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South Yorkshire Bus Service Needs Improvement

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Posted (edited)

To add to the mention of buses waiting time in town, on a bus route that runs a long distance cross city generally timetables will have that written into the timetable. It isn't just to allow for numbers boarding or for driver changeovers, it also acts as a bit of a buffer if a bus is running a little late coming in to town it then won't be quite so late leaving town on the other side of the city. Sheffield has unpredictable traffic and inadequate bus priority measures so this is quite important for the service to run reliably!

Edited by Andy C

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22 hours ago, olivapopea said:

No different to trains or trams etc, buses can’t leave these stops early and they are there to regulate services. Stops located between those listed on the main timetable are only estimated arrival times.

 

Sorry to disagree with you but as far as trams are concerned in Sheffield then they do often leave early and management could not care less - I have reported trams leaving early more than once. This problem has been exacerbated during lockdown where both a reduction in passenger numbers and less traffic on the roads means that the trams are often early and do not wait at the "timing points" as they should. Supertram are far more concerned about trams being late so turn a blind eye to early departures

 

Stagecoach will tell you a timetable for them is a guide not a timetable.

 

It is indeed true that on the trains it is very rare for trains to leave early  because management monitor this and have done probably ever since the railways were built

Just now, Andy C said:

To add to the mention of buses waiting time in town, on a bus route that runs a long distance cross city generally timetables will have that written into the timetable. It isn't just to allow for numbers boarding or for driver changeovers, it also acts as a bit of a buffer if a bus is running a little late coming in to town and won't be quite so late leaving town on the other side of the city. Sheffield has unpredictable traffic and inadequate bus priority measures so this is quite important for the service to run reliably!

This is a feature of all public transport timetables (in the UK at least) and the vast majority of drivers whether they be bus train, tube stick to the rules (as above excepting Supertram)

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3 hours ago, Bigal1 said:

Sorry to disagree with you but as far as trams are concerned in Sheffield then they do often leave early and management could not care less - I have reported trams leaving early more than once. This problem has been exacerbated during lockdown where both a reduction in passenger numbers and less traffic on the roads means that the trams are often early and do not wait at the "timing points" as they should. Supertram are far more concerned about trams being late so turn a blind eye to early departures

 

Stagecoach will tell you a timetable for them is a guide not a timetable.

 

It is indeed true that on the trains it is very rare for trains to leave early  because management monitor this and have done probably ever since the railways were built

This is a feature of all public transport timetables (in the UK at least) and the vast majority of drivers whether they be bus train, tube stick to the rules (as above excepting Supertram)

I don't think it's a good idea for trams to stand waiting 3/4 minutes blocking other traffic, there are a large number of stops on street running sections.

 

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Posted (edited)
53 minutes ago, alexander874 said:

I don't think it's a good idea for trams to stand waiting 3/4 minutes blocking other traffic, there are a large number of stops on street running sections.

 

I would imagine tram timing points, like 99% of bus ones, are at  suitable stops.

Edited by RollingJ

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5 minutes ago, RollingJ said:

I would imagine tram timing points, like 99% of bus ones, are at  suitable stops.

Each stop has it's own approximate time but for example there is know where inbound between Middlewood and Shalesmoor to stand waiting for the clock.

 

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2 hours ago, alexander874 said:

Each stop has it's own approximate time but for example there is know where inbound between Middlewood and Shalesmoor to stand waiting for the clock.

 

OK - don't know that route as it isn't one I've ever had cause to use.

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Bigal1 said:

Sorry to disagree with you but as far as trams are concerned in Sheffield then they do often leave early and management could not care less - I have reported trams leaving early more than once. This problem has been exacerbated during lockdown where both a reduction in passenger numbers and less traffic on the roads means that the trams are often early and do not wait at the "timing points" as they should. Supertram are far more concerned about trams being late so turn a blind eye to early departures

 

Stagecoach will tell you a timetable for them is a guide not a timetable.

 

It is indeed true that on the trains it is very rare for trains to leave early  because management monitor this and have done probably ever since the railways were built

This is a feature of all public transport timetables (in the UK at least) and the vast majority of drivers whether they be bus train, tube stick to the rules (as above excepting Supertram)

The Trams have to run to a time table and have to stick to it.

