Coronavirus - Part Two.

[Guest sibon]

40 minutes ago, top4718 said:

Depends what PPE they refuse to wear properly, no one would refuse to wear P3 masks when required as they wouldn’t last 5 mins in that environment without one. Any other breaches would be picked up by our managers , the client or the HSE and would be dealt with depending on the severity of the breach.

 

Now answer mine.

I will do presently, but I’m not satisfied with your answer yet.

 

Can you clarify, do you “run the show”, or not?

 

If you do run the show, why let “managers” pick up health and safety breaches.

 

What I’m digging at here is that almost every person I’ve ever dealt with who has “run the show”, has also led by example.

 

So, clarify please.

[top4718 838]

6 minutes ago, sibon said:

I will do presently, but I’m not satisfied with your answer yet.

 

Can you clarify, do you “run the show”, or not?

 

If you do run the show, why let “managers” pick up health and safety breaches.

 

What I’m digging at here is that almost every person I’ve ever dealt with who has “run the show”, has also led by example.

 

So, clarify please.

When I have 5 sites running at once I can’t be at every one,  we have site managers and site foreman as do most companies like ours. Setting an example in on site PPE and caving in to nonsense are two different things, if I stated that one of your precious masks was going to be used for any level of protection the project wouldn’t even be allowed to start.

 

Now back to my question.

[hackey lad 3,955]

19 hours ago, top4718 said:

I dont need to because they're totally ineffective, you might as well put your hand in front of your face.

 

If anyone wants a challenge I'll invite you to the next job we do where masks are required, our lads with have the P3's that they've been face fit trained for on you can have on you're flimsy face nappies, we'll see who's the first to leave.

Whether you think they are ineffective or not , why not just wear one , it wouldnt harm you and would make people around you feel safer .

[Guest sibon]

52 minutes ago, top4718 said:

When I have 5 sites running at once I can’t be at every one,  we have site managers and site foreman as do most companies like ours. Setting an example in on site PPE and caving in to nonsense are two different things, if I stated that one of your precious masks was going to be used for any level of protection the project wouldn’t even be allowed to start.

 

Now back to my question.

No. We’ve not finished yet.

 

Are you seriously saying that you run operations on five school sites and you don’t conform to the guidance from the DfE for visitors to school sites?

 

I find that very difficult to believe. If the people you are “in charge of” step out of line, you’ve not got a leg to stand on.

30 minutes ago, hackey lad said:

Whether you think they are ineffective or not , why not just wear one , it wouldnt harm you and would make people around you feel safer .

They are also a legal requirement in a variety of settings. 

[top4718 838]

1 hour ago, sibon said:

No. We’ve not finished yet.

 

Are you seriously saying that you run operations on five school sites and you don’t conform to the guidance from the DfE for visitors to school sites?

 

I find that very difficult to believe. If the people you are “in charge of” step out of line, you’ve not got a leg to stand on.

They are also a legal requirement in a variety of settings. 

We don't just work on schools.

 

For someone who prepares RA's you don't seem to able to differentiate between Health & Safety at work (the Act was drawn up in 1974) and Covid rules.

2 hours ago, hackey lad said:

Whether you think they are ineffective or not , why not just wear one , it wouldnt harm you and would make people around you feel safer .

 Wearing a pair of knickers on my head would have the same effect but I don't want to do that either.

[Guest sibon]

16 minutes ago, top4718 said:

We don't just work on schools.

 

For someone who prepares RA's you don't seem to able to differentiate between Health & Safety at work (the Act was drawn up in 1974) and Covid rules.

 

I was calling you out on being unwilling to follow DfE Covid guidance, specific to the places that you claim to work. If you are so blasé about those and about Covid regulations, then how can anyone believe that you manage H and S properly. You’ve more or less said that you don’t, in your answers to my question.

Edited June 19, 2021 by sibon

[top4718 838]

13 minutes ago, sibon said:

I was calling you out on being unwilling to follow DfE Covid guidance, specific to the places that you claim to work. If you are so blasé about those and about Covid regulations, then how can anyone believe that you manage H and S properly. You’ve more or less said that you don’t, in your answers to my question.

Your making your own narrative up to suit your argument, totally ridiculous. Workplace H&S and Covid rules are totally different things, you're proving you have no idea what you're talking about.

[Guest makapaka]

45 minutes ago, top4718 said:

Your making your own narrative up to suit your argument, totally ridiculous. Workplace H&S and Covid rules are totally different things, you're proving you have no idea what you're talking about.

This is true.

 

come on tho mate - you’re obviously not daft.

 

have a day off from the conspiracy nonsense and find a middle ground. 
 

