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Consequences Of Brexit [Part 8] Read First Post Before Posting

Vaati

Mod Note: As we are getting rather tired of seeing reports about this. The use of the word Remoaners  is to cease. Either posts like adults, or don't post at all. The mod warnings have been clear.

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mort

In addition to remoaner we are also not going to allow the use of libdums or liebore - if you cannot behave like adults and post without recourse to these childish insults then please refrain from posting. If you have a problem with this then you all know where the helpdesk is. 

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1 hour ago, tinfoilhat said:

 

 

Sure, we could make a success out of brexit on paper but Ive no idea how. 

toilet rolls?

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5 hours ago, Lockdoctor said:

You need to calm down  and read comments more carefully.  I haven't labelled any posters personally.  If I was a snowflake I would take offence at your personal comments directed at me.

 

The 17.4 million who voted to leave didn't tell any lies and don't deserve to be cheated out of their democratic wish.  Politicians from both sides of the arguments are equally guilty of being economical with the truth both before and after the democratic 2016 EU Referendum vote.

Personal comments can't be directed at anyone else can they? You are being tautological.

 

MPs have lied before and will lie after - it is in their nature - remember Nick Clegg? There is no legal recourse.

 

What was their wish? After all were they voting for a hard brexit, or a soft brexit or a customs union one or a Norway one, or a Marmite one or what?

The problem with leave is that they didn't say what they were voting for - now there is a chance to revisit that with the democratically requested second referendum with clear meaning about what you are voting for.

 

Anything else would go against the democratic choice of the people to change their minds (as David Davis said).

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8 minutes ago, Litotes said:

Personal comments can't be directed at anyone else can they? You are being tautological.

 

MPs have lied before and will lie after - it is in their nature - remember Nick Clegg? There is no legal recourse.

 

What was their wish? After all were they voting for a hard brexit, or a soft brexit or a customs union one or a Norway one, or a Marmite one or what?

The problem with leave is that they didn't say what they were voting for - now there is a chance to revisit that with the democratically requested second referendum with clear meaning about what you are voting for.

 

Anything else would go against the democratic choice of the people to change their minds (as David Davis said).

Good post.. I honestly can't see why people are against a second Ref.

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5 hours ago, Lockdoctor said:

You need to calm down  and read comments more carefully.  I haven't labelled any posters personally.  If I was a snowflake I would take offence at your personal comments directed at me.

 

The 17.4 million who voted to leave didn't tell any lies and don't deserve to be cheated out of their democratic wish.  Politicians from both sides of the arguments are equally guilty of being economical with the truth both before and after the democratic 2016 EU Referendum vote.

It is very telling that you think this is acceptable. Isn't it odd that the Swiss had a very similar situation of their own and their courts voided the result. Whereas people like you think differently. You think lying is acceptable and ethical do you? Says a lot about your character. 

 

 

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8 minutes ago, Albert the Cat said:

It is very telling that you think this is acceptable. Isn't it odd that the Swiss had a very similar situation of their own and their courts voided the result. Whereas people like you think differently. You think lying is acceptable and ethical do you? Says a lot about your character. 

 

 

exactly, and surely if lies and mistruths are involved  its far from a democratic referendum, people need to know honest facts about what WILL and what COULD happen.

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45 minutes ago, Litotes said:

Personal comments can't be directed at anyone else can they? You are being tautological.

 

MPs have lied before and will lie after - it is in their nature - remember Nick Clegg? There is no legal recourse.

 

What was their wish? After all were they voting for a hard brexit, or a soft brexit or a customs union one or a Norway one, or a Marmite one or what?

The problem with leave is that they didn't say what they were voting for - now there is a chance to revisit that with the democratically requested second referendum with clear meaning about what you are voting for.

 

Anything else would go against the democratic choice of the people to change their minds (as David Davis said).

Making general comments about a group is not the same as making  personal  comments directed towards a named individual.  How many times have Leave voters been labelled xenophobic and racist on all the eight Brexit threads?

