Sheff Council - Shalesmoor Road Layout

[covfeffe 0]

Just now, Planner1 said:

Going to the local shops, leisure facilities and for exercise, basically most trips of up to 5km. Sheffield is not too hilly. Bern in Switzerland had good levels of cycling for just one example of somewhere that isn’t exactly flat. 
 

Bikes have gears and they are low enough to get up any hill. For those who really aren’t fit enough or who don’t want to put in that level of effort, there are lots of electric bikes nowadays, which make hills an absolute breeze. 

Whatever you say, its easier said than done believe me I've been there. 

 

Cycling is a nice leisure activity but people's general day to day activities can't be done on a bike.

 

You're only going to get away with pushing this so far; there will come a point where opposition to it will offer itself at the ballot box and people will vote accordingly. So watch it.

[Planner1 437]

8 minutes ago, covfeffe said:

Whatever you say, its easier said than done believe me I've been there. 

 

Cycling is a nice leisure activity but people's general day to day activities can't be done on a bike.

 

You're only going to get away with pushing this so far; there will come a point where opposition to it will offer itself at the ballot box and people will vote accordingly. So watch it.

I'm not pushing anything, I'm not a politician.

 

Promoting active travel, particularly cycling is local, regional and national government policy and is a major thrust of the way they intend to address future travel needs, air quality and health issues. All of the major political parties agree on this, so you might find some difficulty in electing someone who wants something different.

 

You are absolutely incorrect about most people's daily activities. The vast majority of people commute to one location and don't carry immense amounts of stuff with them. The vast majority of commuting trips are short and can easily be cycled. A large number of leisure or daily activities are also short trips which can be cycled.

Edited July 14, 2020 by Planner1

[RJRB 688]

Most motorists are going somewhere to do something.Whether it’s shopping to go to a workplace,because they are delivering items or because they are tradesmen.

Thats what drives the economy.

Most cyclists do so as a leisure pursuit and to keep fit and their chosen routes are to the countryside and the use of by ways rather than highways.

There are of course some exceptions.

Most cyclists prefer to go out when the weather is fine and dry for obvious reasons.

As most people are saying,including cyclists,this is the wrong place for an experiment and one must doubt the intelligence of whoever dreamt up this scheme,those who failed to challenge it and those who try to defend it.

 

[covfeffe 0]

14 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

I'm not pushing anything, I'm not a politician.

 

Promoting active travel, particularly cycling is local, regional and national government policy and is a major thrust of the way they intend to address future travel needs, air quality and health issues. All of the major political parties agree on this, so you might find some difficulty in electing someone who wants something different.

 

You are absolutely incorrect about most people's daily activities. The vast majority of people commute to one location and don't carry immense amounts of stuff with them. The vast majority of commuting trips are short and can easily be cycled. A large number of leisure or daily activities are also short trips which can be cycled.

People like to get around nicely dressed and perhaps smelling nice, not sweating cobs from riding a push iron.

 

The realistic solutions are technology for cleaner cars and a better and convenient public transport infrastructure. A mass cyclist society for Sheffield is a flatulent   fantasy so forget it.

[Igor 12]

42 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

Yes you did. You were asking for Cycling interventions that don’t affect others much, which is what transport authorities have been trying to do for decades and it hasn’t produced great results. Same old interventions, same old results. Nothing significant is going to be achieved without more radical measures.

I'm sorry but you are incorrect. Can you please point out where my statement mentions cycling interventions at all - no I don't think so!? You have chosen to interpret my words to suit your position rather than intepret them iterally. 

[Planner1 437]

13 minutes ago, covfeffe said:

People like to get around nicely dressed and perhaps smelling nice, not sweating cobs from riding a push iron.

 

The realistic solutions are technology for cleaner cars and a better and convenient public transport infrastructure. A mass cyclist society for Sheffield is a flatulent   fantasy so forget it.

Taking the city centre as an example and remembering we are talking about trips under 5km, most of the nearby residential areas are on the hills, so it's downhill or relatively flat to the city centre from where people live. You therefore don't get much of a sweat up going to work and if you do getting home, you can have a shower then. You can carry a change of clothes easily in a rucksack or panniers.

 

An electric or zero tailpipe emission vehicle still takes up road space and causes congestion and still produces particulate emissions, which are dangerous. Over-reliance on any motorised form of transport will still result in the same health issues from lack of activity and also still exclude people on low incomes who can't afford them. Any type of motorised vehicles can have a negative impact on the way we live our lives and structure our settlements. Planning for a more active travel oriented future can help to overcome many ills.

4 minutes ago, Igor said:

I'm sorry but you are incorrect. Can you please point out where my statement mentions cycling interventions at all - no I don't think so!? You have chosen to interpret my words to suit your position rather than intepret them iterally. 

Perhaps you would be kind enough to explain then?

Edited July 14, 2020 by Planner1

[Crissie 18]

14 minutes ago, covfeffe said:

Cycling is a nice leisure activity but people's general day to day activities can't be done on a bike.

