Robin-H 11 #157 Posted February 26, 2020 5 minutes ago, L00b said: I have a source for my claim indeed, but not for your '£500bn' Torygraph strawman which, as usual, you can shove. I'm old enough to remember Osbourne in 2010, then Hammond since, repeatedly promising to eliminate the deficit and balance the budget by 2015, 2017, 2019/2020.,. Numbers don't stop being accurate just because you don't like where they were published. They are either accurate or they aren't. Unfortunately that source doesn't back up your claim at all, partially because it's actually talking about an entirely different thing. You said 'spend on Brexit preparations'. The source you provided is about the 'economic cost' of Brexit. Two entirely different things. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
L00b 441 #158 Posted February 26, 2020 (edited) 34 minutes ago, Robin-H said: Numbers don't stop being accurate just because you don't like where they were published. They are either accurate or they aren't. Quite an odd comment for you to make, if you read my link: that £500bn figure from the Telegraph which you quoted? The actual figure is less than half that: Quote In that time the UK’s net contribution to the EU between 1973 and 2018 was about £216 billion in real terms (accounting for the way prices change over time and using 2019 prices). The net contribution was £156 billion in cash terms (not accounting for inflation). It's the £350m all over again 34 minutes ago, Robin-H said: Unfortunately that source doesn't back up your claim at all, partially because it's actually talking about an entirely different thing. You said 'spend on Brexit preparations'. The source you provided is about the 'economic cost' of Brexit. Two entirely different things. Talk about a pyrrhic debating victory earned on semantics! Quote Other reports have made a more defensible claim: that Brexit will “have soon cost” or “is set to cost” the UK more than 47 years of payments to the EU budget. But these still depend on accepting an uncertain estimate for the cost of Brexit so far, plus even more uncertain estimates of the future cost. And even then, the figure at the end of 2020 is still slightly lower Edited February 26, 2020 by L00b Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
alchresearch 214 #159 Posted February 26, 2020 On 25/02/2020 at 01:05, Longcol said: So any comments about the Tory austerity agenda which you seem to have avoided for a few years? https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/feb/24/austerity-blamed-for-life-expectancy-stalling-for-first-time-in-century How is Brexit going to help? Is there a more obvious reason why growth in life expectancy should be stalling, ‘lifestyle issues’ for example? Three in five are now officially overweight or obese. The effect on cases of diabetes has been dramatic — the number of Britons with the disease, according to Diabetes UK, has risen from 2.9 million in 2011 to 4.7 million in 2019. Sufferers are at significantly increased risk of heart disease and stroke. Obesity is also a big factor in cancer risk. You have only to look around a typical British town to see how junk food has become a staple part of the diet - takeaway after takeaway. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Baron99 795 #160 Posted February 26, 2020 4 minutes ago, alchresearch said: Is there a more obvious reason why growth in life expectancy should be stalling, ‘lifestyle issues’ for example? Three in five are now officially overweight or obese. The effect on cases of diabetes has been dramatic — the number of Britons with the disease, according to Diabetes UK, has risen from 2.9 million in 2011 to 4.7 million in 2019. Sufferers are at significantly increased risk of heart disease and stroke. Obesity is also a big factor in cancer risk. You have only to look around a typical British town to see how junk food has become a staple part of the diet - takeaway after takeaway. Agree with you. In days gone by those described as poor would be thin as rakes. Now they're more likely to be grossly overweight. There was a doctor speaking on the radio about life expectancy & he said, first & foremost, people should be taking responsibility for their own well being. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
L00b 441 #161 Posted February 27, 2020 (edited) 18 hours ago, alchresearch said: Is there a more obvious reason why growth in life expectancy should be stalling, ‘lifestyle issues’ for example? (...) The DWP is busy shredding the records of those benefits claimants, who committed suicide after being harshly sanctioned. Sure, it's a statistical blip in the ocean of data explaining why life expectancy is shrinking in the UK, but that data deletion takes place in a wider context of systematic and widespread data suppression and misrepresentation by Johnson, Patel, Cummings and co. So don't expect solid datasets to be available across the next 5 years of Conservative governance to help explain these, and any other, adverse consequences of Tory government policies, least of all those of Brexit (which, I see, Johnson is currently busy steering back towards no deal by December, a course seemingly missed -or deliberately ignored, same difference- by all and sundry in the UK MSM). Brits who voted for leaving the EU knowing what they wanted, will get the same Brexit they're given by Johnson & pals, as all the other Brits. You'll all be told to blame the imperialist and intransigeant EU for your misery, and after Johnson & pals are done bedding in that narrative in the collective conscience over the next 10 months, a majority of you will inevitably do so, just like they did in 2016, 2017, 2019... Edited February 27, 2020 by L00b Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
