New Road Needed To City Centre

[ads36 217]

13 hours ago, ECCOnoob said:

But people need to get around. Goods need to be transported. Services need to be maintained. Utilities have to be installed an upgraded. That ain't been done on the back of the bike.

can you please point at the bit where *anyone* has said we need to bin all vehicular transport ?

 

merely invest in the alternatives.

 

no city has ever 'beaten' congestion by making it easier to drive. Many have tried, many keep trying, it's a 100% failure rate.

 

People already do use the bus, they already do cycle, they already do use the tram, they already do walk. We don't need much of a nudge for those numbers to increase. The more we invest, the bigger the nudge.

 

more people *not* driving - there's your increased capacity for those journey where a vehicle is necessary.

 

Sheffield's road network is pretty good, it's simply full of cars. One more lane here and there won't fix anything. 

[dutch 68]

This topic is a joke. I have driven through several American and Canadian and Asian cities. Long time ago and even then they where a lot worse than Sheffield has ever been.

I remember approaching one of them around evening rush hour and all of a sudden the sky above became one black bubble from the exhaust fumes.

Sheffield roads are so much better but you do not know this until you have seen really worse. 

Keep on wasting energy miserable dreaming for better. I will use my energy happy Sheffield has far nicer better roads than other places I have seen before. 

Only thing Sheffield is worse at are its potholes but with some decent suspension and tires thats ok.

[Bargepole23 337]

33 minutes ago, ads36 said:

can you please point at the bit where *anyone* has said we need to bin all vehicular transport ?

 

merely invest in the alternatives.

 

no city has ever 'beaten' congestion by making it easier to drive. Many have tried, many keep trying, it's a 100% failure rate.

 

People already do use the bus, they already do cycle, they already do use the tram, they already do walk. We don't need much of a nudge for those numbers to increase. The more we invest, the bigger the nudge.

 

more people *not* driving - there's your increased capacity for those journey where a vehicle is necessary.

 

Sheffield's road network is pretty good, it's simply full of cars. One more lane here and there won't fix anything. 

Exactly this. Same tired arguments are churned out time and again, "What about such and such who needs to carry xyz to do their job, can't be done on a bus etc etc". One size doesn't fit all and nobody has ever suggested it should or can.

[Mr Bloke 1,445]

32 minutes ago, ads36 said:

can you please point at the bit where *anyone* has said we need to bin all vehicular transport ?

 

merely invest in the alternatives.

 

no city has ever 'beaten' congestion by making it easier to drive. Many have tried, many keep trying, it's a 100% failure rate.

 

People already do use the bus, they already do cycle, they already do use the tram, they already do walk. We don't need much of a nudge for those numbers to increase. The more we invest, the bigger the nudge.

 

more people *not* driving - there's your increased capacity for those journey where a vehicle is necessary.

 

Sheffield's road network is pretty good, it's simply full of cars. One more lane here and there won't fix anything. 

Hmmm...

I think you've just put your finger on it...

 

... the roads are so good that too many people enjoy using them!

 

What we need is to dig a few of them up leaving massive potholes and turning the whole network into a mass of single lane bridleways.

 

People will immediately decide that they're not going to risk damage to their brand new Duracell powered people carrier and will instead opt for a far more reliable trip on public transport - which presumably will also need to be downgraded to donkey taxi to cope with the conditions...

[RollingJ 2,029]

31 minutes ago, Mr Bloke said:

Hmmm...

I think you've just put your finger on it...

 

... the roads are so good that too many people enjoy using them!

 

What we need is to dig a few of them up leaving massive potholes and turning the whole network into a mass of single lane bridleways.

 

People will immediately decide that they're not going to risk damage to their brand new Duracell powered people carrier and will instead opt for a far more reliable trip on public transport - which presumably will also need to be downgraded to donkey taxi to cope with the conditions...

As usual, you get it spot on @Mr Bloke👍🤣

[Tony 10]

16 hours ago, Findlay said:

We don't need any more roads, we need people to use them more efficiently and plan start times for large businesses so they don't clog up roads at peak times.

Agreed, and if I could add that this is entirely in the council's gift to;

1. Stagger school-day start and finish times,
2. Stagger term start / end dates,
3. Create and enforce no-drive zones around schools at the start and end of the day. 

A genuinely creative council might even have schools operating seven days a week. 

 

They would also ensure that every school had a walk / cycle policy with facilities on the premises to encourage it while implementing policies and traffic control measures that make it as inconvenient as possible for kids to be driven to school.

[Tony 10]

 

Sadly just about all our politicians can't see further than the next round of council elections and they are scared stiff that actually doing something will lose a few hundred votes. Instead they just find endless opportunities to get their face in the paper and on social media banging on about how much they care, declaring a pseudo "climate emergency" while not actually doing anything meaningful. 

 

And I throw that accusation at every single party currently sitting in Sheffield's council chamber - ALL of them.

[Rockers rule 673]

20 hours ago, HeHasRisen said:

You are comparing it with what it was maybe 40 years ago when cars were allowed down it. The Moor has improved quite considerably in, say, the last ten years.

Afternoon HeHasRisen can I be as bold as to use your first name? 'Lord' .

 

I wasn't particularly comparing the Moor from years ago to todays pedestrianised Moor.

The temptation to look back through Rose tinted (might have had a pair of blue tinted ones that i'll admit to) doesn't have to be regarded as a negative or even a way of kidding ourselves things in the past were some how better.

 

We have had the best and most simplistic road network already.

Traffic came into and out of the city through excellent roads for the time.

Abbeydale Rd, London Rd straight up the Moor & out by Snig hill for Hillsborough, Penistone etc, or Attercliffe, Rotherham, Doncaster, etc.

