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14 hours ago, Anna B said:

1 )First of all, nobody knows if they are healthy or not even if the feel well The symptoms don't show themselves until day 5 or 6 by which time you coukd have infected a lot of people.That's why testing people is so mportant, but even health workers haven't had the test.

 

2) Watched Prime Ministers Questions this morning, MPs of both parties reporting many problems with employers who are flouting the rules and insisting workers work in unsafe conditions (eg unable to maintain a safe distance etc.  and threatening their employees with dismissal if they don't comply.)

Also people trying to claim Universal Credit has rocketed, and they are unable to cope. It never was good at coping in the first place with the 5 week wait being something of a myth. Many people already have to wait longer than 2 months. 

As with the self employed, many of the new claimants have no savings to fall back on.

 

So the 'idiots' have a choice, work or starve.

 

I agree that no one knows if they are healthy or not.  Some estimates suggest that up to 80% of the population may have been infected.  Unless we test we don't know.  I posted about this as well.  In some cases there may be no symptoms, so it's not necessarily true to suggest that they will appear by day 5 or 6.  What is even more concerning is that we do not know how long someone remains contagious.  With pandemic flu it's usually just the first 48 hours, but with this there are some reports of people remaining contagious for weeks ( based on Italian cases). 

 

I think what you describe under 2 above is shambolic, although it's unsurprising.  Human nature at its worst.  And I was not referring to workers as "idiots" btw - if that is your inference?  I was referring to people who take decisions against medical advice based on their own beliefs rather than evidence.

 

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, whiteowl said:

Having worked in big business, I'd bet a pound that it's already been requested and the request is slowly churning its way through procurement... 😂

And you would be correct 

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Posted (edited)

It seems ventilators are required for those that need them because of the thick mucus that builds up in the airways preventing normal breathing and once off the ventilator they then have to have a Tracheostomy.

I am waiting for the government announcement about self employed incomes. 

I think some are going to be very disappointed if it goes on past incomes and tax returns as I know some earn much more than they put down for tax.

I don't think we will need to be boarding up windows just yet but going through April is going to be hard and May is going to be tougher. Coming out mid June is realistic

Edited by Green Slime

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Posted (edited)

On a slightly different tack, on our daily walk my wife and I have seen some unusual wildlife activity in and around Mosborough... a pair of red kites, a heron flying across Mosborough Moor, and a squirrel scuttling under solar panels on a house on the Ribblesdale estate.  And yesterday a clouded yellow butterfly.

 

I can't help wondering about the impact of our quiet streets and cities on our rattus rattus population.  Cleaner streets, fewer rats visible?

Edited by steved32
Typo

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Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, Albert the Cat said:

Ok that was at best tenuous or at worst total garbage. 

 

The Oxford report is speculation based on epidemiology models. The only true way to get a reliable mortality statistic is by widespread testing, tracing and follow ups on closed cases. South Korea probably has the most reliable numbers and they are sitting at 3% across all groups. 

It is not garbage to state that the incidence of Corona virus infection is far far wider than the Govt's  published "confirmed cases". Their own advice is not to even bother contacting anyone (including the NHS) if you think you are infected. 

As regards the Oxford report you'll have to argue with them as to its accuracy. However, the Oxford report isn't the only one being rather moer positive about the outlook, I quoted earlier from an article The Times :

 

Just read an article in today's Times (page 11).

Latest research indicates that the death rate from this virus is probably 0.1 to 0.2 percent, not 1 percent.

This is for two main reasons :

1 - The statistics quoted are for those diagnosed as having the virus. They take no account of the far higher number who have never been diagnosed. Figures from China indicate that around a third of those who have had the coronavirus have no symptoms at all. Many more have mild symptoms and don't actually know if they've had the virus or just a cold. Many who are fairly sure they've had the virus haven't told the authorities they've had it, they've just recovered and got on with it.

2 - The "vast majority" of those who die have underlying medical conditions, yet, certainly in Italy (which reports one of the highest rates of death), anyone who dies whilst infected by the virus is being recorded as dying from coronavirus, as opposed to with coronavirus.

 

Don't get me wrong, I think there are going to be thousands of deaths of people from (and with) Corona virus and any death is sad. But the virus is out there, it cannot be stopped, we can only be as positive as we can, protect as many vulnerable people as possible, and try not to totally trash the economy because that may well kill more people, albeit indirectly.

Edited by Justin Smith

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1 hour ago, Justin Smith said:

Just read an article in today's Times (page 11).

