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Coronavirus - Part Two.

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44 minutes ago, Litotes said:

If you don't think it is under-resourced, I am sorry, I don't think you have every seen the front line of the NHS on a Friday night in an A&E ward. It is not properly resourced...

I don't think you though that one through properly. Just why was A&E inundated with casualties on a Friday night? What was the cause? Should the general public pour more resources into the Friday night alcohol related casualties? This and many more questions in tonight's edition of Soap....... ;)

 

https://news.sky.com/story/every-patient-was-a-drunk-injury-despair-over-bank-holiday-a-e-admissions-11986373

 

The problem with the NHS is in part due to its size as the bigger it gets the more money and resources it needs, just like the good old EU. As it gets bigger it needs more well paid managers so needs more money to survive and carry on.

 

ECCO in part beat me to it..... :)

 

Edited by apelike

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5 minutes ago, apelike said:

I don't think you though that one through properly. Just why was A&E inundated with casualties on a Friday night? What was the cause? Should the general public pour more resources into the Friday night alcohol related casualties? This and many more questions in tonight's edition of Soap....... ;)

 

https://news.sky.com/story/every-patient-was-a-drunk-injury-despair-over-bank-holiday-a-e-admissions-11986373

 

The problem with the NHS is in part due to its size as the bigger it gets the more money and resources it needs, just like the good old EU. As it gets bigger it needs more well paid managers so needs more money to survive and carry on.

 

ECCO in part beat me to it..... :)

 

And all this time HMG are totally helpless to do anything about it...........................................or is it hopeless😎

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1 hour ago, Longcol said:

Perhaps HMG should get their act togetherand tell us the truth about testing - like what do they mean by perform and processing. All we get, yet again, is "jam tomorrow" like Hancock saying we'll be doing (processing or performing?) 500,000 tests per day by the end of October - or BoShambles' Operation Moonshot.

 

Bit of honesty and taking responsibility  by HMG would go a long way. But it's always somebody else's fault isn't it?

 

 

What was the question being asked? If it was how many tests can we do a day then they have answered it. If the question was how many results are being processed in an average week then they have answered that.

 

What exactly are we wanting to know? I would have thought most sensible people would be aware that there is a difference between taking a swab and actually having to them send that off to be processed and analysed with the second part taking longer than the first. 

 

It is also not as if the data isn't available.  I've said multiple times and on this forum that the government publishes reams of statistics reports, committee minutes, and transcripts of debates in the house every day.  It's all there for any of us to access whatever we want.  The big problem is most of us can't be bothered and we simply sit there like dummies waiting to see what the papers tell what they think we want to know,  of course adding on their own bias manipulation and selective editing of the statistics to suit whichever agenda they are trying to push.

 

Here is just a selection of things all here all available for those who want to be informed:

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/nhs-test-and-trace-statistics-england-weekly-reports

https://www.gov.uk/coronavirus

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/react-1-study-of-coronavirus-transmission-august-2020-results/react-1-real-time-assessment-of-community-transmission-of-coronavirus-covid-19-in-august-2020

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-infection-rises-letter-to-care-providers-from-director-of-adult-social-care-delivery/covid-19-infection-rises-letter-to-care-providers-from-director-of-adult-social-care-delivery

https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/distributing-vaccines-and-treatments-for-covid-19-and-flu/consultation-document-changes-to-human-medicine-regulations-to-support-the-rollout-of-covid-19-vaccines

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/912858/covid-and-flu-draft-statutory-instrument.pdf

Edited by ECCOnoob

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4 minutes ago, ECCOnoob said:

What was the question being asked? If it was how many tests can we do a day then they have answered it. If the question was how many results are being processed in an average week then they have answered that.

 

What exactly are we wanting to know? I would have thought most sensible people would be aware that there is a difference between taking a swab and actually having to them send that off to be processed and analysed with the second part taking longer than the first. 

 

It is also not as if the data isn't available.  I've said multiple times and on this forum that the government publishes reams of statistics reports, committee minutes, and transcripts of debates in the house every day.  It's all there for any of us to access whatever we want.  The big problem is most of us can't be bothered and we simply sit there like dummies waiting to see what the papers tell what they think we want to know,  of course adding on their own bias manipulation and selective editing of the statistics to suit whichever agenda they are trying to push.

 

Gov.uk / government / collections / NHS

Why are HMG asking people not to get tested when they are showing capacity for testing is well in excess of numbers being tested.

