Consequences Of Brexit [Part 9] Read First Post Before Posting

[melthebell 863]

1 hour ago, West 77 said:

Wanting your country to be a free sovereign nation again is hardly an extremist ideology.  

which to start with has been shown to be absolutely ********, we have ALWAYS been sovereign, so many things the EU has tried foisting on us and we told em where to stick it, we had the best deal when we were one of the big boys at the table, vetoing the bits we didnt like and keeping the bits we did.

Instead were under the table looking for crumbs, now were shouting very loudly that we want all of the good bits but NONE of the bad bits and heaping all the negatives at the EUs door

Edited December 10, 2020 by melthebell

[Mister M 1,624]

10 minutes ago, melthebell said:

which to start with has been shown to be absolutely ********, we have ALWAYS been sovereign, so many things the EU has tried foisting on us and we told em where to stick it, we had the best deal when we were one of the big boys at the table, vetoing the bits we didnt like and keeping the bits we did.

Instead were under the table looking for crumbs, now were shouting very loudly that we want all of the good bits but NONE of the bad bits and heaping all the negatives at the EUs door

My thoughts exactly Mel. And even if we did decide to rejoin the EU at some future date, it won't be on the same terms that we have now.

Moreover, one of the things that people complained about in relation to the EU, immigration, is driven much more by the market than Europe. Sooner or later, I think people who talk a great deal about being sovereign will realise that being sovereign without much power is little comfort.

[melthebell 863]

5 minutes ago, Mister M said:

My thoughts exactly Mel. And even if we did decide to rejoin the EU at some future date, it won't be on the same terms that we have now.

Moreover, one of the things that people complained about in relation to the EU, immigration, is driven much more by the market than Europe. Sooner or later, I think people who talk a great deal about being sovereign will realise that being sovereign without much power is little comfort.

somebody on one of Attila the stockbrokers new posts was banging on about refugees dying in the ocean, well guess what, they are still going to be coming, its NOTHING to do with the EU, they will still find even more illegal and dangerous ways to get here, and the go betweens will continue getting richer. We should be looking at why people are refugees and need to leave their countries of origin to start with

[El Cid 216]

8 minutes ago, Mister M said:

Moreover, one of the things that people complained about in relation to the EU, immigration, is driven much more by the market than Europe. Sooner or later, I think people who talk a great deal about being sovereign will realise that being sovereign without much power is little comfort.

Boris and Farage are both pro immigration.

[Mister M 1,624]

48 minutes ago, El Cid said:

Boris and Farage are both pro immigration.

And the majority of those who voted for Brexit?

[El Cid 216]

43 minutes ago, Mister M said:

And the majority of those who voted for Brexit?

There may be 10% that are anti immigration totally, but they tipped the ballance in 2016. Everyone is anti immigration if you put a photo of people coming here in dinghies. The reallity of immigration is that we cannot stop it, without turning our country into a hate ridden place.

Yes, try to slow it down, but do not preach hate, preach acceptance and understanding that immigration is not the problem. Politics that cannot build more houses or get better GP appointments is the problem.

[Mister M 1,624]

34 minutes ago, El Cid said:

There may be 10% that are anti immigration totally, but they tipped the ballance in 2016. Everyone is anti immigration if you put a photo of people coming here in dinghies. The reallity of immigration is that we cannot stop it, without turning our country into a hate ridden place.

Yes, try to slow it down, but do not preach hate, preach acceptance and understanding that immigration is not the problem. Politics that cannot build more houses or get better GP appointments is the problem.

You make some interesting points, & I'll add my views into the mix.

In #1773  you pointed out that both Johnson and Farage are pro immigration. Johnson more than likely is; his tenure as London Mayor, and subsequent speeches about offering asylum seekers an amnesty suggests that on this issue he's liberal minded. Not so sure that Farage is pro immigration, I would suggest that someone who is pro immigration would not stand in front of a poster like this:

 

I agree to a large extent with your sentiment that immigration is not the problem, but domestic policies and political rhetoric is the problem. Unfortunately the tenor of the debate has been to scapegoat migrants as the cause of Britain as an 'overcrowded island', indigenous parents not getting their child into a school  of their first choice, spiralling hospital waiting lists etc etc. Never about Government spending or austerity. However public services cost money, and the grim economic news of both COVID 19, and a no deal Brexit point to a future where there will be proportionately less money to spend on these services than we've been used to.

