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Shechita & Halal. Identifiable On All Meat & Meat Products Yes/No.

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15 hours ago, melthebell said:

Technically in this debate, it's about animals being killed for meat.

dairy etc is a whole other kettle of fish

I was quoting someone who said vegetarianism is cruelty free in their response to the original subject of the thread. I wasn't commenting on the fact their comment had strayed a little from the subject of the thread. 

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10 minutes ago, Chez2 said:

I was quoting someone who said vegetarianism is cruelty free in their response to the original subject of the thread. I wasn't commenting on the fact their comment had strayed a little from the subject of the thread. 

I know, i was just stating in the context of this thread...it is cruelty free, but then if we want to go deeper obviously there is cruelty involved further down the line. The arguement about halal is completely inane if you still eat meat. Its cruel, barbaric in any form of "humane" killing, animals are still sentinent, feel pain, fear pain, smell fear.

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2 minutes ago, melthebell said:

I know, i was just stating in the context of this thread...it is cruelty free, but then if we want to go deeper obviously there is cruelty involved further down the line. The arguement about halal is completely inane if you still eat meat. Its cruel, barbaric in any form of "humane" killing, animals are still sentinent, feel pain, fear pain, smell fear.

It is not though. I'm not going to defend "humane" killing but clearly there are different levels of cruelty involved in killing animals. We're still reliant on  meat consumption and we should aim for the least cruel ways to provide it. Which halal or shechita are not.

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21 hours ago, makapaka said:

What would the labels say on non Halal products?

 

Electrocuted in the head and throat chainsawed?

Get a grip, this is an adult conversation. First reply and this is your best contribution, I despair. On "non Halal and Shechita slaughtered meats" what about, "animal stunned and rendered unconscious before been dispatched."

 

Angel1  

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53 minutes ago, Branyy said:

We're still reliant on  meat consumption 

no we arent, i havent eaten it for over 30 years, people who follow traditions are reliant on meat consumption as its the "norm", that includes a lot of "religious" people

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, melthebell said:

no we arent, i havent eaten it for over 30 years, people who follow traditions are reliant on meat consumption as its the "norm", that includes a lot of "religious" people

Maybe you as an individual are not, but you certainly can't supply world's demand for food by vegetable production only.

Edited by Branyy

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Just now, Branyy said:

Maybe you as an individual are not, but you certainly can't supply world's demand for food by vegetable production only.

most of the worlds grain is fed to animals for meat, guess how much volume of grain used compared to how much meat you get at the end, yup you end up with less food ;)

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7 minutes ago, melthebell said:

most of the worlds grain is fed to animals for meat, guess how much volume of grain used compared to how much meat you get at the end, yup you end up with less food ;)

Right, I think you're wasting your potential here. You should go to Africa, take all goats from some poor family and teach them how to make nice grass vegan pie.

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1 hour ago, Branyy said:

It is not though. I'm not going to defend "humane" killing but clearly there are different levels of cruelty involved in killing animals. We're still reliant on  meat consumption and we should aim for the least cruel ways to provide it. Which halal or shechita are not.

What qualifies you to determine what is cruel or not when targetting shechita/halal.

I also find it incredulous that some on here are 'concerned' about the last few mins of an animals life, but not how that animal has been kept- usually in appalling conditions at factory farms.

 

In Islam, the animal's welfare is extremely important- read up on it instead of just ranting about methods of slaughter.

 

Even your favourite yummy pork- pigs, are raised in barren crates or pens at industrial-scale facilities without fresh air or sunlight. They live on hard, slatted floors that do not accommodate their natural urge to root!

 

But you don't make a fuss about that..

 

Joe Regenstein, professor of food science at Cornell University who leads the university’s Kosher and Halal Food Initiative says this:

 

Quote

“Many of those attacking religious slaughter have no clue as to what is happening.

  It is more of an Islamophobic issue, not an animal well-being issue.” Compared to modern, secular methods of slaughter, , “the traditional or Prophetic method might actually be equal or possibly superior” because the initial pain of the throat cut results “in the animal releasing large quantities of endorphins, putting it in a state of euphoria and numbness”. The cut thus serves as its own stun. The scientific evidence against halal slaughter, Regenstein says, “is extremely weak and has often been done poorly with an agenda driving a desired outcome”.

 

 

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13 hours ago, Mister Gee said:

I await a response from our resident Elmer J. Fudd?

Fudd here, hope you have not had to wait too long.

 

Here is a choice for you to make IF YOU ARE A MEAT EATER.

 

A

Animal taken from farm to slaughterhouse.

1) Animal is ushered into slaughterhouse, where no doubt it senses death.

2) Kept in a holding pen, until its time has come, no doubt it smells death.

3) Animal is prodded into killing clamp. Now it knows death is near.

4) Clamp turns upside down while some "holy man" is babbling religious verses.

5) "Holy man"  severs the carotid artery, jugular vein and windpipe . Animal knows it is near death.

6) Animal bleeds to death, eventually.

 

B

1) Angel1 stalks up to feeding deer/rabbit.

2) Angel1 knows his craft and takes the shot without the animal been aware of his presence.

3) Animal falls to shot, death is near enough instantanious.

4) Angel1 grallochs deer or paunches the rabbit.

5) Angel1 puts deer and rabbit in his freezer on his return home.

 

Here is your choice, which animal has had the "best" death possible, A or B.

 

That's why I have no need to apologise for my lifelong hobby, if you will.

 

Angel1.

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4 minutes ago, Mr Fisk said:

What qualifies you to determine what is cruel or not when targetting shechita/halal.

Good question. I accept RSPCA guidelines.

7 minutes ago, Mr Fisk said:

In Islam, the animal's welfare is extremely important- read up on it instead of just ranting about methods of slaughter.

Maybe they do, but not enough. Stunning is not mandatory prior the slaughter.

 

8 minutes ago, Mr Fisk said:

Even your favourite yummy pork- pigs, are raised in barren crates or pens at industrial-scale facilities without fresh air or sunlight. They live on hard, slatted floors that do not accommodate their natural urge to root!

 

But you don't make a fuss about that..

I am concerned, I care about that, I act accordingly and even make a fuss when about that 😊

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15 minutes ago, Mr Fisk said:

Even your favourite yummy pork- pigs, are raised in barren crates or pens at industrial-scale facilities without fresh air or sunlight. They live on hard, slatted floors that do not accommodate their natural urge to root!

 

There is such a thing as free range pork.  Many decent suppliers are keen to promote and label this.

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