Consequences Of Brexit [Part 8] Read First Post Before Posting

[hobinfoot 25]

Guy Verhofstadt called for the EU to become an empire. He quoted the US China India & Russia has being empires they are not they are countries. An EU empire would leave the countries in the EU has no more than county councils with about the same influence. All the power would lie with Brussels and it’s emporer.

[L00b 441]

31 minutes ago, hobinfoot said:

Guy Verhofstadt called for the EU to become an empire. He quoted the US China India & Russia has being empires they are not they are countries. An EU empire would leave the countries in the EU has no more than county councils with about the same influence. All the power would lie with Brussels and it’s emporer.

So what would be the difference, with Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland relative to London and Johnson right now, then?

 

'thought as much 😏

 

Jibe aside, I think you'll find, if you think about it rationally for a minute (a whole one), that there are as many chances of the EU becoming a federation (never mind an 'empire') in our lifetimes, as the sun rising in the west: at least 10 member states, each with a full and independent veto at the EU about such a development, require approval of such a sovereignty-impacting course of action through popular referendum. Same situation with the fabled 'EU army', by the way.

 

Don't be taken in by the rethoric. From either side.

Edited September 18, 2019 by L00b

[apelike 10]

4 hours ago, L00b said:

But your one-liner conveniently overlooks the opposite problem, that too many Leavers are unafraid of the changes brought about by any form of Brexit, ....

But you also conveniently overlook why those that voted for change should be afraid of it when it was the very thing they voted for. They knew it would change so it make no sense to be afraid of it.

 

 

[apelike 10]

1 hour ago, altus said:

...This puts them ahead of those brexiters who are not even aware of the changes that brexit would bring.

The only people that state that brexiters should be afraid or are unaware of the changes are the remainers, some of which have already bolted from this country for fear they would lose out. I just wonder how many of them actually voted in the referendum.

[hobinfoot 25]

11 minutes ago, L00b said:

So what would be the difference, with Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland relative to London and Johnson right now, then?

 

'thought as much 😏

 

Jibe aside, I think you'll find, if you think about it rationally for a minute (a whole one), that there are as many chances of the EU becoming a federation (never mind an 'empire') in our lifetimes, as the sun rising in the west: at least 10 member states, each with a full and independent veto at the EU about such a development, require approval of such a sovereignty-impacting course of action through popular referendum. Same situation with the fabled 'EU army', by the way.

 

Don't be taken in by the rethoric. From either side.

Scotland N Ireland Wales Are not just ruled from London. And I agree with you that the chance of the EU becoming an federation in the short to medium term is not going to happen. But I do believe the EUs ultimate goal is for a federal Europe.

[Top Cats Hat 10]

8 minutes ago, apelike said:

But you also conveniently overlook why those that voted for change should be afraid of it when it was the very thing they voted for. 

Of course it wasn’t.

 

If you speak to most Leavers it is change that they were voting against. Anybody who wants to go back decades to a different time, clearly can’t cope with change. Brexiteers are sentimental for a past which probably didn’t exist. Remainers look forward to a future where petty nationalist sentimentality is replaced with a role where tribal barriers are broken down.

[L00b 441]

6 minutes ago, apelike said:

But you also conveniently overlook why those that voted for change should be afraid of it when it was the very thing they voted for. They knew it would change so it make no sense to be afraid of it.

Hardly.

 

I'm not mistaking the recklessness demonstrated by those voting to change for the sake of changing alone, out of ignorance or desperation regardless, for the calculated design demonstrated by those who voted to Leave with a plan to profit personally in their respective contexts.

[apelike 10]

10 minutes ago, L00b said:

Hardly.

 

I'm not mistaking the recklessness demonstrated by those voting to change for the sake of changing alone, out of ignorance or desperation regardless, for the calculated design demonstrated by those who voted to Leave with a plan to profit personally in their respective contexts.

Just what percentage of those that voted leave had a plan to make a profit from it? We keep being reminded that most of those who voted leave were the less well-off poorly educated so how would they profit. I think it is fair to say that some voted because of that reason just like it is fair to say some were also xenophobic but for most it does not apply.

[L00b 441]

42 minutes ago, apelike said:

The only people that state that brexiters should be afraid or are unaware of the changes are the remainers, some of which have already bolted from this country for fear they would lose out. I just wonder how many of them actually voted in the referendum.

That seems directed at me.

 

As a non-British resident at the time, I did not have any right to vote in the referendum, nor in GEs begore or since.

 

I 'bolted' from your country as an early mitigation strategy to the expected consequences of the political handling of that referendum's result. Your governments have inflicted those consequences on my multi-national family and me, not the other way round. So I didn't get mad, I got even.

 

In both personal and professional terms, the last year and half has confirmed everything that I had anticipated since before the referendum. You can find points in my posts from 2015 and 2016, replicated verbatim in UK and EU Brexit preparations notices of 2019.

 

I state that many Brexiters should be afraid, or are unaware, of the changes to come out of Brexit (any version of Brexit), exactly like I have been since before the referendum, because by the evidence of posts in here and on other forums, articles and comments in media, and voxpop pieces in the TV news and debates like QT for those past 3 years still, it's crystal clear that many Brexiters understand as much about the UK's EU membership and its significance to everyday life in the UK for the past couple of decades and longer, as gerbils understand A-Level physics indeed.

 

But don't mind me, just carry on with the unicorn-and-sunlit-uplands retirement plan lads.

Edited September 18, 2019 by L00b

[apelike 10]

18 minutes ago, Top Cats Hat said:

Remainers look forward to a future where petty nationalist sentimentality is replaced with a role where tribal barriers are broken down.

Are you sure about that. Nationalism in Europe is on the increase and the tribal barriers are still strong.

[L00b 441]

14 minutes ago, apelike said:

Just what percentage of those that voted leave had a plan to make a profit from it? We keep being reminded that most of those who voted leave were the less well-off poorly educated so how would they profit. I think it is fair to say that some voted because of that reason just like it is fair to say some were also xenophobic but for most it does not apply.

You'll have to ask the voting corpus. I can name a few names, though, to save you some time: Jacob Rees-Mogg, Nigel Farage, Priti Patel, the ERG contingent, Crispin Odey, ...

 

Or you could try to explain to me why it was rational to vote Leave for the sake of change alone (since all of the Leave promises were known lies) and/or why it is still rational to pursue Brexit now (since all of the Leave promises have now been proven to be lies)?

 

What's in Brexit, as the better-known quantity that it is now, for all these less well-off poorly educated voters?

 

What's in Brexit for you personally?

Edited September 18, 2019 by L00b

[Pettytom 1]

45 minutes ago, apelike said:

But you also conveniently overlook why those that voted for change should be afraid of it when it was the very thing they voted for. They knew it would change so it make no sense to be afraid of it.

 

 

So, what changes are you hoping for?

 

We know about the big platitudinous ones, that won’t happen anyway. So could you be specific instead . Give us some examples of how our society  might improve as a result of Brexit.