Consequences Of Brexit [Part 9] Read First Post Before Posting

[Albert the Cat 0]

3 hours ago, Baron99 said:

Reading in the 'i' newspaper yesterday that countries such as Italy & Spain who have been hit hardest by COVID-19 & already having fragile economies, are looking for a strong financial response that deploys "Financial instruments adapted to a war."  In other words, financial help & shared financial responsibility between their EU partners. 

 

Guess what?  The likes of Germany & Holland are saying 'No' as they fear that it could lead to eurozone members pooling public debt.  

 

In other words Italy & Spain, the COVID-19 in your countries are your problem, if your economies go into further freefall because of it, tough, we're not bailing you.

Then why is our country the only one to have its credit rating downgraded?

[Baron99 778]

1 hour ago, Albert the Cat said:

Then why is our country the only one to have its credit rating downgraded?

I think you'll find that countries are having their credit ratings amended all the time.  It doesn't happen to them all at the same time, it's dependent on current circumstances that would possibly affect a country's economy.  It just so happens that the UK's was only recently amended & of course how an economy is viewed by investors is not only down to the various credit rating organisations but also how the investors themselves view a country's economic outlook, which maybe entirely different: 

 

https://www.ft.com/content/556954ae-1aad-4538-b6e2-b0abe391daf8

 

I think the telling statement from the above is "The world's sixth largest economy." 

 

Also looking at the latest credit ratings, across S&P, Fitch & Moody, the UK has a higher credit rating than both Italy & Spain. 

 

https://tradingeconomics.com/united-kingdom/rating

 

Not doing to bad outside the EU. 

Edited March 29, 2020 by Baron99

[Albert the Cat 0]

3 hours ago, Baron99 said:

I think you'll find that countries are having their credit ratings amended all the time.  It doesn't happen to them all at the same time, it's dependent on current circumstances that would possibly affect a country's economy.  It just so happens that the UK's was only recently amended & of course how an economy is viewed by investors is not only down to the various credit rating organisations but also how the investors themselves view a country's economic outlook, which maybe entirely different: 

 

https://www.ft.com/content/556954ae-1aad-4538-b6e2-b0abe391daf8

 

I think the telling statement from the above is "The world's sixth largest economy." 

 

Also looking at the latest credit ratings, across S&P, Fitch & Moody, the UK has a higher credit rating than both Italy & Spain. 

 

https://tradingeconomics.com/united-kingdom/rating

 

Not doing to bad outside the EU. 

We are doing horribly outside the EU. Talking about credit ratings for a start, we used to have the same ratings as Germany at AAA along with a a few other EU countries, but not anymore. Not to mention that the FTSE is getting battered more than most since YTD.

 

Thousands of unnecessary deaths due to COVID-19 will occur because we didn't sign up to the EU's procurement initiative for medical equipment. We would've been in it automatically. I wish that the thousands of European health workers that left due to Brexit are still here. 

 

As Brexiteers have said, this country is overpopulated.  Don't worry, it is getting a decent reduction now. 

[Baron99 778]

13 hours ago, Albert the Cat said:

We are doing horribly outside the EU. Talking about credit ratings for a start, we used to have the same ratings as Germany at AAA along with a a few other EU countries, but not anymore. Not to mention that the FTSE is getting battered more than most since YTD.

 

Thousands of unnecessary deaths due to COVID-19 will occur because we didn't sign up to the EU's procurement initiative for medical equipment. We would've been in it automatically. I wish that the thousands of European health workers that left due to Brexit are still here. 

 

As Brexiteers have said, this country is overpopulated.  Don't worry, it is getting a decent reduction now. 

So no sound financial evidence to provide a counter argument just the old, very old, Project Fear rhetoric. 

 

Just examine the 'TE' credit ratings that offer guidance to investors & look at the European 'big hitters'? 

 

Germany (100) prime credit rating. 

UK & France (both 92), high grade credit rating. 

Spain (70), upper medium credit rating. 

Italy (62), lower medium credit rating. 

 

Above are facts not unfounded rhetoric. 

 

Yes we could be better than the 6th best economy in the world but give us a bit of time to shake off the shackles of COVID-19 & the EU legacy & we'll see how we get on. 

 

Certainly when the world does sort out COVID-19, & it will, we'll pick up from where we left off & that will still be in a position where we already had a stronger economy than most of our European cousins. 

 

The UK, while tourism is an important sector, it's not as important as it is to the economies of the like of Spain & Italy & it will be years before they recoup the monies lost in the last few & coming months.  Even when COVID-19 is over in Italy & Spain, tourists will be wary of returning due to the high number of deaths they have sadly suffered.  That legacy will last a long time. 

 

As stated earlier, the likes of Germany & Holland aren't going to bail their EU partners out on this one for fear of a precedent. 

Edited March 30, 2020 by Baron99

[Albert the Cat 0]

9 hours ago, Baron99 said:

So no sound financial evidence to provide a counter argument just the old, very old, Project Fear rhetoric. 

 

Just examine the 'TE' credit ratings that offer guidance to investors & look at the European 'big hitters'? 

 

Germany (100) prime credit rating. 

UK & France (both 92), high grade credit rating. 

Spain (70), upper medium credit rating. 

Italy (62), lower medium credit rating. 

