Council Tax Rise Higher Than Inflation Again.

[apelike 10]

7 hours ago, andyofborg said:

Local democracy used to work. but increasing centralisation in westminster has destroyed that. 

I'm not sure that is the case and I can't understand how westminster has destroyed it either. They have admittedly cut funding but what else have the done to limit or destroy democracy in local councils.

 

7 hours ago, andyofborg said:

Decentralisation would mean that some of the rules wouldn't be set in Westminster any more and those that were would have some flexibility to allow local governement to make decisions in line with local conditions. 

Decentralisation is fine but it just adds another unnecessary layer with new players, new rules and basically has the same outcome. It's just like having a regional Mayor, just a token of appeasement but with limited powers. 

 

7 hours ago, andyofborg said:

The phrase I've underlined is equally applicable to the westminster government. More so in fact. 

I agree but is still does not alter the fact that democratically elected local councils do that and seem to have a dereliction of duty towards their voters even now..

 

7 hours ago, andyofborg said:

I don't dispute that it's archaic and outdated and the decentralisation should be part of a wider constitutional renewal leading to a more federal relationship between the nations and greater regional and local control over appropriate things. 

 

Probably the right reason. As much as we would like to think otherwise there will always be people who take undue advantage of their position in one form or another. Hopefully the various investigations will find the truth in the allegations and the courts will properly deal with any miscreants. 

 

The way to stop that isn't to remove local government that would only centralise the corruption in central government (PPE, track & trace etc.etc.etc.) but strong local government with proper checks and balances. 

But what power has local government ever had since it inception that it now has lost as local councils have always had very limited power as to what they can do.

 

7 hours ago, andyofborg said:

Much of our current problems are of our making. By disengaging from politics the wider population have allowed people who in other times would never get a look in to get in, at both the local and national level. 

 

If you really want things to change then people need to re-engage at a personal level with politics. 

You are probably right but I just can't see that happening as people now have become very complacent and self centered and to achieve what you want would need a major shakeup of politics in the UK.

[andyofborg 11]

1 hour ago, apelike said:

I'm not sure that is the case and I can't understand how westminster has destroyed it either. They have admittedly cut funding but what else have the done to limit or destroy democracy in local councils.

it's not just funding but by limiting the role and powers of local councils in all sorts of areas like council housing, planning, education quite a lot of things really where councils essentially have no control. You only have to look at some of the other threads on here where people blame the council for all sorts of things and many of them turn out not to be in the gift of councils to affect in the slightest. 

 

Eroding the powers of councils, erodes the effect of a local vote and undermines democracy. 

1 hour ago, apelike said:

Decentralisation is fine but it just adds another unnecessary layer with new players, new rules and basically has the same outcome. It's just like having a regional Mayor, just a token of appeasement but with limited powers. 

I'm not a big fan of regional Mayors, but you have to give them or the alternative wider powers and make sure the layers above or below can't interfere except in very exceptional circumstances or where there is evidence of maladministration or corruption.

 

1 hour ago, apelike said:

 

You are probably right but I just can't see that happening as people now have become very complacent and self centered and to achieve what you want would need a major shakeup of politics in the UK.

If people engaged more there would be more scrutiny and interaction with  politicians and possibly encourage politicians to engage with the voters in a more meaningful way. 

 

We have allowed politics to become a career in its own right rather than something people do to help make society  better. We have a large number of politicans and hangers-on who have never done what many people would consider a real job. They have done the university->party worker->advisor->councillor/mp, as a result they have not gained the experience and maturity of being in the real world and that shows.  As a result, they owe their loyalty to the party more than the electorate since the party is the only thing that can give them  career advancement. 

 

If people engaged more it would also hopefully encourage more ordinary people with real-life experience to get involved as councillors and mp's and they would bring experience, perspective and hopefully provide a better balance of loyalties between party and electorate. 

 

[El Cid 214]

9 hours ago, andyofborg said:

Much of our current problems are of our making. By disengaging from politics the wider population have allowed people who in other times would never get a look in to get in, at both the local and national level. 

 

If you really want things to change then people need to re-engage at a personal level with politics.

Small politics has now been replaced to save money, the small council has now been replaced by larger councils. Was Sheffield governed by smaller council pre-1974?

These days people pay their taxes and expect someone to clean the streets, plant the flowers and fill in the pot holes, its not their job to do it.

[apelike 10]

21 minutes ago, andyofborg said:

it's not just funding but by limiting the role and powers of local councils in all sorts of areas like council housing, planning, education quite a lot of things really where councils essentially have no control. You only have to look at some of the other threads on here where people blame the council for all sorts of things and many of them turn out not to be in the gift of councils to affect in the slightest. 

 

Eroding the powers of councils, erodes the effect of a local vote and undermines democracy. 

But what I am trying to get at is have those powers of local councils been eroded or was it the case that they never had them in the first place. SCC for instance now have control over council housing and it is now self funding so in that sense they actually have more control.

 

[andyofborg 11]

12 hours ago, apelike said:

But what I am trying to get at is have those powers of local councils been eroded or was it the case that they never had them in the first place. SCC for instance now have control over council housing and it is now self funding so in that sense they actually have more control.

 

It's taken 40 years to get back to that state though. 

 

Here's a report from 2009, I can't see that things have changed much.

 

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200809/cmselect/cmcomloc/33/33i.pdf

 

 

 

 

[Resident 1,185]

On 24/03/2021 at 10:54, Janus said:

Indeed, that is also how I perceive it.

 

The government spending seems to be bordering on reckless. Instead of good housekeeping, they want us to continue bailing them out, instead of tightening their own belts.

What if I told you a government funded agency has wasted at LEAST £7.8 billion, on average, a year (calculated 2013-18)?

 

Would you say that agency needs investigating and funds withdrawn? 

[Findlay 116]

Glad I'm only in a band B property but I know why it's gone up like everything else.

If you want people to engage in politics, educate people to understand the effects of local politics. 

[apelike 10]

5 hours ago, andyofborg said:

It's taken 40 years to get back to that state though. 

 

Here's a report from 2009, I can't see that things have changed much.

 

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200809/cmselect/cmcomloc/33/33i.pdf

It's a good read and mainly about enhancing local authority powers and changing financial to more to a local level to reflect local needs. That would of course mean a big change in the CT structure but...

 

You say things like "decentralisation and return of powers", "a massive decentralisation of power back to localities", "Local democracy used to work but increasing centralisation in westminster has destroyed that" and "It's taken 40 years to get back to that state though." 

 

You still have not explained what powers the local authorities have lost or that have now been limited in the past 40 years. In fact take it back to the LA Act of 1972 which in effect granted those powers. As pointed out if anything they have actually increased.

 

As an observation... People it seems are becoming bored with politics and even more so at a local level hence the turnout in local elections. All we have seen in the past at a local level is there is a power grab by different parties to take control but no substantial change when they do.