Strikes On Public Transport To Be Made Illegal

[Pettytom 1]

17 minutes ago, RollingJ said:

Yes , you can. A Travelmaster ticket. Try using a Stagecoach ticket on TM or First - won't work.

 

To 'fully integrate' the system as you suggest would need just one operator - like in London - but that ain't going to happen. Unfortunately, I'm only aware of one other area in the country where 99% of the bus companies kind of co-operate to try and make life easier for the travelling public, but even there you can be caught out if you don't check the small print.

A citywide day ticket costs a fiver and allows travel on all buses and trams, regardless of operator.

 

I presume that the money from these tickets is distributed in a way that the operators find acceptable. So, it should be possible to have an integrated ticketing system.

[RollingJ 2,003]

2 minutes ago, Pettytom said:

A citywide day ticket costs a fiver and allows travel on all buses and trams, regardless of operator.

 

I presume that the money from these tickets is distributed in a way that the operators find acceptable. So, it should be possible to have an integrated ticketing system.

Your presumption is correct - all SHEFFIELD operators are covered, because they have all signed up to the voluntary 'Buses for Sheffield' initiative .

The scheme is operated by Travelmaster - a separate company -  and they recompense each operator according to whatever is agreed in that initiative. That's as far as it goes. So you have an integrated system - of sorts.

[Pettytom 1]

1 minute ago, RollingJ said:

Your presumption is correct - all SHEFFIELD operators are covered, because they have all signed up to the voluntary 'Buses for Sheffield' initiative .

The scheme is operated by Travelmaster - a separate company -  and they recompense each operator according to whatever is agreed in that initiative. That's as far as it goes. So you have an integrated system - of sorts.

Indeed.

 

The point that I’m stumbling towards is that if they can do day  tickets across operators, surely it is possible to do tap in and out services in the same way, using contactless cards. 
 

That would encourage me to use the buses more. Knowing the most I will pay on any day is a fiver would certainly get me out of my car more often.

[RollingJ 2,003]

1 minute ago, Pettytom said:

Indeed.

 

The point that I’m stumbling towards is that if they can do day  tickets across operators, surely it is possible to do tap in and out services in the same way, using contactless cards. 
 

That would encourage me to use the buses more. Knowing the most I will pay on any day is a fiver would certainly get me out of my car more often.

Slightly more complicated - that would involve a BIG investment in back-office technology for each operator, and if say First backed out of Sheffield operations and another company took over, they would have to integrate  their system, which may not be compatible.

[Bargepole23 337]

On 16/12/2019 at 11:47, *_ash_* said:

A key difference with buses, is that up north, not having a conductor means buses are slow. Major arterial routes would be much better, if they didn't stop for 10 mins at each stop while people pay with 1ps (it seems)

 

(though I'm going a little off topic there)

 

 

Yep. Buses stopping are the real reason major arterial routes are clogged with traffic. Either that or the thousands of single passenger cars....

[*_ash_* 88]

1 hour ago, Bargepole23 said:

Yep. Buses stopping are the real reason major arterial routes are clogged with traffic. Either that or the thousands of single passenger cars....

I'm not sure if I've misunderstood, or you have.

 

What I was meaning is that with conductors on arterial routes, the buses would run faster, and this would make them more appealing.

 

Earlier today in taxi, I was queueing on Glossop Road (just past Clarkhouse Junction), and since I was sat in traffic, I watched a 120, and there must have been 50 customers at the stop. I was aiming for the B Rd, which was jammed, in 15 minutes, this bus was still there checking everyone on.

 

This for me, is the failure of getting buses. In london, they stop, 10 seconds, they're off. (though they do have more doors, so wouldn't be this quick in Sheff)

 

I don't think Sheffield is ready for Oyster with different companies etc. But if main routes have conductors, the bus can stop, open doors, let everyone on, then get going.

 

Of course, not all simple, as private companies don't want to pay conductors.  How much pollution that bus sat there for 15 mins + (was still there when I got on B Rd), so perhaps instead of CAZ charge of £50 per day per bus, this could be spend on finding a compromise with standing buses?

 

 

I tried quote 2 posts but it doesn't work, but this also links and replies to into the post earlier post#20 by @geared

[RollingJ 2,003]

2 minutes ago, *_ash_* said:

I'm not sure if I've misunderstood, or you have.

 

What I was meaning is that with conductors on arterial routes, the buses would run faster, and this would make them more appealing.

 

Earlier today in taxi, I was queueing on Glossop Road (just past Clarkhouse Junction), and since I was sat in traffic, I watched a 120, and there must have been 50 customers at the stop. I was aiming for the B Rd, which was jammed, in 15 minutes, this bus was still there checking everyone on.

 

This for me, is the failure of getting buses. In london, they stop, 10 seconds, they're off. (though they do have more doors, so wouldn't be this quick in Sheff)

 

I don't think Sheffield is ready for Oyster with different companies etc. But if main routes have conductors, the bus can stop, open doors, let everyone on, then get going.

 

Of course, not all simple, as private companies don't want to pay conductors.  How much pollution that bus sat there for 15 mins + (was still there when I got on B Rd), so perhaps instead of CAZ charge of £50 per day per bus, this could be spend on finding a compromise with standing buses?

 

 

I tried quote 2 posts but it doesn't work, but this also links and replies to into the post earlier post#20 by @geared

I'll probably get slated for saying this, but it's not the bus company's fault - its the passengers who are not ready - only trying to find purses/passes/cards when they get to the front of the driver, even if they've been stood at the stop for 10 minutes, and then, from my experience, blocking the first bay so no-one else can get on the bus. This doesn't happen in London because there, they have the card ready, tap on and move down the bus.