RJRB 688 #162 Posted February 27, 2020 4 hours ago, L00b said: The DWP is busy shredding the records of those benefits claimants, who committed suicide after being harshly sanctioned. Sure, it's a statistical blip in the ocean of data explaining why life expectancy is shrinking in the UK, but that data deletion takes place in a wider context of systematic and widespread data suppression and misrepresentation by Johnson, Patel, Cummings and co. So don't expect solid datasets to be available across the next 5 years of Conservative governance to help explain these, and any other, adverse consequences of Tory government policies, least of all those of Brexit (which, I see, Johnson is currently busy steering back towards no deal by December, a course seemingly missed -or deliberately ignored, same difference- by all and sundry in the UK MSM). Brits who voted for leaving the EU knowing what they wanted, will get the same Brexit they're given by Johnson & pals, as all the other Brits. You'll all be told to blame the imperialist and intransigeant EU for your misery, and after Johnson & pals are done bedding in that narrative in the collective conscience over the next 10 months, a majority of you will inevitably do so, just like they did in 2016, 2017, 2019... There is no wonder that you fled the UK shortly after the Brexit vote as you seem to have a very low opinion of the British people. Your sweeping generalisation that all and sundry are taken in by the machinations of Johnson and Cummings is laughable. Thanks for stating the exceedingly obvious in your final paragraph but rest assured that there are many who recognise which way the wind is blowing. We are in a phoney year of negotiations ,and thereafter the grim reality of job losses,lack of inward investment and a host of other detrimental aspects of Brexit will become apparent. We will have to endure this regrettably. Brexit was only ever a project of those who consider themselves to be the ruling class by right,but their mobilisation of others on the back of the immigration “crisis “ got them over the line. Johnson will have his coupleof years of glory before his popularity wanes,and I doubt that Cummings will be on the scene for that long. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Litotes 63 #163 Posted February 27, 2020 Lies damned lies and brexit! Yet again, having conned the UK into giving them a majority, the government goes agqainst what it promised the electorate. They are throwing all their promises, all the talk of agreement with the EU, alignment through NI and the borders into the bin. They are making demands of the EU that the EU cannot agree to, and should not, because that wasn't what was agreed... having said that we are led by a liar, cheat, sexist racist bufoon who cares nothing for the country, only for himself, so why am I surprised? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Albert the Cat 0 #164 Posted February 27, 2020 My work is immune from Brexit and I am effectively guaranteed employment for the next 20+ years till retirement. So I have very little sympathy for the people who will soon start suffering. I voted to remain in the EU. I tried, I really did. But if people want to lose their jobs and go to food banks then let them. I'll just grab my popcorn. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Mister Gee 823 #165 Posted February 27, 2020 16 minutes ago, Albert the Cat said: My work is immune from Brexit and I am effectively guaranteed employment for the next 20+ years till retirement. So I have very little sympathy for the people who will soon start suffering. I voted to remain in the EU. I tried, I really did. But if people want to lose their jobs and go to food banks then let them. I'll just grab my popcorn. I disagree Albert, I’m always going to stick up for folk that have been conned. It’s the conmen like Farage that need to suffer. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
melthebell 863 #166 Posted February 27, 2020 3 hours ago, Litotes said: Lies damned lies and brexit! Yet again, having conned the UK into giving them a majority, the government goes agqainst what it promised the electorate. They are throwing all their promises, all the talk of agreement with the EU, alignment through NI and the borders into the bin. They are making demands of the EU that the EU cannot agree to, and should not, because that wasn't what was agreed... having said that we are led by a liar, cheat, sexist racist bufoon who cares nothing for the country, only for himself, so why am I surprised? Yup, what ive seen and read is thus... 1: The EU have drafted their starting proposals. 2: The UK hasnt. 3: Boris has been whining and whinging that the EU are being unfair. 4: Boris is threatening to tear up his withdrawl document if he doesnt get his way. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Litotes 63 #167 Posted February 27, 2020 No mention of the GFA in the document - only of Peace Plus -another naffcronym from the Cons No mention of the agreed alignment between Eire and NI despite this being contradictory to the border agreement - just more lies from our lying, cheating sexist racist bully of a leader. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Robin-H 11 #168 Posted February 27, 2020 52 minutes ago, melthebell said: Yup, what ive seen and read is thus... 1: The EU have drafted their starting proposals. 2: The UK hasnt. 3: Boris has been whining and whinging that the EU are being unfair. 4: Boris is threatening to tear up his withdrawl document if he doesnt get his way. No 2. So what was published today? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...