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Julie Dore Standing Down From Council In May

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2 hours ago, Martin C said:

I assume I'm (as if often the case) over-concerned here but I'd still welcome a categorical assurance that the whole "city of sanctuary" thing under Julie's watch hasn't led to any increase (whatsoever) in council (or policing) costs.

No idea, but City of Sanctuary started in Sheffield in 2005 when Jan Wilson was leader, long before Julie Dore's spell in office.  Although Sheffield was first, it is now part of a huge network across the UK.  Most of the money comes from various charities, and grants from local authorities will be a small part.    Much of the support is from volunteers.   

 

Putting in a Freedom of Information request to the council could give you the information you want.   

 

 

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If Julie Dore is like the rest of the Labour councillors I know, from my own experience, they're what used to be known as "machine politicians". That is to say they are not in it "to make a difference" and stand up for their constituents, at least not if it means making waves and being put in an awkward position. They just want the power and an easy life. I had/have a very serious issue with SIV ( a major linked organisation to the council who are subsidised by them), but none of the Labour group were interested*, the worst being Mary Lea who actually said to me she wasn't interested in what I could prove and would do nothing about it. Even worse she declined to give me that in writing, such was her confidence in her position. None of them deserve to be in office and I will never vote for them again.

 

* Actually that's not quite true, Francyne Johnson did agree to look into it, but, without going into details, displayed a typical left winger's personality, idealist but naïve. And she was the best of them, which is all you need to know.

Edited by Justin Smith

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On 12/01/2020 at 16:04, Chaddamp said:

She over paid like ALL public sector workers compared with private sector employees ,can't wait til we can see employment conditions of pay and pension rights of average worker against average  private sector employee .The general public would NEVER vote Labour in again if that was published factually  .So much of the public sector is over manned and inefficient and too costly hence high taxes.Just one example... at a recent funeral when I was a pole bearer for my dear friend,the Sheffield Mayor turned up,complete with his driver and polished Jaguar vehicle,its just so ponssy 

OOOh and what pension will she be on ???????

Really??? i can personally vouch that i could/have earn(ed) a lot more in the private sector for my job than i do/have

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23 hours ago, Chaddamp said:

They don't work hard enough,too much easy flexi time being built up to get extra time off,too much sick time taken with full pay,think you need to look into private sector rights ,or is that too frightening for you to contemplate?

I can only speak of the sector I work in, but my experience is:

  • Council workers are often as good or better at their jobs than the private sector. There are good and not so good people in both sectors.
  • People in the public sector work very hard. Many, particularly the managers, are over-worked and put in massive amounts of hours, which can catch up with them and lead to absence. Many Council departments are under staffed because of funding cuts, but the demands for the services are still there, even when there are less staff.
  • The benefits of flexible working are widely available in the private sector too.
  • Private sector working conditions (ie the office spaces, equipment, IT)  are often much better than the Council's. The private sector do actually appear to act on the theory that their workers are their best asset and understand that productivity increases and absenteeism drops when you provide good working conditions.
  • Councils tend to cram as many workers as they can into their offices (to cut accommodation costs) , which leads to a regimented office layout with rows and rows of desks, which often isn't the best layout for the type of work being done. Private sector offices tend to be more modern, better equipped and better planned for the type of work being done.
  • Private sector offices I visit have very nice perks for the staff, like free tea/coffee/soft drinks and a subsidised restaurant.
  • Private sector pensions are just as good as the ones Council staff now get.
  • Your legal employment rights are the same whether it's private or public sector. you can't just fire people who don't meet your expectations, there has to be proper process. It's the same in any reasonable size organisation, private or public. There are far less union members in Councils nowadays, so trade union influence is not what it once was.
2 hours ago, Justin Smith said:

If Julie Dore is like the rest of the Labour councillors I know, from my own experience, they're what used to be known as "machine politicians". That is to say they are not in it "to make a difference" and stand up for their constituents, at least not if it means making waves and being put in an awkward position. They just want the power and an easy life. I had/have a very serious issue with SIV ( a major linked organisation to the council who are subsidised by them), but none of the Labour group were interested*, the worst being Mary Lea who actually said to me she wasn't interested in what I could prove and would do nothing about it. Even worse she declined to give me that in writing, such was her confidence in her position. None of them deserve to be in office and I will never vote for them again.

 

* Actually that's not quite true, Francyne Johnson did agree to look into it, but, without going into details, displayed a typical left winger's personality, idealist but naïve. And she was the best of them, which is all you need to know.

I don't believe that is true. I think they mostly do it because they want to make a difference. Some are better than others, but that's the case in all walks of life / professions.

 

I'll give you Jack Scott as an example of someone who I believe genuinely wants to get things done and make a difference.

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17 hours ago, linaker said:

Sheffield Council is run by its officers, not Julie Dore or the "cabinet". Her "job" consists of occasionally deciding between a couple of options put to her by the officers. 

That is absolutely not true and you'd know this if you had any involvement with them.

 

The Cabinet Members work very closely with the officers in their portfolios and a great deal of work is done behind the scenes before any of the "options" you speak of are put to the senior Members for a decision. The Cabinet Member is often the decision maker as authority is delegated to them. They do a lot of detailed work with the officers to shape the proposals that are eventually put to them in a decision report, which is  a public document. The Cabinet Member is responsible for briefing their political group / the Leader on what decisions are coming forward and feeding back to the officers anything that comes from those discussions.

 

Like many of these things, the bit the public sees is only the tip of the iceberg. 

