don't know if the range would be workable in terms of having a useable top gear though].

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Commuting Sheffield by bike is just fine, the problems that people bang on about are imaginary - just ask a cyclist! Heeley Bottom to Meadowhead is faster on a bike at rush hour (in BOTH directions) than it is in a vehicle.

 

Most people's commute is mainly on the flat valley bottom with one hill, in one direction, once a day, if they happen to live on one. The advent of electric bikes turns hills into a non-issue, even the wheeziest of lard arses can get up City Road on one of those.

 

Most people are just lazy articles who find it easier to jump in the car, and I include myself in that!

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1 hour ago, Rockers rule said:

Even with gears, you'd tackle the likes of Woodseats Rd and progress on to Scarsdale Rd?

Meersbrook Rd etc, etc, etc, etc.

yes.

 

occasionally i have to go up Conduit, that'll get me off and walking.

 

but remember that walking is still progress, and hills are faster in the other direction (!) meaning the average speed is largely unaffected.

 

one of reasons i *do* cycle is that it's faster than driving.

 

(and much less frustrating : it's good steady progress all the way - no stop start crawling queueing rubbish)

Edited by ads36

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