The Conservative Party - Part Two.

[banjodeano 31]

2 hours ago, the_bloke said:

There is no place for bullying in the workplace, but without being able to read the report we've no idea what the investigation actually considers bullying really is. I doubt she was demanding menaces money and stealing lunches in Whitehall.

Thats it, make light of the bullying,  if this was in the labour party you would be all over it like a rash

1 hour ago, Pettytom said:

She should be sacked. Anyone who tried to protect her should also be sacked.

 

There is no place for bullies in modern society.

wow, at last we can agree

[PRESLEY 1,228]

54 minutes ago, West 77 said:

What utter nonsense.  Any boss has to motivate or pressure the people they lead in order to get the best results. Our Armed Forces would be weak in they didn't have tough leadership throughout the ranks. Those wimps working in Government departments in Whitehall should be thankful they have it so cushy and are not in the army. 

I  agree Armed Forces, Police, Fire Service, Prison Service and Ambulance Service have to face  extremely tough and precise decsion making  so tough training and disciplin installation  is imperative, compared with other Civillian jobs firm fair treatment is surfice, bullying is a completly different bag and a no no through out  any occupation, so should be weeded out, if Patel as victimised or singled out an indivisual that is bullying but swearing and mouthing off at a group/department is out of order but I would put it down to ill management.

[Mister M 1,624]

Boris Johnson's introduction to the Ministerial  Code 2019:

 

There must be no bullying and no harassment; no leaking; no breach of collective responsibility. No misuse of taxpayer money and no actual or perceived conflicts of interest. The precious principles of public life enshrined in this document – integrity, objectivity, accountability, transparency, honesty and leadership in the public interest – must be honoured at all times; as must the political impartiality of our much admired civil service.

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/826920/August-2019-MINISTERIAL-CODE-FINAL-FORMATTED-2.pdf

[Pettytom 1]

Just now, Mister M said:

Boris Johnson's introduction to the Ministerial  Code 2019:

 

There must be no bullying and no harassment; no leaking; no breach of collective responsibility. No misuse of taxpayer money and no actual or perceived conflicts of interest. The precious principles of public life enshrined in this document – integrity, objectivity, accountability, transparency, honesty and leadership in the public interest – must be honoured at all times; as must the political impartiality of our much admired civil service.

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/826920/August-2019-MINISTERIAL-CODE-FINAL-FORMATTED-2.pdf

Blimey.

 

That’s most of the cabinet gone then. 
 

 

[L00b 441]

19 minutes ago, West 77 said:

You've made some fair comments. 

 

I have more sympathy for low paid wages who have no alternative but to suffer the consequences if ill management than highly paid civil servants working in Whitehall throwing their toys out their prams. I'm not hearing reports that Pritti Patel is doing a bad job as Home Secretary and can see no justification for her being replaced.

None so blind, as those who refuse to see.

 

She's beyond adjectives, and redemption, with an overdue Karmic tab the size of Mount Everest.

[the_bloke 17]

1 hour ago, banjodeano said:

Thats it, make light of the bullying,  if this was in the labour party you would be all over it like a rash

I'm not making light of it at all, but unlike anti Semitism in the Labour party, all we have to go on is a report we can't see the contents of. It's a bit different to a plethora of social media posts, interviews and articles where people give anti Semitic viewpoints. It's a single person which an unknown number of accusers.

 

If the report content comes to light and highlights a serious problem on a significant scale, then she should be fired and steps put in place to combat the problem.

 

Considering you mentioned Labour, it's worth pointing out that Gordon Brown was famously a bully too, yet I don't remember him stepping down over it.

[RJRB 688]

25 minutes ago, West 77 said:

You've made some fair comments. 

 

I have more sympathy for low paid wages who have no alternative but to suffer the consequences if ill management than highly paid civil servants working in Whitehall throwing their toys out their prams. I'm not hearing reports that Pritti Patel is doing a bad job as Home Secretary and can see no justification for her being replaced.

Boris fails to see the justification as well in the same way that he failed to see the fault in Dominic Cummings well publicised transgressions.

This will also comeback to haunt him and confirms his weakness and dependence on ill chosen allies.

[PRESLEY 1,228]

7 minutes ago, West 77 said:

You've made some fair comments. 

 

I have more sympathy for low paid wages who have no alternative but to suffer the consequences if ill management than highly paid civil servants working in Whitehall throwing their toys out their prams. I'm not hearing reports that Pritti Patel is doing a bad job as Home Secretary and can see no justification for her being replaced.