 

Above are facts not unfounded rhetoric. 

 

Yes we could be better than the 6th best economy in the world but give us a bit of time to shake off the shackles of COVID-19 & the EU legacy & we'll see how we get on. 

 

Certainly when the world does sort out COVID-19, & it will, we'll pick up from where we left off & that will still be in a position where we already had a stronger economy than most of our European cousins. 

 

The UK, while tourism is an important sector, it's not as important as it is to the economies of the like of Spain & Italy & it will be years before they recoup the monies lost in the last few & coming months.  Even when COVID-19 is over in Italy & Spain, tourists will be wary of returning due to the high number of deaths they have sadly suffered.  That legacy will last a long time. 

 

As stated earlier, the likes of Germany & Holland aren't going to bail their EU partners out on this one for fear of a precedent. 

What did I say was rhetoric? So the FTSE100 didn't suffer a worst hit than the other major financial indices in Europe this year?

 

Are you also going to tell me thousands of doctors and nurses from the EU DIDN'T leave the UK because of Brexit? Go ahead, I dare you. 

[RJRB 688]

1 hour ago, Albert the Cat said:

What did I say was rhetoric? So the FTSE100 didn't suffer a worst hit than the other major financial indices in Europe this year?

 

Are you also going to tell me thousands of doctors and nurses from the EU DIDN'T leave the UK because of Brexit? Go ahead, I dare you. 

If many of those who voted for Brexit cannot now see why we are stronger together and that we threw away a very privileged position then they never will.

Project Fear to my mind was the lies and misinformation spread by Farage and Co to whip up a susceptible section of voters.

Shortage of doctors,nurses,care workers.

You only have to watch the TV to see how reliant,and thankful we should be for immigrant workers.

BTW where is Farage.

Is he in Trump Towers or perhaps in Germany?

Edited March 30, 2020 by RJRB

[L00b 441]

8 hours ago, RJRB said:

(...)

BTW where is Farage.

Is he in Trump Towers or perhaps in Germany?

After deplatforming himself as an MEP, since he can't do the rounds currently, he's on Twitter agitating for plebes to ignore self-isolation and to go back to work (I've let myself be told that he's also busy setting up a help-the-farmers-with-crop-picking scheme with his UKIP/BXP plc following. £50 to join 😉)

 

More seriously now, formal minutes published today show that the UK took part in four meetings with the EU27 about the procurement of  PPE, ventilators etc since late January.

 

So the "communications problem" reported by the ex-Leave crew in charge, that has allegedly caused the UK to pull out of these coordinating opportunities, is nothing other than the Brexit ideological filter at work.

 

That this could end up costing the lives of so many elderly Brexit voters/faithfuls, is quite the irony. We may well be back to the turkeys/Xmas analogy before long.

[El Cid 212]

18 minutes ago, West 77 said:

The decision about our membership of the EU has been made and we have now officially left the EU.  It's irrelevant now whether we are stronger together by being a member of the EU.  Every country has a shortage of doctors, nurses and care workers regardless of whether they are a member of the EU.

The NHS and others have been saying for years that there is a shortage of doctors/nurses; I do believe its real now.

The only difference in relation to coronavirus, with us now being out of the EU, has been this ventilator scheme that we failed to join. So no benefit from being out of the EU, just a posible negative.

[RJRB 688]

52 minutes ago, West 77 said:

The decision about our membership of the EU has been made and we have now officially left the EU.  It's irrelevant now whether we are stronger together by being a member of the EU.  Every country has a shortage of doctors, nurses and care workers regardless of whether they are a member of the EU.

So we possibly took the wrong fork in the road and must press on towards the cliff edge,irrespective of the alternatives of stopping and reviewing the situation.

What an irresponsible attitude.

 

 

Edited March 31, 2020 by RJRB

[RJRB 688]

Just now, West 77 said:

The Government are working with the Formula One teams and other technical people to make ventilators quickly.  There is a World shortage of ventilators which EU hasn't got a magic wand to solve.

 

We had a chance  to stop Brexit on 12th December last year but the electorate chose to elect the Tory Party with a big majority.  Brexit is only a cliff edge in your opinion. Brexit hasn't caused the coronvirus which is the World's biggest crisis since the second World war.  

 

 

If you cannot see the benefit of the closest cooperation between communities and countries which I have always believed to be beneficial,but particularly so in the current circumstances then I can say little more.

As I have said previously some areas will recover before others and any friction to trade is detrimental.

I am not necessarily talking about the movement of physical goods,but also the closest cooperation with medics,scientists.throughout Europe and the world.

The Tory Party is sensibly having to abandon some of its normal core policies so who knows what is around the corner.

 

[RJRB 688]

Coincidentally,just watching BBC report on movement within the Schengen area.

Many borders are up to prevent unnecessary movement,but lorries with essential supplies are fast tracked through between countries.

[Albert the Cat 0]

The FT has just reported that the cost by the UK government far outstrips other EU countries in supporting the economy with the measures announced.  We are spending 0.225 per cent of annual GDP per week.  That's £6bn!  To give you some context, the annual NHS bill is £140bn.  So the wage guarantee for just under half a year will match what we spend on the NHS.  Maxing out the country's credit card quite nicely.  The other EU governments haven't gone anywwhere near as far.  Wonder why.....