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Sheff Council - Shalesmoor Road Layout

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, ECCOnoob said:

 

Then we can go to the crux of the issue here.   The problem is what powers cars not the acutal use of one.  

 

No, it isn’t about what powers cars.

 

No matter what powers it, a car still takes up road space, causes pollution (particulates) causes safety problems and needs somewhere to park.

 

What is being sought is a less car dominated option for the places we live, visit and do business in.

Edited by Planner1

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53 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

If the emergency services have a real problem with something, they will talk to the council about it. Most times, if, because of changes, they now find it slower to go that way, they will use an alternative route.

 

The emergency services are very pragmatic and accept that they will sometimes get caught in traffic. It is not practical to have unobstructed access for emergency vehicles at all times on all routes. They fully understand this and plan for it.

This springs to mind.

 

 

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1 minute ago, ECCOnoob said:

It's not peak times though.

 

The alarming thing about this is there a significant number of people who are still working from home or not even working at all.   Most shops and hospitality businesses have literally only just reopened and already these ridiculous changes are causing problems.

 

What the hell are they going to be like if we applied the regular working day rush hour traffic.  I don't understand how anyone can see this is nothing but an absolute incompetent failure, which let's be completely frank is serving absolutely sod all benefit.

 

I see all this talk about the "increases" in people cycling and walking but where are they.....  why arent these new cycle lanes filled with people joyfully using them.  At least in central London you can look at the cycle highway and see how busy they get.  That ain't happening up here no matter how much the council and they're cronies try to persuade us.  

Here Here

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16 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

And, in the same vein, many drivers don’t take account of the time it takes them to find a parking space ( or the cost of it) and walk to their final destination. 
 

The measures we are discussing here are to help walking and cycling, not motorised transport modes.

Yeah cos every bus stop is right outside the front door of where I want to be.....right? 

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6 minutes ago, ECCOnoob said:

Do you actually read some of the posts on this thread?   It is not simply about the distance.  

 

Some people cannot feasibly walk or cycle as an alternative.  They have disabilities that prevent them from doing so.  They have time constraints that prevent them from doing.  They have loads to carry which prevent them from doing so.  They have passengers to carry which prevent them from doing so.

 

The solution is not simply to bully car drivers off the road.  All these horse crap environmental concerns are used as an excuse of justifying it.   A bit of foresight and proper town planning when they had the opportunity could have allowed for a a free flowing well designed road system which keeps traffic on the move and away from the centralised core areas where people are walking around and away from all the hazard.  

 

A bit of foresight and competence could have designed and a reliable off-road mass transit system which actually covered where people lived and had the advantage of being outside of any potential traffic delays.  But oh no we got the tram nowhere  which follows multiple existing roads and half the time gets just as jammed up as any car.

 

Then we can go to the crux of the issue here.   The problem is what powers cars not the acutal use of one.  

 

Now, perhaps a progressive competent council would think well outside the box of simply looking for ways to inconvenience drivers and more about encouraging use of alternative power.  Maybe a progressive council wouldn't be so blinded by the anti car agenda and think about encouraging the development and installation of electric vehicle recharging beyond the couple we have now.  Maybe they will come up with other incentives to encourage people to switch over to hybrids or Ev. 

 

Of course I dont expect any such revolutionary ideas from the knuckleheads running ours.

I hate the current system of attempting to deter cars whilst not even attempting to provide a viable alternative, public transport is mostly overpriced and unreliable, cycling will only suit a very small minority who work in a fixed location.

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2 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

No, it isn’t about what powers cars.

 

No matter what powers it, a car still takes up road space, causes pollution (particulates) causes safety problems and needs somewhere to park.

 

What is being sought is a less car dominated option for the places we live, visit and do business in.

Well then they need to come up with something feasible then.

 

Cycling and walking isn't it for the vast majority of residents in this city.  

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Maybe the council should give everyone a pair of roller skates or a scooter🛴

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8 minutes ago, ECCOnoob said:

Do you actually read some of the posts on this thread?   It is not simply about the distance.  

 

Some people cannot feasibly walk or cycle as an alternative.  They have disabilities that prevent them from doing so.  They have time constraints that prevent them from doing.  They have loads to carry which prevent them from doing so.  They have passengers to carry which prevent them from doing so.

 

The solution is not simply to bully car drivers off the road.  All these horse crap environmental concerns are used as an excuse of justifying it. 

I read all of them thanks.

 

Walking and cycling won’t suit everyone, but if you look at the stats quoted for the commuting distance that the majority drive, it is abundantly clear that for many people, walking or cycling is actually a viable option and if a goodly proportion of them were persuaded to do so, there would be far fewer traffic problems all round.
 

The environmental concerns are real, the pollution caused by cars is real as are the road casualties. What is being sought is a better environment for everyone that is far less car dominated.

 

The evidence over the years shows that drivers will not be just “encouraged” to take up other modes. They have to be forced to do so by difficulty or price ie demand management. 
 

You might not like it, but it’s national and local policy, so you will certainly be seeing more of it.

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4 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

I read all of them thanks.

 

Walking and cycling won’t suit everyone, but if you look at the stats quoted for the commuting distance that the majority drive, it is abundantly clear that for many people, walking or cycling is actually a viable option and if a goodly proportion of them were persuaded to do so, there would be far fewer traffic problems all round.
 

The environmental concerns are real, the pollution caused by cars is real as are the road casualties. What is being sought is a better environment for everyone that is far less car dominated.

 

The evidence over the years shows that drivers will not be just “encouraged” to take up other modes. They have to be forced to do so by difficulty or price ie demand management. 
 

You might not like it, but it’s national and local policy, so you will certainly be seeing more of it.

How can you force people if no viable alternatives are in place?

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11 minutes ago, Brooker11 said:

I hate the current system of attempting to deter cars whilst not even attempting to provide a viable alternative, public transport is mostly overpriced and unreliable, cycling will only suit a very small minority who work in a fixed location.

The measures that are being put in are about helping walking and cycling. People can carry quite significant loads on cycles with all sorts of panniers and bags available. There are cargo bikes for shifting more bulky and heavy stuff. 
 

If you actually compare public transport prices in other places,  Sheffield’s come out as being quite reasonable. 

1 minute ago, Brooker11 said:

How can you force people if no viable alternatives are in place?

The vast majority can walk or cycle on some journeys, the measures under discussion are making it easier and safer.

 

There is a public transport network as well and there are taxis, private hire, community transport, car clubs, all of which are viable alternatives to the car. Electric scooters for local journeys are something the government are keen to try out here. They work well in other places.

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2 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

The measures that are being put in are about helping walking and cycling. People can carry quite significant loads on cycles with all sorts of panniers and bags available. There are cargo bikes for shifting more bulky and heavy stuff. 
 

If you actually compare public transport prices in other places,  Sheffield’s come out as being quite reasonable. 

Cycling is only viable to people in good health, with showers available at their place of work, who have to carry very few items and work from one fixed location, it wouldn't be an option for a single person in my place of work.

 

The prices might be reasonable but its unreliable.

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I have anew bike and panniers full of kit to do my job and I live on Jenkin Avenue. Heart attack waiting to happen.

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