Good points from yourself.   You mentioned Alex Ferguson(Man Utd) , Brian Clough was a nightmare play under,  I met a  couple of Forrest players in a Nottingham Restaurant in 79, Larry Lloyd, Gary Birtles and they said he was a complete nightmare to play under, harsh, gobby,  arrogant as they come and real discaplinarian, but they wouldn't swap him.  Now some people, outsiders of the game could have viewed him as a bully, the same with Patel,   I am not a Boris fan at all but he must have surely made his decision by hearing both sides of this matter if not,  err, I know we have used Football scenario's,  but it's just not Cricket,    see what I did there.  

[Mister M 1,624]

27 minutes ago, the_bloke said:

I'm not making light of it at all, but unlike anti Semitism in the Labour party, all we have to go on is a report we can't see the contents of. It's a bit different to a plethora of social media posts, interviews and articles where people give anti Semitic viewpoints. It's a single person which an unknown number of accusers.

 

If the report content comes to light and highlights a serious problem on a significant scale, then she should be fired and steps put in place to combat the problem.

 

Considering you mentioned Labour, it's worth pointing out that Gordon Brown was famously a bully too, yet I don't remember him stepping down over it.

But it's being reported that Boris Johnson will not publish the full report:

 

No 10 says it is unlikely to release the full report into Priti Patel’s conduct, in order to protect the people who gave evidence.

Boris Johnson's official spokesperson said: "We've published the summary of the findings this morning but obviously, in order to protect the confidentiality of participants in the exercise, it wouldn't be right or proper to publish any details that would be able to identify them."

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-news-live-brexit-priti-patel-b1758925.html

 

Hang on was there a report condemning Gordon Brown as a bully?

 

Edited November 20, 2020 by Mister M

[Pettytom 1]

25 minutes ago, the_bloke said:

I'm not making light of it at all, but unlike anti Semitism in the Labour party, all we have to go on is a report we can't see the contents of. It's a bit different to a plethora of social media posts, interviews and articles where people give anti Semitic viewpoints. It's a single person which an unknown number of accusers.

 

If the report content comes to light and highlights a serious problem on a significant scale, then she should be fired and steps put in place to combat the problem.

 

 

It’s very similar to the Corbyn situation. The current Labour leadership seem to be a much better job of sorting out their dirty laundry than the Tories are. 

 

We can’t see the report, because Johnson won’t publish it. We do know that the author of the report has resigned because of Johnson’s inaction. We also know that Patel has a string of bullying allegations against her, over a number of years. including one that will reach court next year.  She’s also been sacked before, for inappropriate behaviour. How much more do you want to know before you form

your opinion?
 

It’s time that Johnson stopped running out government as if it was his own private club. It’s also time that people stopped making mealy mouthed excuses for poor behaviour.

[Mister M 1,624]

39 minutes ago, West 77 said:

I always have an open mind unlike some who practice  blind prejudice.

Sports management is a good comparison with high profile management in Government. We've heard about alleged bulling in cycling and gymnastics.  A gold medal winner will have been pushed hard by their coaches in order to win their gold medal. Brian Clough is a good example of someone who arrogantly  ill managed at Leeds and went on to arrogantly manage  well at Forest and be respected by his players.

 

Regarding Boris he will be aware there is fault at both sides but he does seem to be loyal towards those who have helped him into power which I don't think is a bad trait.  If Boris genuinely believes Pritti Patel is doing a good job then he is correct to be loyal towards her.

What about loyalty to those who helped him into power who are victims of bullying? What message does it send to them.

Quite a topical issue as it's anti bullying week.

Boris Johnson hasn't sacked Robert Jenrick, Dominic Cummings, Gavin Williamson, Matt Hancock and a whole host of ministers whose performance has been woeful this last year since he's been PM.

We know that Johnson wants to be liked, not like any other PM, but to the point where he refuses to sack people where their behaviour has been demonstrably and provably well below what is expected. In the case of Patel that is not a moot point, She broke the Ministerial Code. Fact. Johnson said in his foreword to the Ministerial Code 'Bullying is wrong'.  A report lands on his desk less that a year later showing that Patel has, across 3 departments displayed bullying behaviour. He refuses to sack her.

He's not loyal - ask his ex wives and mistresses. He's spineless and amoral.

 

[andyofborg 11]

57 minutes ago, West 77 said:

Ie've heard about alleged bulling in cycling and gymnastics.  A gold medal winner will have been pushed hard by their coaches in order to win their gold medal.

There is a big difference between being pushed hard and being bullied.