Freedom of religion - no

[Voice of reason 0]

1 minute ago, Top Cats Hat said:

Really?

 

Many people find that kind of behaviour really creepy especially when they are feeling vulnerable. There are chaplins in most large hospitals if patients want that kind of support, and importantly the patient will ask for it, not have it imposed on them.

Yes, really. If she did it in the right way, I don't think there is any harm in it at all. But she didn't.

[Top Cats Hat 10]

2 minutes ago, Voice of reason said:

Yes, really. If she did it in the right way, I don't think there is any harm in it at all. But she didn't.

She is there as a nurse to provide medical care to the patient, not to impose her own religious views on her patients.

[Voice of reason 0]

4 minutes ago, Top Cats Hat said:

She is there as a nurse to provide medical care to the patient, not to impose her own religious views on her patients.

She is there to support patients in many ways. The problem was she was too imposing, hence the problem. Offering non-medical help in a sympathetic sensible way isn't imposing something. She failed to strike anything like a sensible level.

[Top Cats Hat 10]

1 hour ago, Voice of reason said:

She is there to support patients in many ways. 

No she is not. She is there to support their clinical and medical needs.

[Voice of reason 0]

1 hour ago, Top Cats Hat said:

No she is not. She is there to support their clinical and medical needs.

NHS will be employing more robots then presumably??

Or maybe they want caring and compassionate people:

https://www.healthcareers.nhs.uk/leading change%2C adding value

[catmiss 12]

I worked in the Health Service amongst staff and patients of various religious beliefs. This nurse will have gone through disciplinary process before being dismissed. Seems as though she was abusing her position by enforcing her religious belief on those vulnerable patients 

[Top Cats Hat 10]

9 hours ago, Voice of reason said:

Or maybe they want caring and compassionate people:

Caring and compassionate people don’t force their own opinions on other people! 🙄

[Cyclone 10]

On 22/05/2019 at 07:35, Waldo said:

Post 17 seems to be their first post in this thread, and it's in no way racist, it makes no reference to or hints at any particular race.

 

I agree with the point in fact, people should not be taking time out while on duty to satisfy any religious obligations. If they feel strongly about their religious obligations, that they feel a need to oray or whatever at times when they're on duty, then they should resign; they're then free to indulge their religious fervour to their heart's content on their own time. That applies obviously to all religions.

I suppose that smokers who feel the need to take several breaks to smoke during the day should also resign.

On 22/05/2019 at 08:24, Waldo said:

If it has no impact, why not give all medical staff an hour off each week? I'm sure our over-worked NHS staff would all appreciate that, and as (as you claim) it will have no impact, why not?

Are you for some reason assuming that they don't actually work for the contracted number of hours?

On 22/05/2019 at 08:34, JamesR123 said:

Well you have used the right word, bigotry.  Racism and bigotry are separate things.

 

Most people are bigots.  Hate fascists?  Welcome to the bigot club.  Despise white supremacists?  Hello Mr. Bigot.

 

If you think all bigotry is the same, I guess you think hating racists is the same as hating Muslims?  

A ridiculous set of assertions, this is an attempt by the far right to claim that any criticism of them is an example of intolerance itself and so those who aren't with them are hypocrites.

On 22/05/2019 at 14:18, Top Cats Hat said:

No. 

 

The requirement to pray is five times a day three of which are before sunrise and after sunset so the most they would pray during the working day would be twice, one of which is at midday when most people are at lunch, so I'm not sure what these 'numerous' quiet times were.

 

During Ramadan extra nightly prayers are encouraged but not obligatory.

To be fair, the NHS doesn't stop at lunch, nor does it stop at sunset or sunrise, patients need care 24/7, not just during 'the working day'.

[Cyclone 10]

6 hours ago, Top Cats Hat said:

Caring and compassionate people don’t force their own opinions on other people! 🙄

I think that's his point.  She would be okay offering religious support, but if that's rejected then she's not okay to keep pushing it.  She clearly went well beyond what is acceptable and more than once.

Nobody apart from Mac seems to think that it was wrong to sack her.

[JamesR123 0]

41 minutes ago, Cyclone said:

 

A ridiculous set of assertions, this is an attempt by the far right to claim that any criticism of them is an example of intolerance itself and so those who aren't with them are hypocrites.

No it isnt.  It is simply me pointing out what the word bigotry means.

Do you contest the meaning?

[Voice of reason 0]

41 minutes ago, Cyclone said:

I think that's his point.  She would be okay offering religious support, but if that's rejected then she's not okay to keep pushing it.  She clearly went well beyond what is acceptable and more than once.

Nobody apart from Mac seems to think that it was wrong to sack her.

Correct. She went way too far and 'forced' her views on people.

I don't know the details, but was it gross misconduct and an immediate sacking, or a culmination of unheeded warnings? The latter would seem more appropriate than the first imo

[Waldo 96]

@Cyclone

 

Resign is maybe a bit OTT. I would think it unreasonable and unfair for smokers to expect time off that other people don't get. If everyone gets the same perks, it's not a problem.

 

Regarding my assumption; yes, I think I am assuming the people who are taking time out to pray are, on average, getting more time off than those not praying. Do we have any evidence (spreadsheet time sheets etc) to indicate otherwise?

 

Just treat all people the same, what's wrong with that? If people want to take time out to  pray, contemplate or fantasise, then why not afford that opportunity to all staff?

Edited May 24, 2019 by Waldo