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Sheff Council - Shalesmoor Road Layout

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1 hour ago, RJRB said:

Airy fairy rubbish.

Take it to the extreme.

Close Ecclesall Road to all vehicles because there is insufficient carriageway width to accommodate 2 way traffic including buses plus an acceptably wide  2 way cycle lane.Similarly London Road and most other arterial roads.

Of course it impacts,but the Shalesmoor alteration achieves very little as opposed to the problem created.

That's your response? "Airy fairy rubbish".

 

You're not worth the effort.

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6 minutes ago, Bargepole23 said:

That's your response? "Airy fairy rubbish".

 

You're not worth the effort.

Lacking in detail or practicality......hence airy fairy rubbish

Devote your effort to your grandiose plan.

Edited by RJRB

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10 hours ago, Bargepole23 said:

What a bizarre suggestion. Clearly, the experiences of current cyclists can inform what might be perceived by others as a safe route. 

 

Why would anyone ever read and act upon, for example, a restaurant review if that were not the case? Because we use the experience and  opinion of others to steer our decisions for the better.

You are mixing up reviews and consultations. A review is what people think of the current offering. A consultation is what people would like to happen to make them do something. A consultation by a restaurant owner would produce more effective results by asking people why they DONT go than asking current customers why they do.

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32 minutes ago, busdriver1 said:

You are mixing up reviews and consultations. A review is what people think of the current offering. A consultation is what people would like to happen to make them do something. A consultation by a restaurant owner would produce more effective results by asking people why they DONT go than asking current customers why they do.

All current cyclists were new cyclists once and some of them have only recently started/resumed. It's nonsense to claim any advice they could give would be unsuitable. People who don't cycle don't have practical experience of the issues involved. Asking committed car drivers why they don't cycle would be like a seafood restaurant asking vegans why they don't eat there.

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11 hours ago, busdriver1 said:

You are mixing up reviews and consultations. A review is what people think of the current offering. A consultation is what people would like to happen to make them do something. A consultation by a restaurant owner would produce more effective results by asking people why they DONT go than asking current customers why they do.

I'm not mixing up anything. I'm suggesting that the experience of others is valuable in the design process. To suggest otherwise is bizarre.

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21 hours ago, RJRB said:

Lacking in detail or practicality......hence airy fairy rubbish

Devote your effort to your grandiose plan.

You call it grandiose because you lack ambition for what could be done. Chiefly, I imagine, because you are unable to comprehend a transport system, indeed entire cities, not revolving around motor cars. Motor cars that do immeasurable damage to our health, and our environment. Yet we persist in spending countless billions on enabling their use, reducing travel times by insignificant amounts, whilst spending next to nothing on safe walking and cycling routes, on better public transport.

Edited by Bargepole23

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There I was, sitting in the traffic jam that is now Shalesmoor Road, hoping one day to get to Hillsborough, and I saw a cyclist!!!!!  Yes, really a CYCLIST!!!

 

It was on the other side of the road, also heading out of town.  Was it on the cycle lane (all be it heading the wrong way)?  Nope, it was on the pavement, of course it was, it was a cyclist.

 

So thats money well spent then isnt it, one cyclist, on the pavement, on the wrong side of the road, going the wrong way

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41 minutes ago, Bargepole23 said:

You call it grandiose because you lack ambition for what could be done. Chiefly, I imagine, because you are unable to comprehend a transport system, indeed entire cities, not revolving around motor cars. Motor cars that do immeasurable damage to our health, and our environment. Yet we persist in spending countless billions on enabling their use, reducing travel times by insignificant amounts, whilst spending next to nothing on safe walking and cycling routes, on better public transport.

Where to start.

Firstly I do admire your ambition for the future of world transport.

However I do find it difficult to comprehend a future without motor cars.

Perhaps cleaner methods of propulsion will continue to evolve but it will be evolution.

Then compare travelling times of any distance by cycle or other forms of motorised transport,

That is a considerable saving in time and convenience for most people most of the time.

Safe walking routes?

I think we are well served with pavements and pathways.

Cycles have a place in the scheme of things ,but the clever bit is deciding where.

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2 hours ago, Bargepole23 said:

You call it grandiose because you lack ambition for what could be done. Chiefly, I imagine, because you are unable to comprehend a transport system, indeed entire cities, not revolving around motor cars. Motor cars that do immeasurable damage to our health, and our environment. Yet we persist in spending countless billions on enabling their use, reducing travel times by insignificant amounts, whilst spending next to nothing on safe walking and cycling routes, on better public transport.

Just out of interest, do you have a car? 

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3 hours ago, RJRB said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshire-53249547

 

one of these at Shalesmoor roundabout and perhaps another at Brook Hill roundabout would be interesting.

Stick one of those at Brook Hill and a few bicycles could end up over the fence on to the tram tracks.

 

1 hour ago, alchemist said:

There I was, sitting in the traffic jam that is now Shalesmoor Road, hoping one day to get to Hillsborough, and I saw a cyclist!!!!!  Yes, really a CYCLIST!!!

 

It was on the other side of the road, also heading out of town.  Was it on the cycle lane (all be it heading the wrong way)?  Nope, it was on the pavement, of course it was, it was a cyclist.

 

So thats money well spent then isnt it, one cyclist, on the pavement, on the wrong side of the road, going the wrong way

I saw three cyclists this morning, two on the pavement and one waiting at a crossing, blocking the cycle lane.

 

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3 minutes ago, drolnhoj said:

Just out of interest, do you have a car? 

Yes, which I use when other options are not appropriate. When I can cycle, which is more often than not, I do that. Or walk. Or catch a bus.

 

Please tell me you have read widely enough on the subject to know that most proponents of more walking, cycling and public transport options fully agree that a car is sometimes the best option? 

 

Or did you think you were going to catch me out with your entirely predictable question?

 

"Just out of interest....", same level of argumentative skills as "I rest my case....".

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