Edited by Longcol

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12 minutes ago, Longcol said:

And all this time HMG are totally helpless to do anything about it...........................................or is it hopeless😎

in apes and ecco's world the government can do no wrong and boris and dominic are perfect and almost god like in their brilliance.

 

all public sector bodies from the NHS downwards, work within a framework of polices and funding provided by the government. even though they choose to ignore it the various ministers and secretaries of state are supposed to be responsible for these bodies and their actions and decisions. 

 

but like the top levels of private sector management, ministers take no responsibility for their actions and move on to pastures new without ever having to take responsibility for their failures. the only difference is that private sector types tend to go with millions in their pockets and ministers get new ministries to destroy. 

 

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17 minutes ago, andyofborg said:

..... all public sector bodies from the NHS downwards, work within a framework of polices and funding provided by the government. even though they choose to ignore it the various ministers and secretaries of state are supposed to be responsible for these bodies and their actions and decisions. 

I think you will find that it is the various NHS Trusts and their managers that are responsible for its day to day running and not any Ministers or Secretaries of State from the Department of Health. The overall control of the NHS is in fact held by NHS England which was formed in 2012 by the Health and Social Care Act to make it a separate entity free from Government control or political interference. NHS England answer directly to parliament for that reason.

 

You are correct though that those at the top and in charge of running it are mainly from private sector management consultancies, and that is now the problem.

 

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It is a fundamental function of government to ensure that its citizens don’t die. 
 

At the moment that involves them ensuring that track and trace works excellently. Not adequately. Excellently.

 

Sadly, Hancock has been so worn down by the crisis that he’s a complete busted flush. Johnson daren’t sack anyone. And so, we are all left with this unsatisfactory shambles.


It can’t be that hard to swab people and process the swabs  in UK labs, quickly. Instead, those who we allow a test to are likely to find their swabs taking a trip to the EU for processing. My irony detector just blew up.

 

The Government have a huge majority. They are absolutely in charge. The buck stops with them. I can’t see Johnson/Sunak/Hancock inspiring excellence in anyone.

Edited by Pettytom

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1 hour ago, Pettytom said:

It is a fundamental function of government to ensure that its citizens don’t die. 

No, it has a fundamental function to protect its citizens from harm from each other and also from foreign outsiders amongst other things. 

 

1 hour ago, Pettytom said:

At the moment that involves them ensuring that track and trace works excellently. Not adequately. Excellently.

Is there a country where track and trace is functioning and working excellently? All I can see is that track and trace is functioning and operational in many countries but the uptake is very low. It needs to have an uptake of around 70-80% for it to be effective and of any use.

 

1 hour ago, Pettytom said:

.....It can’t be that hard to swab people and process the swabs  in UK labs, quickly.

No it's not hard if we had the labs but the simple answer is we don't as this could not have been and was never planned for. 

 

1 hour ago, Pettytom said:

Instead, those who we allow a test to are likely to find their swabs taking a trip to the EU for processing. My irony detector just blew up.

Probably made in China then! 

 

1 hour ago, Pettytom said:

The Government have a huge majority. They are absolutely in charge. The buck stops with them.

Yes, yes and yes but I don't think anyone is arguing differently.

 

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5 hours ago, apelike said:

No, it has a fundamental function to protect its citizens from harm from each other and also from foreign outsiders amongst other things.

Well they didnt and still dont stop or even test people coming into the country, even now they refuse to test, but rely on people isolating for 14 days.

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9 hours ago, apelike said:

 

 

Is there a country where track and trace is functioning and working excellently? All I can see is that track and trace is functioning and operational in many countries but the uptake is very low. It needs to have an uptake of around 70-80% for it to be effective and of any use.

 

 

 

South Korea and has done since March or April.

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18 minutes ago, tinfoilhat said:

South Korea and has done since March or April.

IIRC The S.Korean one is mandatory now, uses a QR code that uniquely identifies individuals and is basically state surveillance by any other name. That last bit is why the T&T system rollout in Europe and elsewhere is really worthless as its take up has been limited and in most cases less than half the population has downloaded it to their phone. S.Korea also like many Asian countries down that way have also been very prepared in their preparations for new pandemic outbreaks because of past history in dealing with them. We had a choice but have gone down the same route as we have with masks/face coverings and have failed to make them mandatory for a reason.

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operation moon shot?

moonshine, more like

 

Moonshine= foolish talk or ideas.

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