 

It's not fair to imply Nick Clegg lied.   The Lib Dems didn't win the 2010 General Election which meant they couldn't deliver all their manifesto pledges in their role as the very junior partner in a coalition Government.  If hung parliaments become a regular event then it will be normal for pledges in manifestos to be traded to form coalition Governments.

 

Remaining in the customs union and single market will make a mockery of the democratic 2016 EU Referendum result.   There can be no justification for having another EU referendum before the result of the 2016 EU referendum result has been implemented.  And to have another EU Referendum with remain on the ballot paper will kill democracy in this country.

 

David Cameron who was the Prime Minister made it clear our country wouldn't have a chance to change it's mind if the democratic people voted to leave.  You sound like a broken record by continually mentioning David Davis.

 

34 minutes ago, Albert the Cat said:

It is very telling that you think this is acceptable. Isn't it odd that the Swiss had a very similar situation of their own and their courts voided the result. Whereas people like you think differently. You think lying is acceptable and ethical do you? Says a lot about your character. 

 

 

I haven't said I support lying by politicians.  You're kidding yourself if you think the remain campaign was totally honest and the leave campaign were totally dishonest.   We are all grown ups and should be capable of choosing which way to vote by trusting our own judgement.  

Edited by Lockdoctor

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1 hour ago, Litotes said:

MPs have lied before and will lie after - it is in their nature - remember Nick Clegg? There is no legal recourse.

 

What was their wish? After all were they voting for a hard brexit, or a soft brexit or a customs union one or a Norway one, or a Marmite one or what?

The problem with leave is that they didn't say what they were voting for - now there is a chance to revisit that with the democratically requested second referendum with clear meaning about what you are voting for.

 

Anything else would go against the democratic choice of the people to change their minds (as David Davis said).

Once again I need to remind you that the people do not get a democratic choice. Parliament are the ones that may grant that wish despite you keeping harping on about what Davis said as he does not speak for parliament either.

Edited by apelike

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55 minutes ago, melthebell said:

exactly, and surely if lies and mistruths are involved  its far from a democratic referendum, people need to know honest facts about what WILL and what COULD happen.

People knew exactly would could happen before the referendum. They were constantly being warned by EU supporters. Didn't you get the propaganda from Project Fear? Every household in the UK received a leaflet spelling out exactly why we must Remain and what would happen if we left. Rich Tories gave news conference after news conference warning about 850,000 job losses, doom and gloom and the sky falling in if we just voted to Leave, never mind actually Leaving...

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6 minutes ago, Car Boot said:

People knew exactly would could happen before the referendum. They were constantly being warned by EU supporters. Didn't you get the propaganda from Project Fear? Every household in the UK received a leaflet spelling out exactly why we must Remain and what would happen if we left. Rich Tories gave news conference after news conference warning about 850,000 job losses, doom and gloom and the sky falling in if we just voted to Leave, never mind actually Leaving...

"Rich tories" - you mean the tories that are telling us we should accept Brexit?

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2 hours ago, Padders said:

Nationalism is on the rise in Germany again TF, I'm sure they will be keeping a close eye on events here.

Success here will only further their cause.

Yes and Nationalism is also on the rise in other EU countries. 

But Germany had a national collective guilt problem for many years after the war, and still does to a lesser extent. That's one of the reasons why the EU and what it stands for means so much to the majority of them. 

 

I'm glad leaving the EU has been made difficult for us, we should never forget the  main reason why the EU was formed and peace in Europe must always continue. 

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Why not? It would not be democratic  to force people to accept something they don't now want now they know what it means.

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1 minute ago, Litotes said:

Why not? It would not be democratic  to force people to accept something they don't now want now they know what it means.

But that is not the case and its those that want to remain who are making that out. I think the vast majority that voted leave are happy with their decision. It is within parliaments remit to revoke A50 or have another referendum but because of the mess they have made of this one I doubt they will.

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