 

I've recently bought an electric bike after not having cycled for 20 years.  It took a little time to get my confidence up but while the roads were quieter it was a great opportunity for that.  I live on a steep hill and can manage that with ease.  Probably when Winter comes I'll be back in the car, but I'm having a go for now.

 

My 5 mile each way commute to work takes less time than it does in a car.  The car's fuel and wear-and-tear savings will cover the cost of the bike in a couple of years.  I'm lucky enough to have secure storage for the bike at work, and a shower if I need it, although the electric assistance means I'm not sweating and out of breath when I arrive.  I've left a change of clothes at work for if it rains heavily, although it doesn't actually do very often funnily enough.

I can get to the local shops and supermarkets, and can carry plenty of goods in 2 panniers and a back-pack.

I can visit friends and relatives without using the car or bus.

I could (but choose not to, and don't advocate it) go to the pub and have a couple of drinks without worrying about drink-drive alcohol levels. 

I ride out into the Peak District at weekends and love being able to hear and smell it.

Other walkers, cyclists and joggers often pass with a friendly greeting.

I feel fitter and better.

 

So yes, with a bit of the right attitude, many day to day activities are accessible on a bike for some people. If I can do it, I'm sure a lot of others could too.

[carosio 186]

7 minutes ago, Crissie said:

I've recently bought an electric bike after not having cycled for 20 years.  It took a little time to get my confidence up but while the roads were quieter it was a great opportunity for that.  I live on a steep hill and can manage that with ease.  Probably when Winter comes I'll be back in the car, but I'm having a go for now.

 

 

What's its range (when peddling where possible) and how long to charge?

[RJRB 688]

8 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

Taking the city centre as an example and remembering we are talking about trips under 5km, most of the nearby residential areas are on the hills, so it's downhill or relatively flat to the city centre from where people live. You therefore don't get much of a sweat up going to work and if you do getting home, you can have a shower then. You can carry a change of clothes easily in a rucksack or panniers.

 

An electric or zero tailpipe emission vehicle still takes up road space and causes congestion and still produces particulate emissions, which are dangerous. Over-reliance on any motorised form of transport will still result in the same health issues from lack of activity and also still exclude people on low incomes who can't afford them. Any type of motorised vehicles can have a negative impact on the way we live our lives and structure our settlements. Planning for a more active travel oriented future can help to overcome many ills.

Perhaps you would be kind enough to explain then?

We all know the benefits of exercise whether it be walking ,cycling or going to the gym.

However this is not a route to the city centre.

It is a route around the city centre .

Stop defending the indefensible and get down there and witness the chaos that some “Planner” has dreamt up to pay lip service to a green dream.

[Planner1 437]

15 minutes ago, RJRB said:

We all know the benefits of exercise whether it be walking ,cycling or going to the gym.

However this is not a route to the city centre.

It is a route around the city centre .

Stop defending the indefensible and get down there and witness the chaos that some “Planner” has dreamt up to pay lip service to a green dream.

I'll beg to differ with you on that, it most certainly is a route to the city centre, depending on where you are coming from, or going to.

 

I don't need to "get down there" thanks, I've seen plenty of traffic queues, sat in plenty of them and cycled past a good few too.

 

I think you may be forgetting that the role of council officers is to recommend or advise. Politicians take the decisions.

[Baron99 794]

1 hour ago, Planner1 said:

I described the number as quite low, which it is, compared to the number who do comply with the law. As I said, the potential risks of a cyclist going through a red light is pretty low, that’s because they slow down, have a look round and carry on only if safe to do so. The risks involved when motorists contravene red lights are much more severe. 

 

The point is, If you listen to some people on here, they make out that the majority of cyclists ride irresponsibly, which is simply not true and it isn’t a major risk factor for the cyclists or others.

Yes you did. You were asking for Cycling interventions that don’t affect others much, which is what transport authorities have been trying to do for decades and it hasn’t produced great results. Same old interventions, same old results. Nothing significant is going to be achieved without more radical measures.

From my observations over the years, those that aren't jumping red lights, (and it doesn't matter if they slow down to see if it's safe to proceed against a red light, they are a road user & are required to obey the Highway Code.  You don't see drivers, driving through a pelican crossing that's been pressed, although there's no pedestrians on the crossing), are generally breaking the other law of riding on the pavement, endangering pedestrians. 

Edited July 14, 2020 by Baron99

[Planner1 437]

43 minutes ago, carosio said:

What's its range (when peddling where possible) and how long to charge?

This guide might help you: https://www.tredz.co.uk/help-advice/start-your-cycling-journey/e-bike-hub/what-is-the-range-of-an-electric-bike

 

15 minutes ago, Baron99 said:

 You don't see drivers, driving through a pelican crossing that's been pressed, although there's no pedestrians on the crossing), are generally breaking the other law of riding on the pavement, endangering pedestrians. 

You don't look very hard then.

 

On a daily basis I see drivers who run red lights. You go through a set of signals that are changing to red, look in your rear-view mirror and see another  three cars behind you, who most certainly came through on red.

 

I also on a daily basis see drivers who drive and park part way or fully on the footway. You see plenty of examples of appalling parking where pedestrians have to go out onto the road to pass.

 

There are poor road users in all modes of travel.