British steel facing administration

[Michael_W 11]

Every manufacturer is looking at costs, if they can get cheap steel or cheap labour, that is what they do, providing it conforms to a certain spec, it's no different to how people generally often shop for food or clothes, we look for bargains, as a society we reap what we sow, so if you want to buy cheap you get cheap, and with it comes the consequences. I have worked in steel and engineering for over 40 years and it is run as badly now as it ever was, nothings going to change, our remaining niche manufacturing markets are still governed by cost, quantity over quality is still a factor and UK companies are more likely to set on highly paid graduates to trim production costs than to improve product.

[melthebell 863]

6 minutes ago, Michael_W said:

Every manufacturer is looking at costs, if they can get cheap steel or cheap labour, that is what they do, providing it conforms to a certain spec, it's no different to how people generally often shop for food or clothes, we look for bargains, as a society we reap what we sow, so if you want to buy cheap you get cheap, and with it comes the consequences. I have worked in steel and engineering for over 40 years and it is run as badly now as it ever was, nothings going to change, our remaining niche manufacturing markets are still governed by cost, quantity over quality is still a factor and UK companies are more likely to set on highly paid graduates to trim production costs than to improve product.

you all seem to be missing the point Oo

 

these costs couldve been avoided, completely avoidable. WE have pushed down the pound, WE have pushed up costs because of this brexit farce, when companies are feeling the harshness of the businessness environment it doesnt take much to push them over the edge, thats what brexit has done

[tinfoilhat 11]

18 minutes ago, melthebell said:

you all seem to be missing the point Oo

 

these costs couldve been avoided, completely avoidable. WE have pushed down the pound, WE have pushed up costs because of this brexit farce, when companies are feeling the harshness of the businessness environment it doesnt take much to push them over the edge, thats what brexit has done

Well sort of. Traditional heavy industries have been stood on a cliff edge in this country (and alot of western europe) since the 80s. Yes, brexit kicked it over the edge but, as other posters have said, lack of investment and other countries doing it cheaper hasn't helped either.

[Michael_W 11]

28 minutes ago, melthebell said:

you all seem to be missing the point Oo

 

these costs couldve been avoided, completely avoidable. WE have pushed down the pound, WE have pushed up costs because of this brexit farce, when companies are feeling the harshness of the businessness environment it doesnt take much to push them over the edge, thats what brexit has done

Your economical insight is wasted mel, lol

[melthebell 863]

43 minutes ago, tinfoilhat said:

Well sort of. Traditional heavy industries have been stood on a cliff edge in this country (and alot of western europe) since the 80s. Yes, brexit kicked it over the edge but, as other posters have said, lack of investment and other countries doing it cheaper hasn't helped either.

yup totally agree, most of it hasnt helped, but the brexit effect was completely avoidable, they mightve gone on for days, weeks, years, but we deliberately stuck a finger out and pushed.

And for those that said we'd thrive after brexit...tell that to the 5000 workers and 20.000 supply chain workers now **** scared (some prolly voted for it)

 

Completely avoidable. Adding yet more hardship in the way is not helping its making things worse

35 minutes ago, Michael_W said:

Your economical insight is wasted mel, lol

and i see you dont have a proper reply

Edited May 23, 2019 by melthebell

[Voice of reason 0]

2 hours ago, melthebell said:

you all seem to be missing the point Oo

 

these costs couldve been avoided, completely avoidable. WE have pushed down the pound, WE have pushed up costs because of this brexit farce, when companies are feeling the harshness of the businessness environment it doesnt take much to push them over the edge, thats what brexit has done

You need to brush up on your maths. The pound falling has made imports more expensive, and exporting our goods cheaper. Those factors would have been of net benefit to British Steel.

16 hours ago, apelike said:

 But its not just Chinese steel that is shafting us but also EU steel produced in the EU. Surprising as it may seem I actually agree with Ez8004 in that it should be left to its own demises.

It's a major factor. We and the EU have rightly imposed strict environmental and health and safety regulations. These add to the cost of the product.

If China produce theirs by avoiding these costs and screwing up the environment in the process, and subsequently send EU based companies bust, do you think that is a good , level, sensible playing field?

[Baron99 798]

The i newspaper has published a league table of the top 25 world's steel producers from 2018 today. 

 

Top are the Chinese who produced 928.3 million tonnes. The UK is placed at position 22 with 7.7 million tonnes, just ahead of that mighty steel producing nation, Austria on 6.9 million tonnes but behind Egypt on 7.8 million tonnes.  For comparison, Poland 19th, (10.2); France 15th, (15.4); Italy 11th, (24.5) & Germany 7th, (42.4).  So there you have it, our place in the world.  Or another way to look at it is that by amount, the UK probably manages to sell more of its steel by percentage as we don't produce as much as the others. 

 

Have also had a look at what is supposedly the salary of your average Chinese steel worker.  Latest info I could find is from 2017 when the hourly rate was the equivalent of $3.60 or £2.85 at today's rate. 

 

How can you compete with that? 

Edited May 23, 2019 by Baron99

[altus 540]

1 hour ago, Voice of reason said:

You need to brush up on your maths. The pound falling has made imports more expensive, and exporting our goods cheaper. Those factors would have been of net benefit to British Steel.

You're neglecting the effect of the falling pound on raw material costs - we don't mine iron ore any more for instance.

[Magilla 510]

57 minutes ago, Voice of reason said:

You need to brush up on your maths. The pound falling has made imports more expensive, and exporting our goods cheaper. Those factors would have been of net benefit to British Steel.

Your product doesn't get cheaper if the raw materials used to make it are also imported

 

 

 

[Voice of reason 0]

46 minutes ago, Magilla said:

Your product doesn't get cheaper if the raw materials used to make it are also imported

 

 

 

Can you quantify that please. What proportion of the cost of British Steel finished goods is attributable to raw material? presumably you know, and have the facts to hand to justify your claim.

I'm sure you know there's lots more to it than some coke and iron ore?? 

[Voice of reason 0]

1 hour ago, Baron99 said:

 

Have also had a look at what is supposedly the salary of your average Chinese steel worker.  Latest info I could find is from 2017 when the hourly rate was the equivalent of $3.60 or £2.85 at today's rate. 

 

How can you compete with that? 

This is a major element in all of it. Low wages, low regulation = lower prices. We accept their goods, made with low safety, high pollution and accept it.

It is also something for everyone to watch out for. People may well accept the steelworkers going to the wall, but there are also low paid engineers, graphic designers etc etc etc in China, all willing and able to undercut workers here. The same problem will soon start happening to people who don't have old fashioned smelly jobs.

[Magilla 510]

1 hour ago, Voice of reason said:

Can you quantify that please. What proportion of the cost of British Steel finished goods is attributable to raw material? presumably you know, and have the facts to hand to justify your claim.

I didn't claim the falling pound was a net benefit to British Steel, you did.., complete with some snide quip about maths.

 

Clearly, you already have the "facts" or your pathetic quip would just make you look like a total tool?

 

How about you prove your claim, since you made it first?