In a previous post I pointed out that those who voted Brexit because of immigration, will be disappointed largely because the pressure for migrants is partially market led, and that isn't going change, in fact, demographics suggest that trend is only going to increase.

 

Edited December 10, 2020 by Mister M

[RJRB 688]

Well spoken Mr M .It may eventually be realised by some that the supposed freedoms to control immigration will lead to no perceptible change in the future.

Nor will the control of our borders,but it stirred up the rabble and tipped the vote.

Meanwhile

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-45112872

I see some tariffs will be reduced so good news for bicycle tube buyers and other sundries

[Pettytom 1]

5 hours ago, RJRB said:

Presumably because you are reasonably comfortably set up,with an adequate income.

So job losses,increased prices,and other disruptions are of little concern compared with Sovereignty,the essence of which has never left us.

I would have hoped that someone could have done better.

If Johnson considers that No Deal is an acceptable conclusion then he has been a total failure.

 

I’ve looked and looked, but I can’t see anything to look forward to in a no deal situation. It s a ludicrous outcome and a total failure of government. Not a surprise really as this government are failing in every single area.

 

Here is the Telegraph’s take on no deal. It’s not pretty, but it is pretty expensive.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/12/10/no-deal-brexit-means-might-happen-might-affect-daily-life-uk/?adobe_mc=TS%3D1607635166|MCMID%3D13174724000064698623774641771990406057|MCORGID%3D2C7336C753C676BA0A490D4B%40AdobeOrg

[L00b 441]

3 hours ago, Mister M said:

My thoughts exactly Mel. And even if we did decide to rejoin the EU at some future date, it won't be on the same terms that we have now.

(...)

Had, until end January 2020. Sorry Mister M.

 

Best y'all get ready for an Australia-style deal, then.

[Longcol 600]

55 minutes ago, Pettytom said:

I’ve looked and looked, but I can’t see anything to look forward to in a no deal situation. It s a ludicrous outcome and a total failure of government. Not a surprise really as this government are failing in every single area.

 

Here is the Telegraph’s take on no deal. It’s not pretty, but it is pretty expensive.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/12/10/no-deal-brexit-means-might-happen-might-affect-daily-life-uk/?adobe_mc=TS%3D1607635166|MCMID%3D13174724000064698623774641771990406057|MCORGID%3D2C7336C753C676BA0A490D4B%40AdobeOrg

I'm sure I've seen some Brexiteers say they are looking forward to trading under WTO rules.

 

From the Telegraph link;

 

"If there is no deal, the UK will trade with the bloc on World Trade Organisation (WTO) rules from January 1, meaning all imports and exports would be subject to border checks, quotas and tariffs.

Medicines are not subject to tariffs under WTO rules, but agricultural and manufactured goods such as cars would become more expensive. The price of cars could increase by 10 per cent while some food products such as cheese and beef could see a 50 per cent price hike, according to calculations by the British Retail Consortium (BRC).

Approximately 30 per cent of the food in British supermarkets is imported from the EU, meaning consumers can expect to see a dramatic increase in their weekly food bill if a deal is not agreed upon."

[RJRB 688]

39 minutes ago, Longcol said:

I'm sure I've seen some Brexiteers say they are looking forward to trading under WTO rules.

 

From the Telegraph link;

 

"If there is no deal, the UK will trade with the bloc on World Trade Organisation (WTO) rules from January 1, meaning all imports and exports would be subject to border checks, quotas and tariffs.

Medicines are not subject to tariffs under WTO rules, but agricultural and manufactured goods such as cars would become more expensive. The price of cars could increase by 10 per cent while some food products such as cheese and beef could see a 50 per cent price hike, according to calculations by the British Retail Consortium (BRC).

Approximately 30 per cent of the food in British supermarkets is imported from the EU, meaning consumers can expect to see a dramatic increase in their weekly food bill if a deal is not agreed upon."

Repeat the mantra “Project fear,Project fear” every morning for 30 minutes.

It seems to work for some.