 

Chesterfield Rd, Heely Btm, London Rd or Queens Rd same again the Moor or  Attercliffe, Rotherham etc.

 

Things have moved on, traffic is at an all time high and there have been some excellent improvements (and some illogical ones),

Unstone By-pass taking traffic away from Dronfield, Bochum Parkway removed the need for the dog leg down Norton lane and the improvements to Ridgeway Rd, Prince of Wales Rd, Sheffield Parkway giving better access to Town and the Motorway network are all excellent. Hanover Way, Netherthorpe Rd and onto Penistone Rd again (if it wasn't for the Glossop Rd junction) excellent pieces of road.

 

My point of the Arundel Gate underpass was a good one. For its time it was the bee's knees, moving traffic out of the (now pedestrianised)  town center but giving access to it at the same time but also providing a way of keeping the traffic flowing out of it.

 

What for the Future? 

Woodseats being the original example for this post. Unless as suggested you take a chunk out of greaves Park to join every thing up at Norton and onto Ridgeway Rd by some sort of By-pass.

Other alternatives would be to shove everything (or a proportion) of the traffic down Abbeydale Rd via Woodseats Rd? or up Scarsdale to Norton (turn Chesterfield Rd into a giant one way up from Heeley and Abbeydale into a one way into town).

Ridicules - Correct.

None of these apart from a Greaves Park/ Woodseats by-pass would make sense and would no doubt keep the shop keepers of Woodseats happy. The last thing anyone would want would be to lose its footfall.

Ecclesall rd Hunters bar must be one of the biggest bug bares for Sheffield motorists. 

In theory this is the best road into and out of the city centre at busy times. In reality its a place to be avoided. 

The link into town is excellent  soon as you hit St Mary's Gate/ Hanover Way the choice is yours. 

Peak time the return journey is frustrating to say the least. 

 

So we had the best routes (blue tinted glass') into and out of Sheff.

The increased amount of traffic changed their viability as has some of the strange ideas of the past that didn't quite work.

Shoving all the traffic up Bramhall Lane only to deposit it onto another strange dog leg junction and the strange if not dangerous at Peak times single or duel carriageway Queen's Rd Heeley B'tm piece of road.

(There can't have been many of us who haven't been confronted with a car coming towards us in the wrong lane.)

 

The simple facts, baring total devastation of housing stock (& or the isolation of once prominent shopping areas) to give priority by some sort of futuristic new road system (be it on stilts or not) that not only carries traffic in out, around and to areas now blighted by traffic snarl ups, Sheffield is stuck with the roads we have.

The Geography of Sheffield dictated where roads went and will continue to do so, any chance to do otherwise has long gone.

The insistence we all get on the Bus,Tram or cycle ignoring Sheffield is built on hill's and take time out of any schedule you might have, to lug shopping about at the end of your journey, is ridicules.

Just as Motoring has changed Shopping has changed. weekly wages and the weekly 'shop' are mostly a thing of the past as is running to the corner shop.

Aldi, Liddle, Morrisons with their free parking have enticed people away from Town centre shopping.

Does anyone do a full shop and use the bus or tram to do so? I've no idea. Its certainly something i wouldn't contemplate doing.

 

& the answer is ?

 

so far no one has given a viable one.

 

Keep safe.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ads36 217]

13 minutes ago, Rockers rule said:

The insistence we all get on the Bus,Tram or cycle

*all* ... ?

 

who is saying "all" ?

 

'some' already do, if we made these options better, it would be 'more', - and that would free up road space.

 

...

 

i did say this would happen, it's still fascinating to watch : people's heads start exploding when you suggest spending money on not-car transport options.

Edited September 22, 2021 by ads36

[Rockers rule 673]

2 hours ago, ads36 said:

*all* ... ?

 

who is saying "all" ?

 

'some' already do, if we made these options better, it would be 'more', - and that would free up road space.

 

...

 

i did say this would happen, it's still fascinating to watch : people's heads start exploding when you suggest spending money on not-car transport options.

Me saying "All" 

is the best you can pick me up on?

 

Again another post that has No 'viable' suggestion as to  how we could improve traffic flow be it public or private transport in and around Sheffield.

 

For now, I'll keep the car's, Motorcycles & bicycles & totally avoid public transport, Thanks!

 

(He who dies with the most toys, wins 🧐

 

Keep safe.

[ads36 217]

2 minutes ago, Rockers rule said:

is the best you can pick me up on?

there are only so many hours in a day !

[Andy C 86]

We already have the outer ring road from Meadowhead roundabout that is dual carriageway from where you can drop into the City Centre via City Road or the Parkway. These big roads are busy and congested. Meadowhead roundabout is also problematic with the volume of traffic.

 

To upgrade the road via Woodseats would require either this district shopping centre to be flattened or at least parking banned! Even if this did happen there would still be a bottleneck at Heeley. Abbeydale Road couldn't be upgraded without miles of housing and businesses being flattened.

 

Frankly there is little left that can be done to upgrade the roads capacity and nowhere to put new roads!

 

The worst time for traffic seems to be school run time, is there anything the schools can do to fix that?

 

The solution has to be to reduce the volume of traffic by getting more people to use public transport where that is a viable option.  It needs to be attractive to achieve that including reliable quick journeys. The trains from Dore & Totley and Dronfield stations easily achieve that, for buses to do the same bus lanes need to be present on all the bus roads and in operation (and enforced) all day. Park & Ride is perhaps something we need - the car park at Dronfield unfortunately isn't big enough and pre-covid Dore & Totley's was getting full - however there is also the issue of the train service being too infrequent. Is there potential for a bus users car park near Meadowhead? Or perhaps a tram extension from Herdings Park to a new car park somewhere around Norton?