Consequences Of Brexit [Part 8] Read First Post Before Posting

[Ontarian1981 10]

 

 Did this inspire the Brexit referendum? 

 

[tzijlstra 11]

6 hours ago, apelike said:

 

The turmoil is being caused by the remainers as they simply wont accept the outcome of a legal, democratically held referendum.

The turmoil is caused by the fact that nobody defined what/how/when Brexit was. 
 

3 years on and we still don’t know. Why? Because we are in uncharted territory- rewriting or, in the case of the UK, reworking the entire constitution with no clear mandatory understanding of what or how or indeed when.

[Longcol 597]

19 minutes ago, tzijlstra said:

The turmoil is caused by the fact that nobody defined what/how/when Brexit was. 
 

3 years on and we still don’t know. Why? Because we are in uncharted territory- rewriting or, in the case of the UK, reworking the entire constitution with no clear mandatory understanding of what or how or indeed when.

Even if we'd left the day after the referendum we'd still be in the middle of negotiating a myriad of deals with the EU, whether that be trade, exchange of intelligence etc.

 

The "deal" we've been looking to negotiate thus far has only been an interim "holding position" before the hard work begins,

[Pettytom 1]

7 hours ago, apelike said:

 

 

The turmoil is being caused by the remainers as they simply wont accept the outcome of a legal, democratically held referendum.

How does that work then?

 

Explain to me how a minority (if that is what it is) can frustrate the majority, in a democracy.

 

If anything, it is the leavers causing the problems. They are the ones ignoring the  fact that the country is split They are the ones voting against leaving in parliament.

 

Blame the ERG for our continued EU membership. Blame the confrontational attitude of he hard Brexiters. 

[Lockdoctor 10]

8 hours ago, Pettytom said:

But, the minority might actually be a majority.

 

That’s the problem. A problem specific to the anti-democratic idea of binary referenda.

 

Until the leavers respect that, we will be in turmoil 

It's shameful to try and put the blame on  leave voters because they were the winners of the democratic 2016 EU referendum vote.

 

The majority who voted chose the leave option out of the binary choice.

 

How can a binary choice on a ballot paper be anti-democratic?

 

The turmoil has been caused by remain voters who don't respect the democratic binary choice, who also have no respect for their own people's wishes that made the other binary choice on the ballot paper. Until our country leaves the EU the turmoil will continue. 

 

 

Edited September 29, 2019 by Lockdoctor

[Longcol 597]

11 minutes ago, Pettytom said:

Blame the ERG for our continued EU membership. Blame the confrontational attitude of he hard Brexiters. 

Yes - the people pushing us down the "no deal" route are the financiers / speculators/  gamblers who stand to profit from a chaotic no deal.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/sep/28/philip-hammond-radical-tory-advisers-want-no-deal-brexit

 

Hammond wrote: “Boris Johnson asserts, ever more boldly, that we will leave the EU with or without a deal. But as his sister has reminded us, he is backed by speculators who have bet billions on a hard Brexit – and there is only one outcome that works for them: a crash-out no-deal Brexit that sends the currency tumbling and inflation soaring.”

Just now, Lockdoctor said:

The turmoil has been caused by remain voters who don't respect the democratic binary choice, who also have no respect for their own people's wishes that made the other binary choice on the ballot paper. Until our country leaves the EU the turmoil will continue. 

 

 

The turmoil will have only just started if we leave with no deal on the 31 October - we haven't prepared anything hardly - trade deals, checks on cross channel traffic etc.

[Pettytom 1]

46 minutes ago, Lockdoctor said:

It's shameful to try and put the blame on  leave voters because they were the winners of the democratic 2016 EU referendum vote.

 

The majority who voted chose the leave option out of the binary choice.

 

How can a binary choice on a ballot paper be anti-democratic?

 

The turmoil has been caused by remain voters who don't respect the democratic binary choice, who also have no respect for their own people's wishes that made the other binary choice on the ballot paper. Until our country leaves the EU the turmoil will continue. 

