Sheff Council - Shalesmoor Road Layout

[Tony 10]

12 hours ago, Baron99 said:

Because  about half a dozen vehicles that are travelling down Netherthorpe Rd / Hoyle St are sat in traffic trying to get on to the now single carriageway of Penistone Rd & the tram can't cross the bottom of Hoyle St to make its way up Netherthorpe Rd.  NOTE:  the vehicles had every right to occpy that bit of Hoyle St at that time. 

 

The tram driver has to rely on the good nature of the drivers to back up slightly, (good job the lights at the bottom of Netherthorpe Rd were at red, holding back even more vehicles), to let the tram through.  

They didn't have any right to occupy that bit of Hoyle St because the tram tracks have cross hatchings and waiting there wins 3 points on a driving license and a fine. Your tram should have breezed through but it was held up by traffic ignoring driving laws, not by bikes or bike lanes. 

 

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Hoyle+St,+Sheffield/@53.3880755,-1.4784776,104m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x4879788741264e1d:0x26197947f71977e9!8m2!3d53.3880507!4d-1.4781007

 

 

Trams are quite good when they are on your route though aren't they? Your journey would have been even faster on a bike.    

[Baron99 779]

52 minutes ago, Tony said:

They didn't have any right to occupy that bit of Hoyle St because the tram tracks have cross hatchings and waiting there wins 3 points on a driving license and a fine. Your tram should have breezed through but it was held up by traffic ignoring driving laws, not by bikes or bike lanes. 

 

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Hoyle+St,+Sheffield/@53.3880755,-1.4784776,104m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x4879788741264e1d:0x26197947f71977e9!8m2!3d53.3880507!4d-1.4781007

 

 

Trams are quite good when they are on your route though aren't they? Your journey would have been even faster on a bike.    

Fair enough. They'd better get a camera operating down there then.  

 

But it still doesn't solve a problem but has created one, that even in LIGHT  traffic, you have two major roads converging into a single carriageway, causing tailbacks, while an empty carriageway, designed to carry vehicles, (including public transport), sits empty of any vehicles, except for possiblly the occasional cyclist. 

 

Not a good use of previously spent £4.6 million, man hours or resources to improve traffic flow in the area.   

 

Only SCC could spend so much money & resources on sorting out a road improvement / traffic management scheme, then spend even more money & more man hours on 'planning' & physical work & end up with more congestion than they had 2 or 3 years ago in that area. 

 

Edited July 26, 2020 by Baron99

[Planner1 428]

3 hours ago, Baron99 said:

They'd better get a camera operating down there then.  

 

 

 

Box junctions can only be enforced by camera in London. The government have consistently refused to roll out the powers more widely.

[alchemist 35]

5 hours ago, Baron99 said:

Fair enough. They'd better get a camera operating down there then.  

 

But it still doesn't solve a problem but has created one, that even in LIGHT  traffic, you have two major roads converging into a single carriageway, causing tailbacks, while an empty carriageway, designed to carry vehicles, (including public transport), sits empty of any vehicles, except for possiblly the occasional cyclist. 

 

Not a good use of previously spent £4.6 million, man hours or resources to improve traffic flow in the area.   

 

Only SCC could spend so much money & resources on sorting out a road improvement / traffic management scheme, then spend even more money & more man hours on 'planning' & physical work & end up with more congestion than they had 2 or 3 years ago in that area. 

 

But you are forgetting that bikes are wonderful, they are fantastic they are the solution to all known problems. 

 

But.....They dont use Shalesmoor road despite us being told by the cycle apologists that there would be hundreds using it from all over the north of England

[Becky B 31]

3 minutes ago, alchemist said:

But you are forgetting that bikes are wonderful, they are fantastic they are the solution to all known problems. 

 

But.....They dont use Shalesmoor road despite us being told by the cycle apologists that there would be hundreds using it from all over the north of England

You sound a bit like a petulant child with you first sentence, IMHO.  As do the other posters who have said the same/similar!

 

I don't know who the council consulted on this project, but I don't understand why that bit of Shalesmoor needed to have one lane made into a cycle lane, when cyclists can just go through Kelham Island?  That's what I do when I need to go that way.

 

Why didn't they just block Alma Street off to through traffic (I know they have done it as part of this scheme - I mean just do that without the other bit)?

[Baron99 779]

1 hour ago, Becky B said:

You sound a bit like a petulant child with you first sentence, IMHO.  As do the other posters who have said the same/similar!

 

I don't know who the council consulted on this project, but I don't understand why that bit of Shalesmoor needed to have one lane made into a cycle lane, when cyclists can just go through Kelham Island?  That's what I do when I need to go that way.

 

Why didn't they just block Alma Street off to through traffic (I know they have done it as part of this scheme - I mean just do that without the other bit)?

I think you're confusing petulance, in your opinion, with what it actually is from many, a good old dose of Sheffield sarcasm against SCC. 