Latest research indicates that the death rate from this virus is probably 0.1 to 0.2 percent, not 1 percent

https://inews.co.uk/news/sweden-coronavirus-no-lockdown-covid-19-measures-cases-deaths-social-distancing-restaurants-open-2517991

 

Only time will tell, the UK started off with a relaxed approach.

 

Sweden has become a global outlier in its approach to stopping the coronavirus.

Rather than imposing a lockdown like most of Europe, the country has avoided "draconian" regulations, telling its people to follow social distancing, only order food at restaurants via table service, and work from home if they can.

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1 hour ago, steved32 said:

On a slightly different tack, on our daily walk my wife and I have seen some unusual wildlife activity in and around Mosborough... a pair of red kites, a heron flying across Mosborough Moor, and a squirrel scuttling under solar panels on a house on the Ribblesdale estate.  And yesterday a clouded yellow butterfly.

 

I can't help wondering about the impact of our quiet streets and cities on our rattus rattus population.  Cleaner streets, fewer rats visible?

There is always some positives come out of any crisis, maybe this will become the norm in a few years time..

Climate change could become our biggest challenge..

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, DerbyTup said:

I agree that no one knows if they are healthy or not.  Some estimates suggest that up to 80% of the population may have been infected.  Unless we test we don't know.  I posted about this as well.  In some cases there may be no symptoms, so it's not necessarily true to suggest that they will appear by day 5 or 6.  What is even more concerning is that we do not know how long someone remains contagious.  With pandemic flu it's usually just the first 48 hours, but with this there are some reports of people remaining contagious for weeks ( based on Italian cases). 

 

I think what you describe under 2 above is shambolic, although it's unsurprising.  Human nature at its worst.  And I was not referring to workers as "idiots" btw - if that is your inference?  I was referring to people who take decisions against medical advice based on their own beliefs rather than evidence.

 

 

 

 

Not at all Derby, I wasn't referring to you at all, I was paraphrasing and it's a reference I've seen used all over the place including in the papers. (And they've called them at lot worse.) 

 

Take the jams of people on the London tube for example. Pictures abound.

However, the government want key workers to go to work, and issued a n extensive list which is open to interpretation, they have not been clear about things like 'essential' construction workers, and failed to curb exploitative employers who are insisting their employees attend work or else.... 

 

This amounts to thousands of workers, so what do the government do? Cut the transport system so people are crowded onto fewer trains. So who are the idiots?

 

Are the media highlighting bad behaviour, or aiming to shift the blame from the government to the people?

Edited by Anna B

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2 hours ago, steved32 said:

On a slightly different tack, on our daily walk my wife and I have seen some unusual wildlife activity in and around Mosborough... a pair of red kites, a heron flying across Mosborough Moor, and a squirrel scuttling under solar panels on a house on the Ribblesdale estate.  And yesterday a clouded yellow butterfly.

 

I can't help wondering about the impact of our quiet streets and cities on our rattus rattus population.  Cleaner streets, fewer rats visible?

I've noticed a complete lack of birdsong in our back garden, and the bird feeders which are usually very busy are hardly being used.

Anybody else experienced this?

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Just now, Anna B said:

I've noticed a complete lack of birdsong in our back garden, and the bird feeders which are usually very busy are hardly being used.

Anybody else experienced this?

Anna, they are self isolating like the rest of us.

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14 minutes ago, Anna B said:

Not at all Derby, I wasn't referring to you at all, I was paraphrasing and it's a reference I've seen used all over the place including in the papers. (And they've called them at lot worse.) 

 

Take the jams of people on the London tube for example. Pictures abound.

However, the government want key workers to go to work, and issued a n extensive list which is open to interpretation, they have not been clear about things like 'essential' construction workers, and failed to curb exploitative employers who are insisting their employees attend work or else.... 

 

This amounts to thousands of workers, so what do the government do? Cut the transport system so people are crowded onto fewer trains. So who are the idiots?

 

Are the media highlighting bad behaviour, or aiming to shift the blame from the government to the people?

Have the government cut the transport system or is it a case of transport companies doing that?  

 

People are responsible for their own actions.  Yes, the government can give directions and advise, they can even enforce a lockdown, but at the end of the day, they cannot stop people being idiots.  You really do have a boner for this government, don't you?  Instead of slating them on an online forum, why not put the laptop away and convert that negative energy doing something positive i.e. volunteering for the NHS or helping vulnerable people in your community :)

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Don't know if its coincident or not,  pollutions levels dropping , no aeroplanes flying, I've never seen a clearer cloudless blue sky.

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