 

 

The turmoil is being caused because of hard line leavers.

 

That’s all.

 

Parliament represents the fragmented nature of the UK electorate. Deal with it

 

Referenda are intrinsically anti-democratic, by the way. If you haven’t grasped that yet, maybe you need to sit down and have a bit of a harder think.

Edited September 29, 2019 by Pettytom

[Albert the Cat 0]

1 hour ago, Lockdoctor said:

It's shameful to try and put the blame on  leave voters because they were the winners of the democratic 2016 EU referendum vote.

 

The majority who voted chose the leave option out of the binary choice.

 

How can a binary choice on a ballot paper be anti-democratic?

 

The turmoil has been caused by remain voters who don't respect the democratic binary choice, who also have no respect for their own people's wishes that made the other binary choice on the ballot paper. Until our country leaves the EU the turmoil will continue. 

 

 

We just need the older demographic to hurry up and move on. 
 

Any democratic exercise held now or later will unwind this tragic mistake. In case you haven’t noticed, the longer it takes for us to have another referendum or GE,  the more likely remain will win.
 

It is ironic that Leave supporters are trying their hardest to hold on to what they have and they simply do not have the parliamentary arithmetic to enact what they want. 

 

Why do you think we haven’t held another referendum yet? We are waiting for the numbers. 

[Lockdoctor 10]

58 minutes ago, Albert the Cat said:

We just need the older demographic to hurry up and move on. 
 

Any democratic exercise held now or later will unwind this tragic mistake. In case you haven’t noticed, the longer it takes for us to have another referendum or GE,  the more likely remain will win.
 

It is ironic that Leave supporters are trying their hardest to hold on to what they have and they simply do not have the parliamentary arithmetic to enact what they want. 

 

Why do you think we haven’t held another referendum yet? We are waiting for the numbers. 

There hasn't been another referendum yet because both the Tory Party and the Labour Party stated in their 2017 General Election manifestos that they would implement the democratic 2016 EU referendum result.

 

In my opinion, it's not nice to wish the older demographic to hurry up and move on. 

Edited September 29, 2019 by Lockdoctor

[Top Cats Hat 10]

5 minutes ago, Lockdoctor said:

In my opinion, it's not nice to wish the older demographic to hurry up and move on. 

In my opinion it is not nice to wish the younger demographic to go without a future so that a handful of rich businessmen can get even richer.

[Lockdoctor 10]

45 minutes ago, Top Cats Hat said:

In my opinion it is not nice to wish the younger demographic to go without a future so that a handful of rich businessmen can get even richer.

That's rather a bias view.  The younger demographic should count their lucky stars they live in such a rich country as the UK regardless of whether the democratic EU referendum result is implemented.

[ECCOnoob 1,020]

1 hour ago, Top Cats Hat said:

In my opinion it is not nice to wish the younger demographic to go without a future so that a handful of rich businessmen can get even richer.

If we're going to play the game of throwing around stupid stereotypes and wildly inaccurate broad brush approach to things let's just say this shall we...

 

Perhaps a younger generation should have got off their backsides and gone and voted on the day rather than sitting back just presuming that they will win the referendum.

 

They didn't.  The morning after was a massive jolt to remainers and that includes me.

 

Are you so daft that you honestly think that the 51% doesnt include any of the "young".     Just look around some of the northern areas of the UK.  Look around some of these crowds for the the brexit supporting parties.   Yes of course there is a heavy lean towards the older generation but there are still plenty of young faces in the crowd.  

 

The same can be applied to the remainer parties.  The way you are talking you are making it out  there is nobody over 50 who supports remain. 

 

It's ridiculous and quite frankly very offensive.

 

....Hurry up and die so I can change circumstances and get the result I personally want from a democratically conducted vote....

 

Go and say that out on the streets and see how far you get.

 

Edited September 29, 2019 by ECCOnoob