 

Yes, London buses are dual-door, because the Oyster system is tap-on/tap-off, and a single entry/exit is not compatible with that - although it works fairly well in my second home city (Brighton).

 

AFAIK, London buses are one-man operated, so why we should need conductors here is beyond me - as above, the passengers need educating in the use of common sense.

[*_ash_* 88]

7 minutes ago, RollingJ said:

I'll probably get slated for saying this, but it's not the bus company's fault - its the passengers who are not ready - only trying to find purses/passes/cards when they get to the front of the driver, even if they've been stood at the stop for 10 minutes, and then, from my experience, blocking the first bay so no-one else can get on the bus. This doesn't happen in London because there, they have the card ready, tap on and move down the bus.

 

Yes, London buses are dual-door, because the Oyster system is tap-on/tap-off, and a single entry/exit is not compatible with that - although it works fairly well in my second home city (Brighton).

 

AFAIK, London buses are one-man operated, so why we should need conductors here is beyond me - as above, the passengers need educating in the use of common sense.

When since picking up always involves people, then you can't educate everyone. And picking up is always going to be faster than dropping off.. same in my trade. Speeding up the pick up process speeds things up a lot.

 

I'm not talking about every route btw. Most buses are empty at night when I'm around. I'm talking major routes. Like Ecclesall/Abbeydale/Glossop rd Barnsley rd attercliffe. 52, etc.  At peak times. Get the things moving.

Edited December 17, 2019 by *_ash_*

[RollingJ 2,003]

9 hours ago, *_ash_* said:

When since picking up always involves people, then you can't educate everyone. And picking up is always going to be faster than dropping off.. same in my trade. Speeding up the pick up process speeds things up a lot.

 

I'm not talking about every route btw. Most buses are empty at night when I'm around. I'm talking major routes. Like Ecclesall/Abbeydale/Glossop rd Barnsley rd attercliffe. 52, etc.  At peak times. Get the things moving.

I accept you can't educate everyone, but I just can't believe how many apparently uneducated people there are out there - surely it is common sense to have cards/cash/passes ready and common  courtesy to move out of the way of those boarding after you, or are Sheffield people really that stupid? As I said, I use public transport in many areas of the UK, and this, to me, selfish attitude, is almost unique to Sheffield - I don't even experience it to the same degree in Rotherham/Doncaster.

 

The routes you mention above all have pinch points - and inconsiderate drivers - on the Abbeydale corridor, which is my 'personal' route, I see many instances of people ignoring bus lanes, blocking junctions and parking on corners or tight bends, making it difficult to manouvre 33ft. buses around.

[Bargepole23 337]

10 hours ago, *_ash_* said:

I'm not sure if I've misunderstood, or you have.

 

What I was meaning is that with conductors on arterial routes, the buses would run faster, and this would make them more appealing.

 

Earlier today in taxi, I was queueing on Glossop Road (just past Clarkhouse Junction), and since I was sat in traffic, I watched a 120, and there must have been 50 customers at the stop. I was aiming for the B Rd, which was jammed, in 15 minutes, this bus was still there checking everyone on.

 

This for me, is the failure of getting buses. In london, they stop, 10 seconds, they're off. (though they do have more doors, so wouldn't be this quick in Sheff)

 

I don't think Sheffield is ready for Oyster with different companies etc. But if main routes have conductors, the bus can stop, open doors, let everyone on, then get going.

 

Of course, not all simple, as private companies don't want to pay conductors.  How much pollution that bus sat there for 15 mins + (was still there when I got on B Rd), so perhaps instead of CAZ charge of £50 per day per bus, this could be spend on finding a compromise with standing buses?

 

 

I tried quote 2 posts but it doesn't work, but this also links and replies to into the post earlier post#20 by @geared

Fair enough.

 

Cashless or no change buses would be preferable to a conductor IMO.

 

Shifting and crushing cars parked in bus lanes, yep. My usual route up Ecclesall Road home from work would benefit there.

 

Maybe shifting and crushing anyone getting on the bus and not moving down, yep. Along with anyone blocking the way off chatting with the driver, they always get an impolite shove as I squeeze past. 

[RollingJ 2,003]

13 minutes ago, Bargepole23 said:

Fair enough.

 

Cashless or no change buses would be preferable to a conductor IMO.

 

Shifting and crushing cars parked in bus lanes, yep. My usual route up Ecclesall Road home from work would benefit there.

 

Maybe shifting and crushing anyone getting on the bus and not moving down, yep. Along with anyone blocking the way off chatting with the driver, they always get an impolite shove as I squeeze past. 

It's not so much chatting with the driver, that in my experience happens extremely rarely, more the numbskulls who stand just behind the 'No standing passengers forward of this point' notice - especially at busy times. I have been known to ask people to move down the bus if they are stood there, and find it amazing that (a) they stand there in the first place, and especially when there are empty seats on the bus, and (b) that they can't (or won't) see the problems they are causing.

Edited December 18, 2019 by RollingJ
Grammatical errors.

[Lex Luthor 10]

22 hours ago, alchresearch said:

 

 

Plus lets not forget this death - caused BY a guard.  

 

Georgia Varley train fall death: Christopher McGee jailed

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-20339630

Interesting summary by the judge.  Pity that the judge in the Duckenfield trial chose to ignore that he had a 'duty of care' also.  At the very least he was also criminally negligent then?