 

Pre tramtrain the biggest issue was congestion between Park Square and Cathedral and secondly single track sections and staff changeovers.

 

With the introduction of tramtrains the whole system is governed by the railways.

Tramtrains can only enter and leave the section beyond Meadowhall South when the railway says so and within a minute or two max.

This  means that all Yellow trams are governed by tramtrain movements with. This cascades across the whole system with punctual arrival of Blue and Purple trams between Park Square and Cathedral being critical.

 

There are two solutions to the problem. 

They reduce the number of journeys per hour.

They increase the allocated journey time.

Together they increase the reliability of the timetable over the whole day-this is demonstrated by the improved punctuality of trams.

 

Sheffield people are pretty happy with (97 per cent of Supertram passengers are satisfied) and Supertram has a 87% punctuality rate.

 

One test of an efficient system is what happens at termini. 

 

Edited by Annie Bynnol

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I agree with the bullet points listed by Andy C. I am still concerned that bus stops have been moved from Pinstone Street and despite the consultation earlier this year, we still don’t know if this closure is permanent. Last week I walked to the bus stops now moved to Rockingham Street. Aside from it taking longer to walk there, there are now tables and chairs out on the pavements which have to be negotiated, and, of course, the pavements on Rockingham Street are narrow and uneven. Yes, K know that this would be sorted out eventually (one would hope anyway)if these were to become permanent bus stops, but we still have to use them in the meantime. Further, to see the buses winding their way along these narrow roads which were, surely, never meant to accommodate buses, I don’t see how this can be an improvement. Please bring back the buses to Leopold Street and Pinstone Street. They were easy to access and felt safe, and buses did not have to navigate around lots of tiny bends.

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Posted (edited)
22 hours ago, Andy C said:

To add to the mention of buses waiting time in town, on a bus route that runs a long distance cross city generally timetables will have that written into the timetable. It isn't just to allow for numbers boarding or for driver changeovers, it also acts as a bit of a buffer if a bus is running a little late coming in to town it then won't be quite so late leaving town on the other side of the city. Sheffield has unpredictable traffic and inadequate bus priority measures so this is quite important for the service to run reliably!

Well walking up from The Moor to Fargate last weekend, I can tell you that Pinstone St has been resurfaced so that the road is now level with the pavement & new cycling / walking road markings have been put down indicating a shared area, so I'd suggest that running public transport in front of the Town Hall or down Pinstone St as before, has now become a distant memory. 

 

Apologies.  The post should have been a response to post 212 for Andromeda. 

Edited by Baron99

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36 minutes ago, Andromeda said:

I agree with the bullet points listed by Andy C. I am still concerned that bus stops have been moved from Pinstone Street and despite the consultation earlier this year, we still don’t know if this closure is permanent. Last week I walked to the bus stops now moved to Rockingham Street. Aside from it taking longer to walk there, there are now tables and chairs out on the pavements which have to be negotiated, and, of course, the pavements on Rockingham Street are narrow and uneven. Yes, K know that this would be sorted out eventually (one would hope anyway)if these were to become permanent bus stops, but we still have to use them in the meantime. Further, to see the buses winding their way along these narrow roads which were, surely, never meant to accommodate buses, I don’t see how this can be an improvement. Please bring back the buses to Leopold Street and Pinstone Street. They were easy to access and felt safe, and buses did not have to navigate around lots of tiny bends.

Not gonna happen. 

S̷h̷e̷f̷f̷i̷e̷l̷d̷ ̷U̷n̷i̷v̷e̷r̷s̷i̷t̷y̷  SCC have already decided it's not reopening. They decided it before it was ever closed & have wanted it closed for a long time. However prior to Covid they faced very strong opposition from most sides so never did it. Covid gave them an easy excuse to avoid that opposition.

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20 hours ago, alexander874 said:

I don't think it's a good idea for trams to stand waiting 3/4 minutes blocking other traffic, there are a large number of stops on street running sections.

 

They do not the timing points are chosen to avoid that scenario.

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2 minutes ago, Bigal1 said:

They do not the timing points are chosen to avoid that scenario.

Thanks, @Bigal1 for that confirmation.

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