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Over all the conservatives are  coming,get ready all that think Sheffield will always be Labour run,I remember one wet spring not long ago when grass couldn't be cut,the litter pickers asked for help and grass cutters said "no thats not our job" so they sat for days doing nothing and getting paid.Same with gritters when heavy frost or snow comes,they agree a big bonus to basically do their job before doing the job they are already going to get paid for,get rid of Unions,they cost tax payer ,if they don't like it ,get a job in private sector where they'll find the attitude more in ,line with modern work practices

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58 minutes ago, Planner1 said:

[machine politicians]

I don't believe that is true. I think they mostly do it because they want to make a difference. Some are better than others, but that's the case in all walks of life / professions.

 

I'll give you Jack Scott as an example of someone who I believe genuinely wants to get things done and make a difference.

I take quite an interest in politics, and I hear all these political reporters saying they don't like the lack of respect politicians get, "because  most / all the politicians they know are in it to make a difference". And I'm sure the politicians themselves would say the same thing. But, after my experience with a number of Labour councillors this year, I would not apply that to any of them. My issue, without going into details, is a proven case of being very badly treated by a linked organisation to the council. The fact is that any of those councillors could have taken the time to let me prove my case to them, then "made some waves". But, with the possible exception of Francyne Johnson, none wanted to do that. They wanted an easy life, not having to risk upsetting senior managers at SIV,  or indeed other Labour councillors. As I said before Mary Lea wouldn`t even give me her position in writing ! I do not know whether such attitudes are unique to Labour councillors (I may well find out in the next month or so.....) but at the moment I`m even more cynical than I was before.

 

Edited by Justin Smith

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17 minutes ago, Justin Smith said:

I take quite an interest in politics, and I hear all these political reporters saying they don't like the lack of respect politicians get, "because  most / all the politicians they know are in it to make a difference". And I'm sure the politicians themselves would say the same thing. But, after my experience with a number of Labour councillors this year, I would not apply that to any of them. My issue, without going into details, is a proven case of being very badly treated by a linked organisation to the council. The fact is that any of those councillors could have taken the time to let me prove my case to them, then "made some waves". But, with the possible exception of Francyne Johnson, none wanted to do that. They wanted an easy life, not having to risk upsetting senior managers at SIV,  or indeed other Labour councillors. As I said before Mary Lea wouldn`t even give me her position in writing ! I do not know whether such attitudes are unique to Labour councillors (I may well find out in the next month or so.....) but at the moment I`m even more cynical than I was before.

 

Yes and one has other such gems as a well known councillor creating fake twitter accounts to troll his own constituents during the tree scandal in recent years.

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22 hours ago, linaker said:

Sheffield Council is run by its officers, not Julie Dore or the "cabinet". Her "job" consists of occasionally deciding between a couple of options put to her by the officers. 

 

4 hours ago, Planner1 said:

That is absolutely not true and you'd know this if you had any involvement with them.

It's because I have had close involvement with them that I made that statement. Some of them just do whatever the officers tell them. 

 

7 hours ago, Justin Smith said:

...they are not in it "to make a difference" and stand up for their constituents, at least not if it means making waves and being put in an awkward position. They just want the power and an easy life. 

I agree. Time and again, they pass the buck to the officers or blame the "cuts" rather than actually get off their backsides and try to make a difference. I too have seen correspondence between a friend and Mary Lea and her lack of interest was stunning. Some of them are well intentioned, but under Julie Dore's uninspiring leadership, most just see it as a sinecure. 

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I do not know Julie Dore personally. I have heard from people who have met her, that she is a sincere lady who genuinely tries to do what she considered best for the city.
However, what she has never been is a true leader in the full sense of the word- with drive and charisma. At a time when Sheffield has been crying out for dynamic, determined and effective leadership, it has been sorely missing.
Regionally, Sheffield's voice is being swamped more and more by the Liverpool, Manchester, Leeds, Hull axis and nationally it is often effectively ignored. More and more we are being sidelined because we have not had an effective and powerful champion.
The HS2 debate, Channel 4 HQ, and now, critically, the NPR transport strategy are just some examples where we have been, and continue to be seen as, increasingly irrelevant.
Not all of this can be laid solely at her door of course and her predecessors were little if no better but a true leader could have done so much more to champion our cause.

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28 minutes ago, andingmen said:

I do not know Julie Dore personally. I have heard from people who have met her, that she is a sincere lady who genuinely tries to do what she considered best for the city.
However, what she has never been is a true leader in the full sense of the word- with drive and charisma. At a time when Sheffield has been crying out for dynamic, determined and effective leadership, it has been sorely missing.
Regionally, Sheffield's voice is being swamped more and more by the Liverpool, Manchester, Leeds, Hull axis and nationally it is often effectively ignored. More and more we are being sidelined because we have not had an effective and powerful champion.
The HS2 debate, Channel 4 HQ, and now, critically, the NPR transport strategy are just some examples where we have been, and continue to be seen as, increasingly irrelevant.
Not all of this can be laid solely at her door of course and her predecessors were little if no better but a true leader could have done so much more to champion our cause.

A very sensible post, thank you.

 

I agree with everything you wrote.

 

Yes, as much as I like Julie Dore as a person (in as much as  don't have any negative feelings about her personally) I do agree that Sheffield has been left behind the other Northern cities you mention, although this isn't entirely Ms Dore's fault; it's been going on for years, it not decades, even when the Lib Dems were in charge . . .  ooh that Scriven got my back up 😣

 

Sadly, I fear Ms Dore will always be remembered for the farcical reaction by the city council to the tree protestors  😢

 

I know they say no publicity is bad publicity, but that story went global . . .

 

I still fancy her though 😘

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Julie Dore "standing Down" GOOD she was absolutely useless & could not Lead a Dog, she is just like all the other politicians in Sheffield  City Council.. Hopeless.  

Edited by Pussycat12

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