 

You also don't know who SCC consulted on the project?  No neither do the rest of us.  They were just offered a shed load of money from Central Govt & it appears that the thinking is, "Let's spend it quickly in case they want it all back." 

 

It wouldn't surprise me, if someone tells me one day that  SCC has decided to pave Park Square roundabout & make a water feature out of it. 

 

Oh God no!  I've given the Planning Dept. & certain councillors an idea. 

Edited July 26, 2020 by Baron99

[Planner1 428]

12 minutes ago, Baron99 said:

You also don't know who SCC consulted on the project?  No neither do the rest of us.  They were just offered a shed load of money from Central Govt & it appears that the thinking is, "Let's spend it quickly in case they want it all back." 

 

No, the government had set very short timescales for spending the money, so there was no time to consult properly, so they didn't consult. Because the scheme has been done on a temporary basis, people would get the opportunity to have their say if it were proposed to be made permanent.

[Baron99 779]

2 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

No, the government had set very short timescales for spending the money, so there was no time to consult properly, so they didn't consult. Because the scheme has been done on a temporary basis, people would get the opportunity to have their say if it were proposed to be made permanent.

There you go Becky B, Planner1 has answered your question. 

[RJRB 688]

The Government is pushing a new health campaign,including a suggestion that doctors should advise or prescribe cycling as a good form of exercise,which it undoubtedly is.

I think that it would be infinitely better to promote and provide  safe cycling routes away from the main roads for leisure cyclists and families 

This of course would require the acknowledgment that most of those already cycling and certainly many of those who might take it up would mainly enjoy it as a leisure pursuit.

This might ultimately lead to people cycling to work,but they would undoubtedly still pick the most direct route .

Planners can dictate the route for motor vehicles with a variety of tools,but such limitations cannot be applied to cycling.

 

[Tony 10]

3 hours ago, Baron99 said:

It wouldn't surprise me, if someone tells me one day that  SCC has decided to pave Park Square roundabout & make a water feature out of it. 

 

Oh God no!  I've given the Planning Dept. & certain councillors an idea. 

Oh man, I don't know how to break this to you, make sure you are sat down with a brown paper bag because you're about to hyperventilate when you see this

 

Quote

Park Square roundabout and Sheaf Street would become a park and link into the Grey to Green scheme at Victoria Quays, Castlegate and West Bar.

 

https://www.thestar.co.uk/business/ps15bn-plan-sheffields-biggest-ever-2445918

 

 

 

 

[Becky B 31]

2 hours ago, RJRB said:

The Government is pushing a new health campaign,including a suggestion that doctors should advise or prescribe cycling as a good form of exercise,which it undoubtedly is.

I think that it would be infinitely better to promote and provide  safe cycling routes away from the main roads for leisure cyclists and families 

This of course would require the acknowledgment that most of those already cycling and certainly many of those who might take it up would mainly enjoy it as a leisure pursuit.

This might ultimately lead to people cycling to work,but they would undoubtedly still pick the most direct route .

Planners can dictate the route for motor vehicles with a variety of tools,but such limitations cannot be applied to cycling.

 

Cycling to and from work is an easy way of getting exercise into your day, especially for those who complain they don't have the time! I used to cycle home from work in Barnsley, because it was much more pleasant than driving home and going to a spin class, and took about the same time...

 

NB  I know this won't work for everyone, but haven't we already had someone on here who said she has taken up cycling and feels much better for it (and IIRC described herself as "not fit/your typical cyclist or something like that?)

 

3 hours ago, Planner1 said:

No, the government had set very short timescales for spending the money, so there was no time to consult properly, so they didn't consult. Because the scheme has been done on a temporary basis, people would get the opportunity to have their say if it were proposed to be made permanent.

Thanks!  That's why it makes no sense 🙂

[Baron99 779]

36 minutes ago, Tony said:

Oh man, I don't know how to break this to you, make sure you are sat down with a brown paper bag because you're about to hyperventilate when you see this

 

 

https://www.thestar.co.uk/business/ps15bn-plan-sheffields-biggest-ever-2445918

 

 

 

 

See what happens.  You throw a bizarre, ridiculous statement out there & 3 hours later, some SCC  urban planner comes up with this. 

 

Seriously, this is old news which has its own thread already on SF somewhere.  However if you do look closely at it, there's a 4 lane carriageway in the plan that looks as though it's intended to link to & from the bottom of the Parkway, running at the back of Midland Station.

 

If you look at a map, this 4 lane road runs right through the South St / Sheaf Valley Park, right in front of the Park Hill flats, (sorry, luxury apartments).  I bet if you've paid a small fortune for your flat there, you're going to be happy with a dual carriageway right in front of your flat. 

 

So probably better access to the M1 than there is now for vehicles, so I hope it all comes to fruition in this case.  No complaints from me. 

 

Actually, if you have an even closer look, bottom left hand corner.  Looks like a cyclist on the pavement?  Bloody typical. 

Edited July 26, 2020 by Baron99