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Consequences Of Brexit [Part 9] Read First Post Before Posting

Groose

Let me make this perfectly clear - any personal attacks will get you a suspension. The moderating team is not going to continually issue warnings. If you cannot remain civil and post within forum rules then do not bother to contribute.

 

In addition to remoaner we are also not going to allow the use of libdums or liebore - if you cannot behave like adults and post without recourse to these childish insults then please refrain from posting. If you have a problem with this then you all know where the helpdesk is. 

Message added by Groose

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If sending local money to London is bad, just imagine how terrible sending money further away to Brussels truly is!

 

Decentralise power, wealth and arms away from the centres of control and give them to the people!

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15 minutes ago, Car Boot said:

Decentralise power, wealth and arms away from the centres of control and give them to the people!

What if the people don't want them?

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18 minutes ago, Car Boot said:

If sending local money to London is bad, just imagine how terrible sending money further away to Brussels truly is!

Turns out, it's far far cheaper than sending it to London...

 

...plus, you get more benefits and a better service :?

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6 minutes ago, Magilla said:

Turns out, it's far far cheaper than sending it to London...

 

...plus, you get more benefits and a better service :?

Did the EU fund the NHS? Our state pensions? Benefit system? Education?

 

Or did the EU give us inflated prices, a fig leaf parliament that inhabits two countries and an extremely expensive bureaucracy?

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Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, Car Boot said:

Did the EU fund the NHS? Our state pensions? Benefit system? Education?

Since EU membership provided significant cost savings across the board compared to going it alone... it certainly helped... so yes, in part. :thumbsup:

 

Quote

Or did the EU give us inflated prices

No... :roll:

 

Quote

a fig leaf parliament that inhabits two countries and an extremely expensive bureaucracy?

Which, as above... turns out is far far less expensive, for a better service and benefits, than going it alone :?

Edited by Magilla

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Posted (edited)
57 minutes ago, Magilla said:

Since EU membership provided significant cost savings across the board compared to going it alone... it certainly helped... so yes, in part. :thumbsup:

 

No... :roll:

 

Which, as above... turns out is far far less expensive, for a better service and benefits, than going it alone :?

You're defending the expense and environmental damage caused by the fig leaf EU Parliament?

 

Auditors say moving MEPs and their staff from Belgium to France costs at least €114 million per year. It's not just the costs accrued by the monthly relocation but the environmental damage caused by the transportation of thousands of parliament officials, political groups, parliamentary assistants and freelance interpreters and paperwork that is transported by truck between the locations.

 

Better Off Out.

 

Give me the good old British Civil Service any day over the wasteful, expensive Eurocrats.

Edited by Car Boot

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8 hours ago, tzijlstra said:

Just as a matter of interest, I'll try and dissect how this relates to Brexit, as it invalidates the argument for Brexit. 

 

The theory of localism only works provided there is:

 

A) No global market and no demand in the local market for products only available on the global market, or: 

B) Abundant resources in the local market to enable production of all core products in demand, or:

C) Purchasing power at least equal to or better than competing 'localities'. 

 

A - we know is false, there is a global market and there is demand for products on that market. 

C - we know is going to be impacted by introduction of tariffs 

 

So B is the one of interest and the area where Brexiteers pin their hopes: We are apparently going to diversify our economy, rebuild manufacturing and become a proud exporting nation (once this rebuild is finished). 

 

That than leaves a few questions that I am sure you will provide a full answer to: 

 

B1: Where is the workforce coming from? There is scarcity on the job market as is. 

B2: Where are the resources coming from? The UK will be competing for raw resources with the likes of China, US, EU, India and many others. 

B3: Is the market here big enough to warrant investment of IP by multinationals? In other words, why would Nissan maintain their production capacity in Sunderland, knowing that it only sells 20% of cars manufactured in Sunderland in the UK? 

B4: How are locally produced products going to be competitive when the supply chain has now been extended to include waiting times at borders, bureaucratic checks and so on? 

 

Pedagogically a good lesson is one that raises questions and triggers critical debate, not one whereby a flawed theory is spelled out as fact. So once again, I am looking forward to the answers. 

So Tony,  care to provide answers to the above questions? Or are you really a bit like Car Boot, avoiding the points of criticism you can't deal with and yelling one-liners instead?  

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Posted (edited)
46 minutes ago, Car Boot said:

You're defending the expense and environmental damage caused by the fig leaf EU Parliament?

I'm defending it because it's cheaper than the UK going it alone! :thumbsup:

 

As such, there's more money available for all the things you claim to care about...

 

...funny how your solution to the plight of the needy is always that they should pay more, don't you think? :suspect: :hihi:

 

Quote

Auditors say moving MEPs and their staff from Belgium to France costs at least €114 million per year. It's not just the costs accrued by the monthly relocation but the environmental damage caused by the transportation of thousands of parliament officials, political groups, parliamentary assistants and freelance interpreters and paperwork that is transported by truck between the locations.

So, of course, your solution is to increase that environmental damage by advocating increased transportation of millions of tonnes of goods from the rest of the world rather than from suppliers on our doorstep...

 

...again, funny how your suggestions always make the particular problem you're railing against worse, isn't it? :suspect:

 

Edited by Magilla

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2 hours ago, Magilla said:

I'm defending it because it's cheaper than the UK going it alone! :thumbsup:

 

As such, there's more money available for all the things you claim to care about...

 

...funny how your solution to the plight of the needy is always that they should pay more, don't you think? :suspect: :hihi:

 

So, of course, your solution is to increase that environmental damage by advocating increased transportation of millions of tonnes of goods from the rest of the world rather than from suppliers on our doorstep...

 

...again, funny how your suggestions always make the particular problem you're railing against worse, isn't it? :suspect:

 

The UK 'going it alone', as you put it, gave us the NHS and the Welfare State. 

 

The EU gave us... Butter mountains.

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5 minutes ago, Car Boot said:

The UK 'going it alone', as you put it, gave us the NHS and the Welfare State. 

 

The EU gave us... Butter mountains.

Don't forget the wine lakes 😎

 

The UK "going it alone" Tories look pretty well set to dismantle the NHS and the Welfare State - how else are they going to balance the books as promised by Sunak?

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Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, Car Boot said:

Did the EU fund the NHS? Our state pensions? Benefit system? Education?

Is that the same NHS on which Johnson & Hancock just spaffed a cool £1bn and crumbs, for PPE, apps & assorted other supplies and services, on their mates' shelf companies that have delivered nothing fit for purpose (if anything at all)?

 

The same state pensions and benefits that are the lowest in Europe by some distance, even though the UK outpaced EU27 economies after the 2008 GFC?

 

The same education that had "what is the EU?" as the most Googled question the day after the referendum?

10 hours ago, Longcol said:

The UK "going it alone" Tories look pretty well set to dismantle the NHS and the Welfare State - how else are they going to balance the books as promised by Sunak?

The books aren't supposed to get balanced - how else are the Tories' backers going to get your great grand kids in hock to their hair roots by age 1 day, and back up chimneys for subsistence without a grumble?

 

Get with the programme ;)

Edited by L00b

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