[Guest sibon]

49 minutes ago, top4718 said:

Your making your own narrative up to suit your argument, totally ridiculous. Workplace H&S and Covid rules are totally different things, you're proving you have no idea what you're talking about.

They aren’t really. They mesh in quite a complicated way. For example, if you refuse to mask up in a supermarket, you endanger the staff and the customers. So you break Covid rules and in some cases you also contravene H&S at Work (1974), depending upon why you are there.

 

Your attitude to one, speaks volumes about your attitude to the other. It’s much easier and safer for everyone to follow the Covid guidance.

 

The DfE guidance is pretty much mandatory anyway as it is linked to Safeguarding and to the OFSTED framework. So, if you really are wandering around schools unmasked as a guest, you are a dangerous, arrogant fool.

 

So. I’ll ask you once again, how do you manage so many people, whilst ignoring safety rules, guidance and laws yourself?

[whiteowl 54]

4 hours ago, sibon said:

No. We’ve not finished yet.

 

Are you seriously saying that you run operations on five school sites and you don’t conform to the guidance from the DfE for visitors to school sites?

 

<snip>

On 12/06/2021 at 00:17, top4718 said:

Whats not to believe, I go to schools nearly every day of the week, I'm at one in Sheffield in the Meersbrook area next Tuesday morning, I won't wear a mask and the head who I met two weeks ago won't have one on either. I'm then at a special school in the Norton area sometimes the receptionist insists on a mask but once I'm introduced to the head or building manager the protocol goes out of the window, these people are seeing hundreds of kids a day along with parents but have absolutely no issues with adhering to mask wearing or social distancing, they're not dropping down ill.

Interestingly I was round at a friends tonight, his wife is a senior teacher at a "special school" in the Norton area - there aren't that many,

 

I mentioned this thread to her and she was horrified. Assuming what you've said is in anyway true and, of course, assuming it's the same school, I'd probably keep away from her if I was you.

[top4718 838]

11 hours ago, sibon said:

They aren’t really. They mesh in quite a complicated way. For example, if you refuse to mask up in a supermarket, you endanger the staff and the customers. So you break Covid rules and in some cases you also contravene H&S at Work (1974), depending upon why you are there.

 

Your attitude to one, speaks volumes about your attitude to the other. It’s much easier and safer for everyone to follow the Covid guidance.

 

The DfE guidance is pretty much mandatory anyway as it is linked to Safeguarding and to the OFSTED framework. So, if you really are wandering around schools unmasked as a guest, you are a dangerous, arrogant fool.

 

So. I’ll ask you once again, how do you manage so many people, whilst ignoring safety rules, guidance and laws yourself?

A lot of words that say absolutely nothing.

 

I’ve just read a huge thread on Twitter with contributions from supermarket workers, shoppers and all manner of people and no one knows any supermarket that has been adversely affected by this deadly virus, no excess deaths, no closures, no severe illness despite being open throughout the “pandemic” and for a good few weeks without masks. Does no on even find this slightly odd 🤷‍♂️
 

If I do a visit to a school and the first thing the head of the school says when I walk in is that I don’t have to wear a mask (and none of the staff are either) I’ll assume that despite all the forewarnings of doom predicted when schools reopened they actually feel quite safe in their environment and are happy to allow rules to be relaxed a little (particularly with masks as no one really wants to spend their working day in a stuffy environment in one), so rather than arrogantly pontificating about people “flouncing around without masks” it may be an idea to get out there and so how sensible adults who have a job to do can mutually agree to do so comfortably.

 

 

9 hours ago, whiteowl said:

Interestingly I was round at a friends tonight, his wife is a senior teacher at a "special school" in the Norton area - there aren't that many,

 

I mentioned this thread to her and she was horrified. Assuming what you've said is in anyway true and, of course, assuming it's the same school, I'd probably keep away from her if I was you.

I hope they were in your “rule of 6”.

[Tomm06 12]

12 hours ago, sibon said:

They aren’t really. They mesh in quite a complicated way. For example, if you refuse to mask up in a supermarket, you endanger the staff and the customers. So you break Covid rules and in some cases you also contravene H&S at Work (1974), depending upon why you are there.

 

Your attitude to one, speaks volumes about your attitude to the other. It’s much easier and safer for everyone to follow the Covid guidance.

 

The DfE guidance is pretty much mandatory anyway as it is linked to Safeguarding and to the OFSTED framework. So, if you really are wandering around schools unmasked as a guest, you are a dangerous, arrogant fool.

 

So. I’ll ask you once again, how do you manage so many people, whilst ignoring safety rules, guidance and laws yourself?

Look up the definitions of guidance and mandatory. Compare the two.